[R-390] Compressor stall (nee Cosmos Dis-assembly)

Sat Apr 17 21:14:33 EDT 2010

Jim,

Thank you for your enlightened viewpoint. Sorry, but you are just wrong 
across the board. Heh heh, I think we got us a former PATCO member.

I thought about the lazy union crybabies like that because I was a pilot 
back then. It was a firsthand sort of thing. I was brought up around 
that stuff, so I have a background.

Yes, it is amazing there are so many of us still around, isn't it?  Get 
over it. I just briefly mentioned a few things like they really happened 
and this history, wars, and politics stuff gets drug out.

Hit piece? Okay. Whatever.

Barry

p.s. I'll get off topic any time I wish. You'll learn how it works one 
day, grasshopper.

> Barry, jack of all trades. You seem like an emotional sort of guy. You think
> and judge, clearly, from emotion and not from facts. You expressed no facts.
> You have no idea what the issues were surrounding the PATCO labor dispute,
> and what was at stake during that time in history. It sounds like you just
> think it was, simply, a them against us thing, and they got theirs. Amazing
> how people like Barry are still fighting political wars from decades ago. 
>
> Now that Barry got his political hit piece in, and I responded, we need to
> get back to R-390's.
>
> Jim
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: r-390-bounces at mailman.qth.net [mailto:r-390-bounces at mailman.qth.net]
> On Behalf Of Barry Williams
> Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 11:14 AM
> To: R390 reflector
> Subject: Re: [R-390] Compressor stall (nee Cosmos Dis-assembly)
>
> I've not heard of a turbine that doesn't have an engine restart 
> procedure. Even the lowly helicopters I flew had them. It may take 
> several thousand feet to get it restarted, but they are meant to 
> restart. Having some sort of failure or damage changes things somewhat. 
> We practiced those over and over in the simulators.
>
> I had small compressor stalls only once. I was flying nights with 
> goggles with students in Alabama. We were flying around 400' over the 
> trees. I was a brand new night instructor and still a little nervous. I 
> went for the first field I saw when I realized it was stalling over and 
> over. As soon as I got close to the ground and saw the big transmission 
> lines, I did exactly what you aren't supposed to do. I pulled in full 
> power to get out of there before hitting the wires. That turbine ran 
> like a champ until I set down about a mile away.
>
> The plane over the Hudson didn't have near the altitude needed for a 
> restart attempt.
>
> Declining ATC suggestions? I've turned down directions more than a few 
> times. Sometimes, they are just lollygagging around the air conditioned 
> tower, and are clueless. The best thing that ever happened was when 
> Reagan fired the striking controllers in PATCO. The radio traffic 
> instantly became friendlier and more helpful. The bad ones were gone and 
> it was fun to talk to ATC once more.
>
> It also depends on what controller level you talk to. Centers like 
> Atlanta are the best and rarely mess up. You know you are in good hands 
> with those guys.
>
>
> Barry
>
>
>   
>> Beat me to it...
>>
>> A simple stall is one thing a FOD'd engine is another story.  But a
>>     
> restart 
>   
>> might get you enough power to get you back to the field...it you don't
>>     
> have 
>   
>> an engine fire in the process....
>>
>> Cecil...
>>
>>
>> Andy,
>>
>> They "can" be restarted in flight.  The difficulty is that you CANNOT
>> tell if it was a "simple" compressor stall OR did you just ingest as bird.
>>
>> After the "Miracle on the Hudson", mental priorities and possibilities
>> have changed.  The awareness is different.
>>
>> It is up to the Pilot in Command, PIC, what flows and what goes.
>>
>> He can tell ATC, a ground controller, and approach control to "stick it"
>> IF he feels safety isn't being adequately addressed, or other issues.
>>
>> I ran into this my self twice when I flew as PIC.  Once I simply told
>> the Tower to wait - My hands were full due to clear air turbulence that
>> drifted over MY runway from a flight that took off over 5 mins earlier.
>> The "heavy" had left its wake, and the crosswinds had blown it over to
>> my runway.  The Tower had NO way of knowing what I was fighting.  Then
>> again, they weren't paying attention to the position of the ailerons and
>> rudder.
>>
>> The second one was when they told me to turn downwind into traffic they
>> had cleared another aircraft inbound.
>>
>> It just happens!
>>
>> Bob - N0DGN
>>
>> On 4/16/2010 4:05 PM, James A. (Andy) Moorer wrote:
>>   
>>     
>>> It happened to me and my son a few years ago. It sure got our attention. 
>>> It
>>> is a sight you really don't ever want to see. Since it was during the
>>> full-power ascent shortly after takeoff, the pilot just turned around and
>>> took it back in.
>>>
>>> Does anybody know if the engine can be restarted after a stall? It seems
>>> like it would be pretty messed up at that point.
>>>
>>> If the pilot was an engine short for the landing, I sure didn't notice
>>>       
> it.
>   
>>> Modern airplanes must be pretty remarkable machines.
>>>
>>> James A. (Andy) Moorer
>>> www.jamminpower.com
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>
>>>     
>>>       
>>>> Compressor stalls happen in real life, too. I've never been on an 
>>>> aircraft
>>>> when one took place, but I know some folks who have, and they say they
>>>> were
>>>> *AWAKE* for the rest of the flight.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>       
>>>>         
>
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