[ScanIndiana] ADMIN: BS laws

Sat Jan 22 21:13:25 EST 2005

In response to a good post from ADMIN, I want to throw
in a couple more cents worth in the spirit of uniting
rather than dividing.

I was active on the internet newsgroups many years ago
before the PC was quite so common and before so many 
people had email at home - most only had access in the
workplace, and consequently many hobbies didn't have 
the ability to bring participants together that we have
today.

At the time when ECPA was being shopped around Washington
and the Indiana Scanner Law already existed, I pointed out
in a number of newsgroups that the American Radio Relay
League refused to get involved in "non-ham" issues.  I
further pointed out that this was short-sighted and unfortunate,
because while what I called then (and still do) "the broader 
radio hobby" had well divided segments (scanning, SWL, Amateur,
CB, etc) we ALL share a number of common issues and bonds
whether some of us like it or not.  :-)

I said, and was roundly proclaimed blasphemous from ALL sides 
for doing so, that in the face of legislation that would 
assault one part of "the broader radio hobby" or another we
would all be better off UNITING rather than sniping at each
other.  It was my belief then, and I believe that about a
decade worth of time has proved me correct (but that's NOT a
gloat), that we would be stronger with mutual support than we
ever would thumbing our noses at each other.

This recent discussion brings out some sore spots that just
don't need to be there and are nothing more than either snobbery
or simple misunderstandings.  For example, Amateur X suggests
that because the Indiana Scanner Law includes an exemption
for licensed Amateurs that scanner enthusiasts who are complaining
about the law simply get a ham license and not have to worry
about it anymore.  Amateur X then gets stomped for having had
the arrogance to suggest that the "superior amateurs" can get
away with something that the scannists can't.

In the meantime, many CBers and hams can't say a civil word about
each other....and the SWL's just wish EVERYONE would shut up so
that they can *listen*.  :-)

Now since I can hear people thinking "get to the point", it is
simply this.  With legislation about what you can listen to,
zoning laws and covenants that restrict antennas, and god knows
what else on the horizon, I will once again dare to suggest that
all of us in "the broader radio hobby" should put aside 
these idiotic quibbles of decades past and unite in support of
each other.  We Amateurs need to respect the others and quit
acting like we are gods of radio.  Scannists might well think
less critically of an amateur who suggests that a ham license
wouldn't hurt them any.  Hams and CBers need to quit sniping
at each other and recognize that we ALL have our niche in 
"the broader radio hobby".  SWLs can speak up instead of just
listening and support the whole lot.

The net result?  Instead of several groups of radio hobbyists
who won't lend their support for each other, a uniting and a
fair meeting of the minds would result in one large group in
the millions.  Millions of taxpayers, that is, who engage in
"the broader radio hobby" in a fair and ethical manner and who
do NOT deserve the crappy image or treatment that they have been
getting.  Millions of taxpayers acting in a spirit of solidarity
with each other are a LOT harder for congresscritters and state
assemblymen to ignore.

Hoosier hobbyists, are you up for this?  Are you willing to accept
and spread this idea and challenge to all the other related
email lists and forums that you participate in?  I've been trying
this for better than 10 years, I can't do it alone.

What would I like to see, ideally?  A true National Association
of radio hobbyists for all *law abiding* participants - a forum
for those participants to come together and a means for all of
us to come together and lobby for laws and rules that make SENSE.
And that means to ME laws that do NOT make criminals out of 
people simply because they listen to a radio.  It also means that
we hobbyists must act responsibly - and must decry and denounce
those who refuse to do so.  IMHO, this is the ONLY way that 
any government officials will ever take it seriously and act
accordingly.

I ask for your indulgence in taking to the soapbox for this
and hope that ADMIN will not think badly of me for doing so.
I just do not wish to see so much potential go down the toilet
over petty squabbles.

Duane Mantick
WB9OMC, Amateur Extra Class
KET-8490, CB
WPWX735, GMRS
FRS user
scanner listener
SWL
"I do it all, I love it all"

-----Original Message-----
From: scanindiana-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:scanindiana-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Matthew C Payne
Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2005 12:41 PM
To: Indiana Scanning
Subject: [ScanIndiana] ADMIN: BS laws

OK folks.  Time out.  Take a breath.

This list has ONE rule.  And that is not to flame (insult, demean, badger,
hassle, yell at, intimidate, or provoke) any other members.  I really don't
think that this is too unreasonable of a restriction.  
There are times when I really think there should be more.  But in the end, I
believe that the more restrictive a list is, the less potential it has as a
source of information.  So I intend to do my best to keep to the path that
has made this list a success for all of these years.  But list members might
consider observing some "guidelines".

    - Unless it is directly related to scanning, folks might consider
leaving politics out of the discussion.  Now scanners and scanner
enthusiasts have been under attack over the years from different political
sources.  So if it's remotely relevant, by all means discuss it.  But try
not to bee too enraged when someone dares disagree with you.  Everyone
thinks differently, and you likely won't change anyone's mind.

    - It's fine to remind folks about the laws of this state.  But you
should be tactful.  If you can't accomplish this tactfully, it might be best
to not make comment.  I carried a scanner for years before getting my ham
radio license.  I'm sure not going to judge someone else for doing the same
thing.  If you want to carry a scanner in your car without a license, that's
groovy as far as I'm concerned.  If you want to listen to your neighbor's
cordless phone calls, that's your concern, not mine.  But like Susan Barker
posted earlier, "don't do the crime..if ya can't do the time".  Susan gets a
gold star.  That was a great post.  :-)

    - Don't play list moderator.  It isn't your job to police others on the
list.  Explain your opinions, sure.  Correct mistakes or educate others,
absolutely.  But playing "list cop" isn't impressive at all.  
Trust me.  As the list administrator, I routinely find myself unimpressive.

    - One exclamation point denotes outcry or emphasis.  Two denotes outrage
or absolute conviction.  Three denotes possible psychosis.  More than
thirty-nine in a row is just obnoxious.  Again, be nice folks.

Now let's get back to the list.  We had some nice discussion going on before
things went downhill.  I find myself impressed all the time at the high
quality of information that is passed on this list.  We all have one thing
in common, and that is our hobby.  Let's get back on track.

Thanks everyone,
Matt

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