[FADCA] HAMS using Internet

Tue Oct 23 14:02:39 EDT 2007

Hi Phil,  That's great.  Keep it up!  Good boy.  I'll back you up all
the way.  73, Ed

On 10/23/07, Royce, Philip <proyce at alachuasheriff.org> wrote:
>  That would be correct, His version of end user in the first email
> indicated if we are going to advance the projects that we should provide
> internet to the masses and evidently that was not the case just to the
> ham community, at least we are on the same page on that one...lol..
>
>  But please understand my view on providing any radio service either
> our own personal enjoyment or as a service to our community.  We have
> seen in every facet of our hobby that to have a reliable system what
> ever it might be you have to have the right equipment, people to fix it
> install it ect., and the landscape to put it in.
>
>  When it comes to packet or any network you need more than one location
> to operate from which means you need towers, equipment, and possible
> rental fees or at least repairs and installations of antennas and
> feedline.
>
>  We enjoy packet for it's information and if possible the conferencing
> with our friends in other areas of the country if the system allows,
> unfortunately QSO1 is gone from this area.  But we are also here to
> provide a service to our community, it's easy to say we don't want to
> help
> "why should I help, they don't help me"  sorry I don't believe that,
> I've been providing comm. support since the early 80s.  If we are going
> to enhance our network we need to show the people we serve that it is
> worth their interest to support and invest in us and our systems that we
> develop.
> For years we tried to get the hospitals to have a packet network and
> they had no interest, they just wanted to have a person there to answer
> phones and have a 2meter radio. For years we tried to get emergency
> management to have aprs and packet in their EOC's they wanted no part of
> it.
> We finally have them understanding we have something to offer them, that
> will let us improve our network for us to have fun with and provide them
> a valuable resource if trouble hits the fan.
>
>  If I had my own 380ft tower I would have the same opinion probably,
> but the only way that GNV switch is going up is to use a county tower to
> do it, what does that mean, that means that I have to have something to
> offer them to allow the switch to be there.  The last time this switch
> was up here in Gainesville it was on the TV20 tower, why did it come
> down because someone wanted another VHF and UHF voice repeater on the
> tower and didn't care about packet.
>
>  We are not divided we just look at it in a different perspective, I
> look at it as I can't do it myself alone I'm going to sell it for what
> we can offer and hope someone has some resources for me to take
> advantage of.
>
>  For months I've tried to come up with equipment myself for this
> switch, I have the computer and programmed by Charlie, I have the radio
> and the tnc's finally on my own.
>  But finally we have an opportunity to have some investment into the
> system (NFL) because I can offer a means of communications to a group
> that needs it in an emergency, we are having a meeting next month about
> installing 7 communications packages in buildings and tower structures
> and presenting them with the high speed data and voice and packet/email
> from Gainesville to Jax. with a MOU to Marion county also.  There is no
> way that us alone could do this ourselves.  So please understand if you
> feel that I'm only out for myself it's not the case I and the packet
> users will enjoy the end result but at someone else's support.
>
>  I'm getting off this soapbox cause I really think when it comes down
> to it, it's not going to matter what anyone says it's will only matter
> what people do.
>
>  As a footnote since Dstar is going though a major evaluation of
> coordination and enduser do's and don't's, I have asked a higher
> authority he opinion about the highspeed data providability and I'll let
> you all know what we can and can't do in the future with Dstar, since it
> is going to be a hot topic coming soon.  See I could have done all this
> over Packet...GRIN.
>
> BTW Jerry I built a Ethernet UHF system before our 2.4 came out with old
> telemetry data radios EF Johnson that did my whole house for internet
> but that was before we had 8.1 data speeds on cable. And End User
> question, probably would not happen due to fact that there's not enough
> time in the day for it, someday maybe we could create a FBBS that had a
> search engine in it that selected only what we wanted and but when you
> have to LB < > 12345 to get what you wanted instead of "this is just an
> example"(S)radio parts or (S) radio parts (10212007)that's just my
> opinion lets not take it to another 10pages..lol
>
> 73 Phil
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jerry DeLong
> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 5:53 PM
> To: 'Florida Amateur Digital Communication Association'
> Subject: RE: [FADCA] HAMS using Internet
>
> Dave,
>
> I don't think anyone wants to help "EMCOMMS" I believe I used the term
> "end user" and Phil assume I was talking about PUBLIC access. The term
> "end user" should have been more defined in the context of HAM "end
> users".
>
>
>
> Best regards, Jerry, KD4YAL
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net]
> > On Behalf Of n4zkf
> > Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 5:00 PM
