[Heathkit] question from a non-Ham
Duane Fischer, W8DBF
dfischer at usol.com
Sun Jul 2 00:01:06 EDT 2006
Bob,
And what you so beautifully described was called "music". Musicians knew how
to play with each othere by natural instinct and engineers knew just how
much echo or reverb to add to make it sound just as live on the pressed
vinyl as it did standing there in person.
The talent may be more difficult to find today, but it is still out there.
However, getting a studio to take the time to do it right, well, we can hope
it happens again!
Now that is real MAGIC!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert & Linda McGraw K4TAX" <RMcGraw at Blomand.Net>
To: <heathkit at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2006 11:47 PM
Subject: Re: [Heathkit] question from a non-Ham
> Duane mentions RCA Studio B in Nashville. They were on 17th Ave So. That
> brings back memories as I spent 15 years across the block at CBS studios
> on 16th Ave So. Specifically, the Quonset hut built by Owen Bradley in
> Nashville. Some years after being recorded and after the fact, we pulled
> a 1/2" master 3 track 15 IPS analog tape out of the vault and was playing
> it. Several "current" musicians had gathered in the studio prior to an
> upcoming session. Comments like, "man how did you get such fantastic
> sound?" were heard around the room. I just smiled and went on about my
> work.
>
> Well the formula is quite simple, all the musicians were in the room
> playing at the same time, listening to each other without benefit of
> headphones, and it was recorded in true stereo, Left, Center, and Right,
> typical of 3 track fashion. Recording groups like Flatt and Scruggs
> required a total of 3 or maybe 4 microphones. One for the vocals, one for
> the instruments, and one for the upright bass and one for the "room". As
> each instrument took a lead, the player simply stepped into the mike and
> picked and then stepped back. Same for the vocals. The recording
> engineer would make only minor adjustments to levels and EQ settings. The
> "band" made the real adjustments acoustically. As to a drum kit, 3 mikes
> was the norm in those days.
>
> Well in later years, on one session I did have a good chuckle with one
> group, one producer, and one drummer. After it was over, I smiled all the
> way to the bank. But in the mean time, I finally got them happy with 18
> mikes on the drum kit alone, being top toms (3), bottom toms (3) , top
> snare (2), bottom snare (1), left kick (1), right kick(1), top hat (2),
> crash left (2), crash right (2) and finally 1 overhead. There were 4
> mikes on Edgar Winters Fender pre CBS tube type Twin Reverb guitar amp
> that was cranked to the max, and 3 mikes on brother Johnny's vocals. Each
> was in a isolation booth. Interestingly, the Koss headphones on the
> drummers head finally quit working when they literally produced smoke
> while on his head! How loud were the phones? I never bothered to
> measure. In one case after a session, I did stick a B & K sound level
> meter between the earpieces and measured 140 dB SPL, average A weighted.
> Deaf? You bet. Pain, you bet.
>
> Today, we listen to music composed of 9 billion tracks of overdubs,
> digitally recorded and compressed, processed, EQ'd, edited, pitch shifted
> because no one can actually play or sing on pitch, de-S'ed, de- popped,
> gated and it is all recorded mostly in boring mono. It is then remixed
> multiple times to fake stereo with more effects added and we call it
> great. They actually give Grammy's for this crap. Until you've stood in a
> studio and listened to a 21 piece band actually blow, you don't have a
> clue. I've been there and done that. It's great. The largest session I
> ever worked had 31 musicians in the studio at one time. That was a Kris
> Kristofferson written song, recorded by Ray Price on analog 4 track. Don
> Law was the producer, Cam Mullins was the arranger. Grady Martin played
> lead guitar. Listen to it, it is real music.
>
> And yes, due to age my hearing is diminished, but not diminished due to
> loud. I've always said that it is easy to be loud as it only takes money.
> To be good, well that's another chapter in the book that few will ever
> attain.
>
> 73
> Bob, K4TAX
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Duane Fischer W8DBF" <dfischer at usol.com>
> To: "wolfbob" <wolfbob at csnsys.com>; <k4oah at mindspring.com>
> Cc: <heathkit at mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2006 9:54 PM
> Subject: Re: [Heathkit] question from a non-Ham
>
>
>> You tell them Bob! (This man knows his audio!). Put up a pair of James B.
