[Boatanchors] Carbon Mic Rejuvination

[Bill Carns]

You may be familiar with some "Three Laws" but you are ignoring the
definition of Power Gain which is Power(out) divided by Power(in).

When you use the input "Power" you are talking about, you are doing "Work"
over q very short time period and the Valve moves (it has mass) and so that
work is done on the valve...It is all over as soon as the "work" is done.
End of story.  The fact you have changed a state, or "Modulated" some value
of the system that then goes on forever is irrelevant.

There is no free energy....There is no free lunch, and energy is always
conserved.  Otherwise you could take that "POWER GAIN" that you are talking
about so cavalierly, and use it to overcome friction in a closed system and
you would have a perpetual motion machine...  I have not seen one of those
yet.

You can play with words all you want, but in the scientific and technical
definition of "Power Gain", passive devices cannot have power Gain - ever.

Bill



-----Original Message-----
From: J. Forster [mailto:jfor at quikus.com] 
Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 1:04 PM
To: Bill Carns
Cc: boatanchors at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] Carbon Mic Rejuvination

That's why I called it an energy modulator. I am on first name terms with
the Three Laws.

-John

==================


> As a newcomer to the list, I hate to be argumentative, but no passive 
> element has Power Gain..  By definition, Power Gain is some expression 
> of Power Out divided by Power in where this number must be more than 
> one, or the db expression of same.
>
> As a physicist, and electrical engineer, I can tell you that no 
> passive element has gain, because the laws of physics would be violated.
>
> We all know that Pin = Pout in a line transformer for instance. (Less 
> of course any small losses)... But Pout cannot be more than Pin.
>
> There has to be "Conservation of energy" in any system ....which 
> basically says there is no free lunch.  If you do not apply external 
> power - like in a supply to an amplifier, then a passive element like 
> a water valve, or a passive modulator like a carbon mic, cannot have 
> gain.
>
> Sorry....just could not let that misunderstanding and misstatement 
> pass without comment.  Perhaps you are confusing "Force" for power...  
> They are not the same.
>
>
>
> Bill
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: boatanchors-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:boatanchors-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of rbethman
> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 12:23 PM
> To: boatanchors at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] Carbon Mic Rejuvination
>
> Someone would have to demonstrate the "power gain" or modulation of a 
> gate valve.
>
> Bob - N0DGN
>
>
> On 3/16/2013 12:58 PM, J. Forster wrote:
>> Richard,
>>
>> More correctly, carbon mikes are 'energy modulators'- they modulate 
>> the flow of electrical energy in response to a mechanical input...
>> very like a valve for water.
>>
>> They DO have power gain, as do valves for water or air.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> -John
>>
>
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