[TheForge] OT: My floor is poured: the saga OT:

Peter Fels & Phoebe Palmer artgawk at thegrid.net
Thu Oct 23 22:43:41 EDT 2014 

That's something i should have done a long time ago. Dragging an air hose tail around my crowded shop isn't at all appealing though.

On Oct 23, 2014, at 7:34 PM, Bruce . wrote:

Another alternative is a supplied air system.  Put fishbowl over head.  Run
air hose into fishbowl, maintaining positive pressure therein.  You get the
picture.

Bruce
NJ

On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 6:30 PM, Peter Fels & Phoebe Palmer <
artgawk at thegrid.net> wrote:

> Bruce, years ago i realized being hairy and conventional respiratory
> protection were in conflict.
> After a bunch of preliminary steps, i ended up with a snorkel mouthpiece
> plugged directly into a respiratory filter socket.
> Exhale through nose.
> Gotta change filters 2 X as often.
> 
> On Oct 23, 2014, at 3:24 PM, Bruce . wrote:
> 
> Acute exposure to ANY dust is dangerous, especially in large quantity.
> Glass dust would be especially so because it is sharp.  Wear a good dust
> mask if working with such stuff.  (Being bearded, I tend to use a moist
> bandana over my nose and mouth instead of a dust mask because dust masks
> won't seal against a beard.)
> But unlike pure silica, glass will eventually dissolve in the body, so if
> it doesn't kill you soon after exposure, the problem might eventually go
> away.  Don't count on it though.
> 
> Bruce
> NJ
> 
> On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 6:12 PM, Peter Fels & Phoebe Palmer <
> artgawk at thegrid.net> wrote:
> 
>> Sounds like silicosis by the ton...That was 3 cents a TON, i think Jerry.
>> 
>> In this connection, refineries sometimes sell sulfur really cheap too..
>> It's strong, 5X stronger than cement,  especially with some styrene and
>> fiber mixed in,  easy to melt in a 55 gal barrel with a bonfire, and pour
>> at around 250F.
>> It's water proof and very acid resistant. Like the styro, make sure it's
>> never subject to flames...(IE, below grade).
>> It doesn't burn particularly hot, but it's persistent and really , really
>> noxious!
>> 
>> 
>> On Oct 23, 2014, at 2:58 PM, jerry Frost wrote:
>> 
>> Oh yeah, ants LOVE foam, any kind, ants or foam. Crushed glass is good
>> stuff
>> and if they're selling it for $0.03/lb they can't afford to ship it to
> the
>> glass plant. If you can find powdered glass it makes excellent ant
> killer.
>> It gets in their joints and shreds them from the inside out and even
> their
>> little crunchy bodies are deadly to the next ones to come along. Just
> don't
>> breath it, it's only less dangerous to us.
>> 
>> Jer
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: TheForge [mailto:theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of
>> Bruce
>> .
>> Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2014 1:44 PM
>> To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA
>> Subject: Re: [TheForge] OT: My floor is poured: the saga OT:
>> 
>> And ants!  Ants will nest in styrofoam.  Voice of sad experience, here.
>> 
>> Bruce
>> NJ
>> 
>> On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 1:49 PM, Peter Fels & Phoebe Palmer <
>> artgawk at thegrid.net> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hope it works as well for you as it did for me...That backfill has a
>>> staggering R value!
>>> Don't neglect to cover it with something that'll keep fire and rodents
>> out.
>>> 
>>> On Oct 23, 2014, at 10:39 AM, Andrew Vida wrote:
>>> 
>>> The recycler had 3'x4'x6' bales of compressed plastic, but they were
>>> over 1000# each and I am in no humor to wrestle that.  The polystyrene
>>> blocks are extruded from the chipped raw material. Density varies
>> significantly.
>>> No matter.  I'm looking to provide a seepage channel and these should
>>> do the trick.
>>> 
>>> Oh, and I also have left at least 4 trails between Charleston and
>> Elkview.
>>> 
>>> On 10/17/14, 1:30 PM, Peter Fels & Phoebe Palmer wrote:
>>>> Andy, the styro i was getting was in the form of wired, compressed
>>> bales. They had a press that'd turn a giant dumpster full into a 3' X 4'
>>> bale, that i then stacked 3 high on my flatbed. Exhausted, i drove
>>> home in the dark having tied down the load. I feared that the cops
>>> would follow the debris trail for 60 miles and find me days later.
>>>> I used some of the bales whole where i was concerned about sliding,
>>>> then
>>> opened up the remaining bales to fill the rest of the space. Before i
