[Elecraft] K3 transmit/amplifier relay

Mon Mar 14 22:27:41 EDT 2011

*Hi,

I have been following this thread for a while now and maybe I have misplaced
the issue.

What is there to fix Igor?

I ask this so that I can better understand your concern and application as I
don't recall anyone else chiming in on a 'fix' if something is indeed wrong.

Always willing to learn.

73's
Gary
*
On 15 March 2011 12:13, Igor Kosvin <k.igor at comcast.net> wrote:

> Guy,
>
> I think whatever you say makes sense. The only action when paddles are
> touched in receive mode with VOX off should be keyer side tone, right?
> Since
> the sound is software controlled without involvement of 7R signal (I assume
> this is correct), the rig should remain in receive mode and there is no
> reason for 7R line to drop down at all. What happens though that all
> transceiver except final stage goes to transmit. Even P3 freezes for a
> duration of the tone, sensing that K3 is in transmit. Oh, the TX LED is not
> activated. Maybe we should use TX LED signal to key amplifier? Kidding,
> just
> kidding...
> By the way, I think the KPA3 is not activated either by the paddles in
> receive without VOX. Both 7R and 7T are brought to the KPA3 and they are
> both used to correctly switch the T/R mode of the amplifier.
> Looking at the whole thing from other perspective. It may or may not be
> easy
> to fix, Elecraft chose not to fix and I am not going to jump off the roof
> because of this. I wish this would be my biggest problem in life. Maybe it
> is time to follow Joe's advice and "stop fussing about it". Maybe some day
> I
> will think about hardware mod to fix it, maybe not. As for now I will not
> pursue this anymore.
>
> 73,
>
> Igor, N1YX
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: elecraft-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:elecraft-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Guy Olinger K2AV
> Sent: Monday, March 14, 2011 5:52 PM
> To: Joe Subich, W4TV
> Cc: Elecraft Reflector
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 transmit/amplifier relay
>
> Joe, I do not understand what you mean by VOX in your assertion below.
>
> There is no VOX steady state input from anywhere.  There is no VOX jack or
> ACC pin named VOX.  There is a steady state VOX segment in the LCD display,
> but that is driven from the CPU across the LCDSCL LCDDI LCDCE LCDMODE
> multiplex lines. There is no VOX trace on the boards.
>
> The VOX input on the BAND- button is momentary.  The CPU has to retain the
> steady state which means "the-operator-wants-VOX operation".  You can call
> it anything you want, but the steady state, as evidenced by the lit VOX
> segment on the display, only exists in the CPU and somewhere inside the LCD
> display.
>
> Set your K3 to CW mode. Do not assert PTT IN at any time in the procedure
> below.
>
> Turn on VOX, key the rig via PADDLE or KEY,  You get both keyed power out
> and "closure" on KEY OUT with the usual TR switching. The TX led lights
> roughly following the CW.
>
> Turn off VOX, key the rig via paddle or Key.  You do not get power out, but
> you get closure on KEY OUT, and (with the hard connection to 7'r) the rig
> drops RX with the keying. The TX led does NOT light, even though the radio
> has done a 7R/7T flip.
>
> Whether you call VOX an input, a state, an imperative, or a glizzywichit,
> VOX on or off has no bearing on whether KEY OUT together with 7R is flipped
> by KEY or the results of PADDLE.
>
> Are you arguing that the behavior just described does not occur?
>
> 73, Guy
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 4:15 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV <lists at subich.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> > > KEY OUT in CW mode is the logical or of straight key, internal
> > > keyer and PTT.  Turning on VOX neither asserts nor gates KEY OUT
> >
> > No, when any of the (input) signals I named - straight key, internal
> > keyer CW, PTT or VOX (note VOX is an input *not* a control state) -
> > is active, Key Out is closed (low impedance to common).  That is a
> > logical-or (more specifically logical-NOR since it is a low going
> > signal).  It would properly be written:
> >  NOT (Straight Key OR Internal Keyer OR PTT OR VOX)
> >
> > What you want is for PTT (input), VOX (input) or QSK (control state)
> > to gate the Key and Keyer.  In other words, written as:
> >  NOT (((Straight Key OR Internal Keyer) AND (PTT OR VOX)) OR
> >      (PTT OR VOX OR QSK))
> >
> > 73,
> >
> >   ... Joe, W4TV
> >
> >
> > On 3/14/2011 3:59 PM, Guy Olinger K2AV wrote:
> >
> >> On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 3:01 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV<lists at subich.com>
> >>  wrote:
> >>
> >> Key Out is the logical or of the key input
> >>
> >>> (straight key, internal keyer, PTT and VOX).
> >>>
> >>>
> >> WRONG. To use your terms and convention, as currently coded in
> firmware...
> >>
> >> KEY OUT in CW mode is the logical or of straight key, internal keyer and
> >> PTT.  Turning on VOX neither asserts nor gates KEY OUT
> >>
> >> To prove that, place in CW mode, and hit the key or the paddle with VOX
> >> off
> >> and PTT not asserted. If your amp is connected, out of standby, and uses
> >> KEY
> >> OUT, it will change state with the CW.
> >>
> >> This *IS* a FIRMWARE directed behavior.  It is not implicit in physical
> >> circuitry anywhere.  The requested behavior change does not require a
> >> hardware change, even though the KEY OUT jack is a hard conversion of 7R
> >> from zero state to high voltage short at KEY OUT.
> >>
> >> When in CW mode, with neither VOX nor PTT asserted, leave the K3 in
> >> receive
> >> mode, use straight or internal keyer assertion to place monitor audio on
> >> the
> >> three RX audio DAC's only. This is entirely a firmware change, though
> >> possibly an ugly one.
> >>
> >> 73, Guy.
> >>
> >>
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