[FADCA] HAMS using Internet
Royce, Philip
proyce at alachuasheriff.org
Tue Oct 23 10:27:04 EDT 2007
That would be correct, His version of end user in the first email
indicated if we are going to advance the projects that we should provide
internet to the masses and evidently that was not the case just to the
ham community, at least we are on the same page on that one...lol..
But please understand my view on providing any radio service either
our own personal enjoyment or as a service to our community. We have
seen in every facet of our hobby that to have a reliable system what
ever it might be you have to have the right equipment, people to fix it
install it ect., and the landscape to put it in.
When it comes to packet or any network you need more than one location
to operate from which means you need towers, equipment, and possible
rental fees or at least repairs and installations of antennas and
feedline.
We enjoy packet for it's information and if possible the conferencing
with our friends in other areas of the country if the system allows,
unfortunately QSO1 is gone from this area. But we are also here to
provide a service to our community, it's easy to say we don't want to
help
"why should I help, they don't help me" sorry I don't believe that,
I've been providing comm. support since the early 80s. If we are going
to enhance our network we need to show the people we serve that it is
worth their interest to support and invest in us and our systems that we
develop.
For years we tried to get the hospitals to have a packet network and
they had no interest, they just wanted to have a person there to answer
phones and have a 2meter radio. For years we tried to get emergency
management to have aprs and packet in their EOC's they wanted no part of
it.
We finally have them understanding we have something to offer them, that
will let us improve our network for us to have fun with and provide them
a valuable resource if trouble hits the fan.
If I had my own 380ft tower I would have the same opinion probably,
but the only way that GNV switch is going up is to use a county tower to
do it, what does that mean, that means that I have to have something to
offer them to allow the switch to be there. The last time this switch
was up here in Gainesville it was on the TV20 tower, why did it come
down because someone wanted another VHF and UHF voice repeater on the
tower and didn't care about packet.
We are not divided we just look at it in a different perspective, I
look at it as I can't do it myself alone I'm going to sell it for what
we can offer and hope someone has some resources for me to take
advantage of.
For months I've tried to come up with equipment myself for this
switch, I have the computer and programmed by Charlie, I have the radio
and the tnc's finally on my own.
But finally we have an opportunity to have some investment into the
system (NFL) because I can offer a means of communications to a group
that needs it in an emergency, we are having a meeting next month about
installing 7 communications packages in buildings and tower structures
and presenting them with the high speed data and voice and packet/email
from Gainesville to Jax. with a MOU to Marion county also. There is no
way that us alone could do this ourselves. So please understand if you
feel that I'm only out for myself it's not the case I and the packet
users will enjoy the end result but at someone else's support.
I'm getting off this soapbox cause I really think when it comes down
to it, it's not going to matter what anyone says it's will only matter
what people do.
As a footnote since Dstar is going though a major evaluation of
coordination and enduser do's and don't's, I have asked a higher
authority he opinion about the highspeed data providability and I'll let
you all know what we can and can't do in the future with Dstar, since it
is going to be a hot topic coming soon. See I could have done all this
over Packet...GRIN.
BTW Jerry I built a Ethernet UHF system before our 2.4 came out with old
telemetry data radios EF Johnson that did my whole house for internet
but that was before we had 8.1 data speeds on cable. And End User
question, probably would not happen due to fact that there's not enough
time in the day for it, someday maybe we could create a FBBS that had a
search engine in it that selected only what we wanted and but when you
have to LB < > 12345 to get what you wanted instead of "this is just an
example"(S)radio parts or (S) radio parts (10212007)that's just my
opinion lets not take it to another 10pages..lol
73 Phil
-----Original Message-----
From: fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jerry DeLong
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 5:53 PM
To: 'Florida Amateur Digital Communication Association'
Subject: RE: [FADCA] HAMS using Internet
Dave,
I don't think anyone wants to help "EMCOMMS" I believe I used the term
"end user" and Phil assume I was talking about PUBLIC access. The term
"end user" should have been more defined in the context of HAM "end
users".
Best regards, Jerry, KD4YAL
> -----Original Message-----
> From: fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net]
> On Behalf Of n4zkf
> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 5:00 PM
> To: fadca at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: RE: [FADCA] HAMS using Internet
>
> I'm starting to think we have two different groups here. Some who want
to
> see a better "ham" radio network and some who want to see a better
network
> for "EMCOMMS".
