[TheForge] Needed: Theory of Cold Fusion (was: Slack tank...POL OT)

Wed Dec 22 14:26:40 EST 2010

The initial announcement by Fleischmann and Pons inspired a lot of
attempts to copy the work.  I've heard of no successes.  Initially, I
was hopeful, but now I am not.

It is true that success could be thwarted by very small things -- take
Wootz steel for example, where (IIRC) a vanadium contamination in the
ore was essential for producing the material.

However, what would get "cold fusion" on a firm footing would be a
theoretical basis.  I have not looked into it recently, but I am aware
of no theoretical basis to suppose  two atomic nuclei could be brought
into sufficiently close proximity to fuse, absent intense heat (as in
a hydrogen bomb).  Anyone who really wants to contribute to this field
would do well to provide a theoretical rational to explain its
feasibility.

This is way out of my field, but basically this would take an analysis
of the atomic and nuclear forces involved in the diffusion of hydrogen
into the metal substrate (palladium, is it?) and the hypothetical
close-approach of the nuclei.  My knowledge of chemistry tells me that
there would have to involve an enormous dislocation of the energy
associated with bringing the two nuclei together.

A possible analogy to this (which will be understood only by those who
have studied chemistry)  is the behavior of the electrons in aromatic
compounds -- rather than being localized in dimolecular orbitals, they
are distributed around the entire "aromatic" ring structure.  The
effect of this is to substantially lower the internal energy of the
system:  e.g., benzene yields much less energy on combustion than
would be expected from a calculation of a hypothetical
1,3,5-cyclohexatriene.

In the case of cold fusion, one could imagine an environment, such as
a palladium crystal, in which the electrons are stripped from the
hydrogen nuclei (very likely true) and the nuclei pass through the
crystal relatively unimpeded (also very likely true, though this may
require some heating of the palladium -- I'm not sure).  One more
element is necessary -- bringing two hydrogen nuclei, that normally
repel each other, close enough together to fuse.  This would certainly
involve distribution of the two positive charges in some manner around
the palladium crystal.  In principal, this could amount to a
considerable redistribution of negative charges in the molecule to
stabilize the presence of the (positively charged) nuclei -- rather
like a capacitor on an atomic scale.  If each nucleus were effectively
of neutral charge, at least beyond a small number of nuclear radii,
then maybe the two hydrogen nuclei could be induced to approach each
other by some means.  So, come up with a way to do that, and you may
develop a theory of cold fusion.

I wouldn't be surprised if the extra, missing detail would be a
contaminating substance in the palladium crystal.  I'm thinking along
the lines of the effect of "poisoning" a silicon  crystal with arsenic
to produce a semiconductor.  Perhaps an anisometry of the palladium
crystal might, under certain conditions, make some sort of micro
accelerator for one or both hydrogen nuclei, propelling them together
(kinetic energy overcoming electrostatic repulsion).

Put your thinking caps on and get to work.  (Now there's a product to
make us rich -- hand forged thinking caps, custom fit to your noggin.)

On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 1:36 PM, Andrew Vida <osan at netlabs.net> wrote:
>
>
> James Binnion wrote:
>> On Dec 22, 2010, at 6:03 AM, Andrew Vida wrote:
>>> You may be right, who knows... depends on whom you believe.  There
>>> are claims that about 100 independent trials have produced
>>> "interesting" results.  I am not doing it so I cannot say.
>>
>> I dont know either Andy but given the simplicity of the experimental
>> setup the crux of the problem seems to be in measuring any kind of
>> fusion byproducts. If there is indeed anything going on it is finicky
>> beyond belief as it seems to be unmeasureable by anyone in a
>> repeatable fashion. So Occam's Razor would suggest there is nothing
>> there. I doubt there is any deep dark conspiracy on this, the lure of
>> cheap power will always draw the gullible to pay some researcher or
>> another who claims to found the secret of cold fusion but somehow
>> there are never repeatable positive results.
>
> As we have both said, who knows?  But they claim statistically
> significant increases in tritium, that from a woman whose career is said
> to have been devoted to tritium detection, using industry accepted
> detectors.  Either it is happening or they are lying.  Ineptitude is a
> possibility, but very remote IMO, again assuming the bios are not faked
> or exaggerated.
>
> The inconsistent results may be due to some subtlety in conditions that
> is as yet unidentified.  ONce again, assuming the players are on the up,
>  it would seem to me to be worth pursuing in case such a subtlety
> exists and can be understood such that consistent results are possible.
>  THe potential value is this is way too big to give up on, just  yet.
> AFAIK paltry sums have been invested to date when compared with other
> endeavors.  Keep at it and remain hopefully sceptical.
>
> Methinks I will investigate this Lattice group.  Now I am curious as to
> what they are about.
>
> Speaking of energy sources, does anyone here use induction coils?  For
> some apps they appear ideal.  I am wondering if they can be arranged
> such that there is open space along the coil wall to accommodate odd
> shapes.  Anyone?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> James Binnion jbin at well.com
>>
>>
>>
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-- 
Bruce
NJ