[Milsurplus] OT: Re: USS Stewart vandalized

Sun Feb 3 16:33:38 EST 2013

Unfortunately, with Iran it seems we're going to find out sooner rather than later.

Peter

On 2/3/2013 3:31 PM, J. Forster wrote:
> Well, there's the rub as Shakespear said.
>
> I am unconvinced, as is Iran apparently, that the US would take any
> meaningful action, other than moving the goal posts, if a red line were
> crossed.
>
> YMMV a lot,
>
> -John
>
> =================
>
>
>> Some of these countries, like Iran and China, that think they can tweak
>> Uncle Sam's nose, had best think carefully before they decide to do
>> something terrible, like send over a nuke or crash our power grid through
>> a computer virus.
>>
>> There are still 50 Peacekeeper Missiles, each with 10 RV's that can be
>> back on line easily. That's 500 750 KT warheads. If Nuclear Warheads
>> are not your cup of tea, they can easily be replaced with conventional
>> warheads.
>>
>> Of course, that assumes we have a Government with the stones to use
>> them.
>>
>> 73, Dick, W1KSZ
>>
>> On Sun, Feb 3, 2013 at 12:51 PM, J. Forster <jfor at quikus.com> wrote:
>>>> There is scant evidence that what you say is true.  Speak to historians
>>>> and they
>>>> will tell you that many things are actually better now than they were
>>>> in
>>>> the past.
>>> History is written by the victors, which really means it is biased to
>>> those currently in power. I don't trust historians to separate their
>>> political biases from their work. There are accepted things about WW II
>>> history that are just not true.
>>>
>>>> You say that these kids do not know the difference between good and
>>>> bad?
>>>> But what about the numerous stories of group members who did something
>>>> bad and were
>>>> punished in an appropriate way and learned? Maybe these kids didn't do
>>>> something
>>>> like that before, maybe alcohol was involved (like the drunken
>>>> sailors).
>>>> I wouldn't be so quick to condemn society with such little evidence.
>>> Damaging drywall in one's own house is petty compared to trashing other
>>> people's.
>>>
>>> There is certainly as much booze, far more drugs, and a lot more
>>> trashing
>>> of places than even 20 years ago. This is partly as a result of larger,
>>> and hence more destructive, 'flash mobs', due to social media.
>>>
>>>> I'm not excusing what they did but rather just saying that there is
>>>> little that can be
>>>> concluded about the greater state of affairs from this one incident.
>>> Perhaps so, but the frequency of such incidents is growing due to
>>> copycats.
>>>
>>>> Social unrest?  What, right now?  What about the protests of the 60's?
>>>> The
>>>> Vietnam war protests, the civil rights marches?  I don't see anything
>>>> now
>>>> that
>>>> matches those times!  The US will not go out like Rome, it will be
>>>> around
>>>> (and strong) for a very long time.
>>> And if Iran puts an atomic weapon in a cargo container and ships it into
>>> NYC?
>>>
>>>> Very few say that military force is in general bad.  A massive majority
>>>> recognize the need for a competent, professional, strong military.  But
>>>> you will
>>>> see legitimate debate about how that military should be used, how much
>>>> should be
>>>> spent on it, and how to deal with the massive inefficiencies in
>>>> spending
>>>> that
>>>> are occurring.   And what's this about "having a gun is bad?"  Or is
>>>> the
>>>> very
>>>> topic taboo to even bring up?  Every freedom has limits and
>>>> responsibilities!
>>>> Just like having a car.
>>>>
>>>> That ship is a museum, and yes, a lot of people really do care. Like
>>>> other
>>>> museums, it may need a decent alarm system though.
>>> Probably so.
>>>
>>>> You want to talk about preservation?  It is the military itself which
>>>> is
>>>> now
>>>> destroying almost all electronics gear rather than allowing it to go
>>>> out
>>>> on the
>>>> surplus market.  Look at MARS even... used to be that interesting gear
>>>> was
>>>> just
>>>> given out for experimentation and modification, attracting a lot of
>>>> bright
>>>> minds. Now, despite those regulations still saying stuff is given out,
>>>> nothing
>>>> really is anymore.  They won't even give out small gensets to allow
>>>> stations to
>>>> operate during power outages!  I've tried going to my representatives
>>>> and
>>>> they
>>>> all listen and are sympathetic but it will take more than a lone voice
>>>> here and
>>>> there to make anything happen.
>>> WW II Mil gear could easily be re-purposed to other uses, partly because
>>> is was far less complex and specialized than today, and partly because
>>> it
>>> used construction techniques that were readily accessible. Not any more,
>>> because so much is in silicon or SW. There is also far less being
>>> produced.
>>>
>>> Compare the quantities of modern radios built to WW II quantities...  1
>>> to
>>> 100 maybe?
>>>
>>> As to the punks, I think they should be sentenced to clean up and
>>> restore
>>> everything they damaged, with sentence to run until that cleanup is
>>> finished. No parole.
>>>
>>> YMMV,
>>>
>>> -John
>>> ================
>>>
>>>> To use your words, "does anyone give a damn" anymore?
>>>>
>>>> Peter
>>>
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