>
> While I'm all for helping out in an emergency and have done so in many
> disasters, I, just as you don't want to spend my weekends "working" as
you
> call it on a network for just the "general public". I don't want to
help
> build it just from EMCOMMS and Email. I guess we all have our alterior
> motives.
>
>
> Dave
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net]
> On Behalf Of kd4yal at tampabay.rr.com
> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 11:26 AM
> To: Royce, Philip
> Cc: Florida Amateur Digital Communication Association
> Subject: RE: [FADCA] HAMS using Internet
>
> Phil,
>
> I still like to read packet bulletins there is still good information
that
> you
> sometimes can't find anywhere else. As a user what would attract you
to
> using a bulletins board again?
>
> I guess this was Charlie point.
>
> **sigh**
>
> When you talk about harden sites I believe this would prove to be very
> difficult from a security stand point. From what I have seen in there
> area
> there aren't enough Network Professional willing to put forth the time
and
> most don't understand the concept.
>
> Most bbs can send email if they are setup to do so I even had axMail
setup
> for Fpac to send email at one point. All flavors of xNos have native
> support
> for SMTP and POP3.
>
> Actually Linksys has caught on and rather then creating a unhappy
customer
> base
> they left the WRT54GL units on the market so people could use them for
> there
> wireless project. Any way there are other platforms out there just as
> cheap and
> easily modified.
>
> As far as your comment about the Amprnet I am not sure what to say but
> these guys were way a head of there time. Most HAMS even as of today
> can't seem to understand the concept that why we are using protocols
like
> Rose to build our networks.
>
> I think maybe you are a little confuse to what would be consider
> commercial use
> and the use of for a fellow HAMS. For the second time no one would be
> selling or
> paying for a service. **END USERS** would be HAMs not the general
public.
>
> The Amprnet has evolved and matured further then any experimental HAM
> radio
> network in existences today. FACT
>
> I would really like to where you found the word **PUBLIC** in anything
I
> said.
>
> During a time of emergency I could see helping emergency responder
make
> there
> way to the Internet since this is the medium uses for business today
but
> **NOT**
> the general public.
>
> Nice spin...
>
>
> Best regards, Jerry, KD4YAL
>
>
> ---- "Royce wrote:> A quote from AMPR.
>
> AMPRNet is not intended to be, and should not be used as, a substitute
> for buying access to the Internet from a local Internet Service
> Provider. It is, at this point in its evolution, an experimental
network
> which should not be relied upon to provide consistent or dependable
> communications. As with ham radio itself, it is a hobbyist adventure.
>
> "quote"( We are at the point now were we could be supplying end users
> with free Internet access and free email,
>
> digital voice traffic with just the cost of their own equipment. This
> type of technology will bring back
>
> users but these type of network require TCPIP. The equipment needs
could
> be purchased pretty cheap.")
>
> It would be great to do, but there are lots of other ways to provide
the
> public with internet, and I'm not spending my weekends working on
> projects for the general public, I'm doing it for the ham community
and
> emergency services.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:fadca-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jerry DeLong
> Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2007 6:24 AM
> To: 'Florida Amateur Digital Communication Association'
> Subject: RE: [FADCA] HAMS using Internet
>
>
>
> Hello, Phil
>
> Nice comments...
>
>
> Firewalls are easy to build and can easily control traffic the entire
> internet is constructed this way.
>
> Did you forget we are HAMS.
>
> I have 2 Linksys router converted to Linux that were purchased for 70$
> each
> and could have the range 6-10 mile @ 54-10 mb depending on the site
they
> were setup at. They can also be modified for two serial ports for
legacy
> TNC. All they need is a weather proof case and antenna.
>
> This has already been done by other HAMS radio networks.
>
> One of my Linksys router is already running Xnet...
>
> If no one is paying for a service how is this consider commercial?
>
> Perhaps you have not heard of the Amprnet? www.ampr.org
>
> You are correct IPIP tunneling or VPN connection is a good option for
> site
> to site work as this is the way it is done on the Amprnet.
>
> Shame on us for forgetting our roots the answer isn't always to go buy
> the
> new Kenwood or in this case Dstar.
>
>
>
> Best regards, Jerry, KD4YAL
>
>
>
> ________________________________________
>
>
>
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