>> Lansing Century L-100 and feed them 35 watts pure continuous RMS and
>> something recorded in the RCA Nashville studio B and you will have all
>> the highs your neighbor's dogs can stand and enough clean bass to vibrate
>> the dirt out of your carpeting! "Good" speakers and amplifiers do not
>> need a lot of power to be efficient.
>>
>> Bob I can still hear a Flea break wind at a thousand yards, a cat fight
>> ten houses down the street and hear down to 32 Hz. I also spent thirty
>> years on stage, but earplugs can do great things for performers, if they
>> bother to use them!
>>
>> Duane w8DBF
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "wolfbob" <wolfbob at csnsys.com>
>> To: <k4oah at mindspring.com>
>> Cc: <heathkit at mailman.qth.net>
>> Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2006 5:22 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Heathkit] question from a non-Ham
>>
>>
>>> I'm not too sure that there are any that can hear anything anymore. The
>>> youth seem to run everything at 115dB and distorted wiping out any
>>> hearing they were born with and we old farts cant hear much over 10K
>>> anymore. I am now specializing in trying to get clean bass...another end
>>> of the spectrum that is being ruined...but once you find a reproducer
>>> that can deliver and a source that has not already been clobbered, it
>>> sure sounds neat...
>>>
>>> WBob
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Garey Barrell" <k4oah at mindspring.com>
>>> Cc: <heathkit at mailman.qth.net>
>>> Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2006 12:39 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Heathkit] question from a non-Ham
>>>
>>>
>>>> Unfortunately, the ones who CAN hear the difference, have nothing to
>>>> compare it against, since the "music" they listen to is _performed_
>>>> with intentional distortion, including voices. That is, at least those
>>>> who haven't already killed the high frequency response of their ears
>>>> with jet engine level sounds at concerts!
>>>>
>>>> Those of us who remember what "real" instruments sound like can't hear
>>>> the overtones that make them "real" anymore, due to advancing age.
>>>>
>>>> All in all, a win-win situation for all concerned!
>>>>
>>>> 73, Garey - K4OAH
>>>> Atlanta
>>>>
>>>> Drake 2-B, 4-B & C-Line Service Data
>>>> <http://www.k4oah.com>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jim Brannigan wrote:
>>>>> For many yearsI have had a better than average Hi-FI set up and have a
>>>>> pretty good ear for music.
>>>>> I've listened to songs on the kids iPod Nano and am amazed at the
>>>>> sound quality.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jim
>>>>> PS get your license and join the fun!!!
>>>>>
>>>>>> But it's not an isolated sign in traditional hobbies. Example: I
>>>>>> have been interested in High Fidelity audio for as long as that of
>>>>>> radio. Building kits of amplifiers, tuners, equalizers, both tube &
>>>>>> solid state were (are) a long-time passion. But kit-companies like
>>>>>> Heath and Dynaco have long since disappeared.
>>>>>> And 20-somethings I am friendly with have NO conception of hi-fi
>>>>>> reproduction. None! They think their iPod and/or MP-3s played on that
>>>>>> Best Buy abomination are the best that can be achieved in musical
>>>>>> reproduction!
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> List Administrator: Duane Fischer, W8DBF ** For Assistance:
>>>> dfischer at usol.com ** $$ See the vintage area on the HCI web
>>>> site - http://www.w9wze.org $$ Heathkit mailing list
>>>> Heathkit at mailman.qth.net
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/heathkit
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> List Administrator: Duane Fischer, W8DBF ** For Assistance:
>>> dfischer at usol.com ** $$ See the vintage area on the HCI web
>>> site - http://www.w9wze.org $$ Heathkit mailing list
>>> Heathkit at mailman.qth.net
>>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/heathkit
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> List Administrator: Duane Fischer, W8DBF ** For Assistance:
>> dfischer at usol.com ** $$ See the vintage area on the HCI web
>> site - http://www.w9wze.org $$ Heathkit mailing list
>> Heathkit at mailman.qth.net
>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/heathkit
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> List Administrator: Duane Fischer, W8DBF ** For Assistance:
> dfischer at usol.com ** $$ See the vintage area on the HCI web site -
> http://www.w9wze.org $$ Heathkit mailing list
> Heathkit at mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/heathkit
>
>
>
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> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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