>>> placed the styro, i did a multiply redundant series of waterproofing
>>> coats on the outside of the retaining wall ( parge coat, rubberized
>>> asphalt sheet and heavy plastic sheet.
>>>> I topped the styro backfill with a foot of leachrock for vermin and
>>> fireproofing.
>>>> The french drain at the bottom  sloped 1/2" to the foot and was
>>>> covered
>>> in 3 layers of drain fabric.
>>>> Unfortunately, the heavy plastic sheet under the french drain got
>>> perforated in the process and the seepage leaves me with a damp shop
>>> floor a few days after heavy rains despite  both sand and plastic
>>> sheet under the slab.
>>>> Somehow, 3 tons of sloppy clay is much heavier than 3 tons of almost
>>> anything else. Groan.
>>>> 
>>>> On Oct 17, 2014, at 5:18 AM, Andrew Vida wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Well, it turned out the recycler indeed has blocks of styrofoam and
>>>> I
>>> have been stacking them to the grade line.  Typar at the outer face,
>>> then back fill.  They loaded two large boxes full... probably about 800#
>> each.
>>> I will be leaving in a short while to get two more and that should do
>>> the do for us.  They are about 8" square by randome lengths, vary in
>>> density, but seem to be porous.
>>>> 
>>>> The day after the north and east walls were completed, the rain
>>>> caved in
>>> the clay at the northeast corner.  I'd estimate at least 3 tons of
>>> water-logged clay.  God bless my wife for her help.  We got it
>>> excavated yesterday in about 6 hours and did it literally by hand, as
>>> the shovels were utterly useless.  I was swearing to make a sailor
>>> join a convent.  Not sure why, but when the clay grabs me such that I
>>> cannot get my boot out, I go completely red.
>>>> 
>>>> Got the drain reset, gravel in, foam blocks on top and sealed the
>>>> walls
>>> with Hydrocide... pretty nasty stuff.  I'm still wearing it, three
>>> days and about 8 showers later.  Need more foam block, and then backfill
>> partially.
>>>> 
>>>> Mason told me to use non-shrinking grout between the bottom of old
>>> footing and top of new block walls.  That is going to be a lot of
>> grout...
>>> :(  At that volume I would have gone broke on hydraulic cement.  That
>>> damned stuff is $$.  I've never used concrete grout before.  I sure
>>> hope it has the compressive strength to take the load.
>>>> 
>>>> I think I am going to fill the spaces where the steel columns are
>>> encased by the blocks with portland.  The walls of the block are
>>> shaved a mite thin in one or two places.
>>>> 
>>>> I will have Bibi take pictures today and post them so you all can
>>>> bear
>>> witness to the truer depths of my insanity.
>>>> 
>>>> The next step: concrete company comes to pour 6" cap on the old-new
>>> floor.  That will give me a 12" floor, less head room (down to about
>>> 9'4"), but I'm OK with it.  The second pour will act as a lock for
>>> moisure and a kicker for the bottomost blocks against the inward
>>> pressure of the surrounding earth.
>>>> 
>>>> Much yet to do, but at least the new foundation is in.  I cannot
>>>> tell
>>> you what a relief that has been.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On 9/16/14, 6:57 PM, Peter Fels & Phoebe Palmer wrote:
>>>>> I'm certain you do Andy! Um...Just one?
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Sep 16, 2014, at 2:50 PM, Andrew Vida wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 9/16/14, 5:18 PM, Peter Fels & Phoebe Palmer wrote:
>>>>>> Some years back i discovered free bales of styrofoam from the
>>> recycling plant.
>>>>>> They were so eager to get rid of them they loaded them for me
>>>>>> after
>>> hours..
>>>>>> Covered my 12' flatbed with them stacked 9' high.
>>>>>> They made great backfill behind the big  retaining wall and have
>>>>>> been
>>> stable for the last 15 years or more.
>>>>>> Water resistant , insulating, easy to place and free. I covered
>>>>>> them
>>> with leachrock about a foot deep for fire and vermin.
>>>>>> If you need more volume, break up the bales on a calm day.
>>>>>> French drain below.
>>>>> Now this is a really cool idea.  I was having a small fit trying to
>>> figure how I was to get all that gravel situated properly.  Was
>>> thinking of using gambions, but they are stupidly pricey and you have
>>> to build them yourself... and they are endlessly heavy, even the small
>>> ones.  But this I could do.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks Peter - I will check this out.  I'm sure I now owe you a beer.
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