[Ham-Computers] RE: Is Smaller Really Larger?

Thu Sep 14 19:03:15 EDT 2006

Aaron,

It defaults to IrfanView V397 I know that you have and use this program, so 
I do not need to explain menus etc.

After I press CTRL P, there are five choices for printing; same size as 
original DPI, best fit to page, custom resolution - user sets the horizontal 
and vertical image dimensions etc.

IrfanView comes up showing the file name you loaded and the PI, I need the 
conversion to inches!

What I do not understand Aaron, is I scanned the photo at 150 DPI, saved it 
as a .tif and then as a .jpg with zero compression Then I increased the 
scanning resolution from 150 to 300 PI. I saved it with 95% quality or 5% 
compression.

When I printed the .tif, I got black and white. When I printed the first 
.jpg using 150 dpi it looked good. When I printed the .jpg using 300 PI and 
100% quality, it was too big and went off the bottom of the page by 1/4 
inch. When I printed the same image with 300 PI, but with 95% quality, it 
fit, but I got distortion on one image!

Tell me this:

If I scan at 150 PI, save as a .jpg with no compression, or 100% quality, 
then print using IrfanView, select custom, set the horizontal at 5.0 and let 
it calculate the vertical, then print. How come the printed image is larger 
than I specified?

Maybe we should go at this another way with a totally blind man!

I have a .jpg image of 452000 size. I load IrfanView. Press O, type in the 
file name and location. It loads it. I press 'no' keys. I hit CTRL P to 
print. Now Aaron from the printer menu that comes up, HP P1000C if it 
matters, what options do I use? Such as which one of the five printing 
choices; same as original DPI size, best fit to page etc.

Thank you.

DBF

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Hsu, Aaron (NBC Universal)" <aaron.hsu at nbcuni.com>
To: "I>Ham-Computers" <Ham-Computers at mailman.qth.net>
Cc: "Duane Fischer, W8DBF" <dfischer at usol.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 6:45 PM
Subject: [Ham-Computers] RE: Is Smaller Really Larger?

> Hi Duane,
>
> Sounds like it's a printer setting issue in the program you're using to 
> print the scan.  Some programs keep the previous print settings.  Since 
> you previously printed at 150dpi to match the 150dpi scan, the program may 
> have kept the 150dpi print setting when you tried to print the 300dpi 
> scan.  This would result in a print scaled by 2 - in other words, the 
> print is now twice as large.  Why?  The program prints at 150dpi, as you 
> requested, but there's actually 300dpi of data; therefore, to print the 
> entire image, it requires twice the amount of print space.
>
> Check the print dpi setting in the program you're using.  If the program 
> doesn't allow dpi print adjustments, make sure the program is set to 
> "scale" the photo to whatever actual print size you wish to print.  Most 
> programs (photo or graphics editors) allow you to set the output size in 
> inches (or pixels) and the program will shrink or expand the image to fit 
> those dimensions.
>
> Matching scan dpi with print dpi is a baffling situation for many people. 
> That's why companies such as HP don't use dpi as a descriptor in their 
> programs.  Instead, the program asks "what kind of document are you 
> scanning (or printing)?  The program then sets what dpi it thinks is best 
> based on the type of document.  The same occurs when you print - the 
> program asks "what size would you like?" and prints the document/image 
> fitted to that size.  They're basically assuming that you chose the right 
> document type when you scanned the document to get the right results.  For 
> example, if you said that the image was for an e-mail, it would scan at 72 
> dpi.  However, if you try to print it to 8 x 10, it would look horrible. 
> But, it's still easier than teaching the average person about Dots Per 
> Inch (dpi) and what scanner/printer settings to adjust.  It gets worse 
> during the explaination of "true" dpi vs "interpolated" dpi.  I digress.
>
>
> 73,
>
>  - Aaron Hsu, NN6O
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 2:52 PM
> Subject: [Ham-Computers] Is Smaller Really Larger?
>
>
> Hello All,
>
> I would greatly appreciate it if one of you would explain some object 
> resolution puzzles to me. Some who are sighted, unlike myself, may benefit 
> also. Thanks!
>
> FYI: I was normally sighted until the eve of my eighteenth birthday when a 
> careless Pheasant hunter shot me.
>
> I have a printed document that measures 8W by 10H, portrait orientation. I 
> scanned it at the default DPI of 150, quarter inch margins, both sides, 
> top and bottom. It was scanned in color.  It was saved as a .jpg with no 
> compression.
>
> The image printed out fine. Correct margins, correct size.
>
> I scanned the image a second time, but I increased the DPI to 300. I also 
> used 5% compression.
>
> This time the image was large enough that the last line of text was 
> missing.
> It also pushed the margins out.
>
> Here is where I am confused. When the number of dots in a given area 
> increases, from 150 per inch to 300 per inch, the image quality, AKA 
> resolution?, improves. Instead of making the image smaller, it made it 
> larger. I thought that less dots per inch would make it larger with lower 
> resolution, but it is working in reverse, or so it seems based on the 
> description related to me.
>
> What I want is a quarter inch border/margin, all the way around. The image 
> should be 8X10. However, I can get along with a half inch border and 
> smaller image. The image could be between 5X7 and 8X10, for instance.
>
> I want the best detail I can get.
>
> Since the image consists of four color photos and some text, I saved it as 
> a .tif I also saved it as a .jpg for comparison.
>
> The .tif is too large, for some reason.
>
> How did I get the original image? My daughter used some version of Adobe 
> and created it. She printed a copy with quarter inch margins. The file she 
> gave me was the one Adobe writes with its own particular extension. Which 
> fails to load into any software I have! Adobe I do not use for personal 
> reasons.
>
> Since I had the image on paper, I thought I could just scan it, size it to 
> be an 8X10, save it to disc and print it. Which is exactly what I did. The 
> problem arose when the higher resolution image did not fit the 8.5X11 
> paper I was using.
>
> The scanned image at 150 DPI fit, but I thought I could improve the 
> quality by doing what I have beeninstructed to do by those who know what 
> they are doing when it comes to graphics. Namely, increase the DPI for 
> scanning and the compress it down to fit.
>
> Help!
>
> What is the best way to get a good scan of this image and then print it on 
> normal photo soft gloss paper stock of 8.5X11 without exceeding the 
> margins and/or going off the page?
>
> Duane W8DBF
> dfischer at usol.com
>
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