> > To: fadca at mailman.qth.net
> > Subject: RE: [FADCA] HAMS using Internet
> >
> > I'm starting to think we have two different groups here. Some who want
> to
> > see a better "ham" radio network and some who want to see a better
> network
> > for "EMCOMMS".
> >
> > While I'm all for helping out in an emergency and have done so in many
> > disasters, I, just as you don't want to spend my weekends "working" as
> you
> > call it on a network for just the "general public". I don't want to
> help
> > build it just from EMCOMMS and Email. I guess we all have our alterior
> > motives.
> >
> >
> > Dave
> >
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net]
> > On Behalf Of kd4yal at tampabay.rr.com
> > Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 11:26 AM
> > To: Royce, Philip
> > Cc: Florida Amateur Digital Communication Association
> > Subject: RE: [FADCA] HAMS using Internet
> >
> > Phil,
> >
> > I still like to read packet bulletins there is still good information
> that
> > you
> > sometimes can't find anywhere else. As a user what would attract you
> to
> > using a  bulletins board again?
> >
> > I guess this was Charlie point.
> >
> > **sigh**
> >
> > When you talk about harden sites I believe this would prove to be very
> > difficult  from a security stand point. From what I have seen in there
> > area
> > there aren't enough Network Professional willing to put forth the time
> and
> > most don't understand the concept.
> >
> > Most bbs can send email if they are setup to do so I even had axMail
> setup
> > for Fpac to send email at one point. All flavors of xNos have native
> > support
> > for SMTP and POP3.
> >
> > Actually Linksys has caught on and rather then creating a unhappy
> customer
> > base
> > they left the WRT54GL units on the market so people could use them for
> > there
> > wireless project. Any way there are other platforms out there just as
> > cheap and
> > easily modified.
> >
> > As far as your comment about the Amprnet I am not sure what to say but
> > these guys were way a head of there time. Most HAMS even as of today
> > can't seem to understand the concept that why we are using protocols
> like
> > Rose to build our networks.
> >
> > I think maybe you are a little confuse to what would be consider
> > commercial use
> > and the use of for a fellow HAMS. For the second time no one would be
> > selling or
> > paying for a service. **END USERS** would be HAMs not the general
> public.
> >
> > The Amprnet has evolved and matured further then any experimental HAM
> > radio
> > network in existences today. FACT
> >
> > I would really like to where you found the word **PUBLIC** in anything
> I
> > said.
> >
> > During a time of emergency I could see helping emergency responder
> make
> > there
> > way to the Internet since this is the medium uses for business today
> but
> > **NOT**
> > the general public.
> >
> > Nice spin...
> >
> >
> > Best regards, Jerry, KD4YAL
> >
> >
> > ---- "Royce wrote:> A quote from AMPR.
> >
> > AMPRNet is not intended to be, and should not be used as, a substitute
> > for buying access to the Internet from a local Internet Service
> > Provider. It is, at this point in its evolution, an experimental
> network
> > which should not be relied upon to provide consistent or dependable
> > communications. As with ham radio itself, it is a hobbyist adventure.
> >
> > "quote"( We are at the point now were we could be supplying end users
> > with free Internet access and free email,
> >
> > digital voice traffic with just the cost of their own equipment. This
> > type of technology will bring back
> >
> > users but these type of network require TCPIP. The equipment needs
> could
> > be purchased pretty cheap.")
> >
> > It would be great to do, but there are lots of other ways to provide
> the
> > public with internet, and I'm not spending my weekends working on
> > projects for the general public, I'm doing it for the ham community
> and
> > emergency services.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> > [mailto:fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jerry DeLong
> > Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2007 6:24 AM
> > To: 'Florida Amateur Digital Communication Association'
> > Subject: RE: [FADCA] HAMS using Internet
> >
> >
> >
> > Hello, Phil
> >
> > Nice comments...
> >
> >
> > Firewalls are easy to build and can easily control traffic the entire
> > internet is constructed this way.
> >
> > Did you forget we are HAMS.
> >
> > I have 2 Linksys router converted to Linux that were purchased for 70$
> > each
> > and could have the range 6-10 mile @ 54-10 mb depending on the site
> they
> > were setup at. They can also be modified for two serial ports for
> legacy
> > TNC. All they need is a weather proof case and antenna.
> >
> > This has already been done by other HAMS radio networks.
> >
> > One of my Linksys router is already running Xnet...
> >
> > If no one is paying for a service how is this consider commercial?
> >
> > Perhaps you have not heard of the Amprnet? www.ampr.org
> >
> > You are correct IPIP tunneling or VPN connection is a good option for
> > site
> > to site work as this is the way it is done on the Amprnet.
> >
> > Shame on us for forgetting our roots the answer isn't always to go buy
> > the
> > new Kenwood or in this case Dstar.
> >
> >
> >
> > Best regards, Jerry, KD4YAL
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________________
> >
> >
> >
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