[TheForge] Abana conference
Peter Fels And Phoebe Palmer
artgawk at thegrid.net
Mon Mar 5 02:35:11 EST 2007
In my abana video dream, the camera zooms in on each jig and does
a 360* around it. A fellow BSer would do the shooting and
editing. Give'em a free conf and 20 virgins to do it....pf
Chuck Robinson wrote:
> Hey Steve,
>
> If you re-read my e-mail, you will see in paragraph 5, that I did
> address the high cost issue for membership in ABANA.
>
> Demonstrators at conferences are not professional actors reading from a
> script.
> They tend to wander around, while looking for tools or responding to
> questions from the audience.
> When I attend a conference like the Batson Blade Smithing Symposium. I
> have found it is much more effective to place my video camera on a stand
> and record the whole demonstration, rather than try to take notes and
> watch the demo at the same time.
> It doesn't bother me if he/she wanders out of camera range as long as I
> can hear what the demonstrator is still talking about.
> The major cost in time and effort in producing videos is the editing. I
> think the editing should be kept to the absolute minimum. An example of
> what I'm talking about is Rodger's tape number 102 of Ralph Sproul's
> demonstration. For the first 20 minutes of his demo Ralph wanders
> around pulling out jigs and talking about tooling that he's developed.
> Ideas that are worth their weight in gold, but could easily have been
> edited out.
> Chuck
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Smith" <sos at alum.mit.edu>
> To: "Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2007 7:24 AM
> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Abana conference
>
>
>> Chuck, I don't see the equipment being the issue. You have to have
>> people who are willing to run the equipment and people to edit the
>> tape into something useful. To make a good video of a demo, I think
>> you need two cameras and tripods, two people on those cameras, an
>> extra person capable of setting up the sound and running errands. If
>> instead you duct tape a camera to a spare anvil, what you'll end up
>> with is a video that nobody watches. Just my opinion. For an example
>> of the best conference videos I've ever seen, get one from Rocky
>> Mountain Smiths. The budget won't break (much), but finding the
>> volunteers is tough.
>>
>> Roger's videos are decent, I have a stack of them. For all I know, he
>> just duct tapes his camera down, contrary to what I say above. He
>> clearly knows what he's doing, however, and is only working on one
>> demonstrator with one angle of view.
>>
>> I agree that conferences are too expensive for most people. Good
>> videos would help spread the word.
>>
>> I don't mean to be picking your comments apart, Chuck, but I've got
>> one more thing to point out. You say: "They tell me that ABANA has no
>> relevance for them as far as blacksmithing is concerned." I notice
>> this doesn't say anything about too expensive, rather that the
>> offering isn't of interest.
>>
>> Something's out of whack, but I'm not sure what it is. I think the AR
>> and HB are great publications, with AR admittedly getting a bit weird
>> and off center at times. I'd love to see ABANA continue to put on
>> conferences in some altered form to make them more useful/accessible
>> to the membership.
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> Chuck Robinson wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Ries,
>>>
>>> My suggestion for video recording the regional conferences should be
>>> possible without breaking the ABANA Budget.
>>> I believe that several years after recording as many conferences as
>>> possible, they would be a revenue you making activity for ABANA.
>>>
>>> The basic problem that I see is that the present way of holding large
>>> expensive conferences isn't working anymore. The fact that only
>>> about 10% of our ABANA membership are willing or able to attend means
>>> that 90% of our membership don't support or receive any benefit from
>>> the conferences.
>>>
>>> I am the ABANA affiliate liaison on the Gulf coast blacksmith's
>>> Association. The GCBA has 125 members, of which including myself,
>>> only three are members of ABANA. One of these ABANA members does not
>>> plan to renew his membership.
>>>
>>> When I question my members as to why they don't want to be ABANA
>>> members. They tell me that ABANA has no relevance for them as far as
>>> blacksmithing is concerned.
>>>
>>> ABANA membership is too expensive for the benefits they receive from
>>> it. Most of The articles in the Anvils Ring show projects that are
>>> well beyond their capabilities to make.
>>>
>>> I first joined ABANA in 1973. The earlier newsletters weren't
>>> nearly as polished as the current ones are, but they presented a lot
>>> of useful information and tips that the average blacksmith would be
>>> interested in.
>>>
>>> The conferences are generally, too far away and way too expensive for
>>> them to attend. So they basically get zero benefit from the ABANA
>>> conferences.
>>> Our library however, has most of Roger's Conference Videos, and they
>>> are very popular with our members.
>>> Chuck
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "ries" <ries at riesniemi.com>
>>> To: "Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
>>> Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2007 11:00 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Abana conference
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Mar 1, 2007, at 8:52 AM, Chuck Robinson wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I would like to make any alternate proposal to having a 2008 ABANA
>>>> conference.
>>>>
>>>> Since the last few ABANA conferences have been extremely expensive,
>>>> and under attended by the it's members, I would suggest ABANA use
>>>> some of the funds it intended to use for the next conference, to
>>>> instead purchase high-quality video making equipment.
>>>> It would be used to make DVDs of the regional conferences put on by
>>>> affiliate groups throughout the country. It might also be possible
>>>> to send several people to international blacksmith and conferences
>>>> to record them .
>>>> I have been extremely impressed with the wonderful job that Roger
>>>> Degner of the Upper Midwest Blacksmith's Association has done in
>>>> recording the conferences that he has attended and produced DVDs of,
>>>> that have valuable instructional material in them. They are
>>>> available to individuals for a very nominal cost.
>>>> Granted the videos aren't the same as being there, but they are
>>>> orders of magnitude better than missing the Demos, when you can't
>>>> attend in person.
>>>> I would strongly suggest that ABANA contact Rodger for advice on
>>>> how he does it.
>>>> Chuck
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Chuck- the whole problem is they dont have the seed money- the
>>>> general idea of how it usually works is that the conference makes a
>>>> slight profit- say 50 grand or so- then that gets used for
>>>> deposits, startup costs, and so on for the next one.
>>>> The conference itself is supposed to be self supporting- the fees
>>>> coming in pay for the expenses going out.
>>>> But this time, Seattle didnt make any money- in fact, it probably
>>>> lost money.
>>>> So there is no pot of money to buy video equipment.
>>>> Roger does indeed work closely with Abana, and he does great things.
>>>> Long term, it would be great if Abana helped Roger more, and Roger
>>>> made more Abana videos available- in addition to the ones from abana
>>>> conferences he already has.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Ries Niemi
>>>> Industrial Artist
>>>> http://www.riesniemi.com/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>
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>> ___________
>>
>> .
>
> _______________________________________________
> Manage membership or unsubscribe at:
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> theforge mail list group photo site is
> http://www.photoaccess.com
> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> password: anvil
> ___________
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