[Vintage-Audio] Celestion speakers

Wed Oct 29 10:07:01 2003

Michael, 	

I am sure the specs are out there, somewhere, Perhaps a search using the model
number would turn up some or perhaps even a review. 	

Some of the audio buffs on this list probably know, wake up W9RAN! (grin) 	

As long as you enjoy the sound, the rest is just rhetoric for people to discuss
pro/con. Taste is a personal thing, or the lack thereof! Ha Ha. No reflection
meant toward you Michael, it is all a matter of personal preference. What I
like, you may love, then again, you may wonder about my taste and find it not
pleasurable at all. 	

Do keep us posted as to what you find out, as at least one of us, ME, is curious
about them. I have never a pair of them, at least not that I can recall anyhow. 

These JVC knock offs are certainly well built, well designed and used good
components. The twelve inch woofers use a 36 ounce magnet which is uncommon in
recent years. I believe these were built around 1990-1993. I do have a critical
ear and these speakers do impress me. Remember I have a pair of James B. Lansing
Century L-100 mounted at the cieling firing down to ear level while sitting on
the couch at the opposite end of the room. I bought them new for $600 in 1974. I
use a pair of B&W 630 as my monitors, but can phase them in with the James B.
Lansing' for a really exciting sound. The B&W are bi-wired to enhance the high
frequencies. Do not confuse this with bi-amped.    	

Right now the Japan Victor Components speakers are being used as the mono center
channel for the H.H. Scott LK-72b and powered by a Marantz amp with 90 watts
continuous RMS per channel. 

Duane W8DBF 	

----------
From: Salmons, Michael <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [Vintage-Audio] Celestion speakers
Date: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 5:38 PM

Hi, Duane. Not sure about the specs you've requested- I am curious
myself, so if I find some of it out I will get back to you. I work at an
academic library and may stumble across a review eventually. Or maybe
Celestion can shed some light. I could take them apart I suppose, but I
wasn't planning to do that.

As far as what I do know: it's not ported, but the passive radiator is a
variation on that theme. Some of Lansing's designs employed passive
radiators; the L77 springs to mind. 

coloration vs. accuracy: I appreciate both, actually. I do have an
affinity for the coloration of certain pieces of equipment. I am
sometimes very pleased by amplifier and speaker combos that are not
accurate at all- for instance the Bang and Olufsen beovox 2600 is a very
colored speaker, but just sounds great with the Yamaha A-460 amplifier.
It has a richness that reminds me a great deal of the way the Shure SM7
microphone reproduces the human voice over an FM broadcast. I'm not sure
why the two seem similar to me, maybe something in the mids. Very
appealing but nothing terribly accurate about either one of them. But I
like to try different combinations just to see what results.

It's hard to decide whether I'm appreciating the particular coloration
of a system, or its accuracy, when listening to a highly artificial work
such as "Tommy." I guess I'm enjoying both at the same time: the
Celestions do have a distinct personality, but also render the intent of
the group and producer of the album quite well, to my ears at least. I
don't think they could ever fool me into thinking the Who or John
Coltrane is playing right in front of me, but I will enjoy them
nonetheless for their own unique strengths.

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Duane Fischer,
W8DBF
Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 12:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Vintage-Audio] Celestion speakers

Michael, 	

First, congratulations on your new toys. 	

What weight magnet is used on the eight inch speakers?   	

What are the frequency crossover points?  	

Are these cabinets infinite baffle or bass reflex? If bass reflex, front
or rear
ported? 	

What is the minimum continuous RMS draw?	

Now this is just my observation based on what you wrote, but I sensed
you were more interested in colorazation than accuracy. Which is fine,
if that is what you prefer to hear. I am curios what media source you
are using; vinyl, reel to
reel tape, cassette tape, CD, DAT, FM tuner or VCR audio? 	

I got a pair of AR-4 from a list member just prior to colon cancer
surgery two months ago. He warned me they looked ugly, he was not
kidding. Not damaged, just needing a fresh refinishing job and new grill
material. Which does not affect the sound. Now I appreciate this
gentlemen telling me the truth, as many would figure how would a blind
man know the grill cloth had more spots than a Leopard? But some know I
am a professional Magician/Illusionist and learned many years ago the
most efficient means by which to vanish people. (grin)  Remember, with a
Magician, it is "Heads they win, tails you lose"! 	

Now that I have a reasonable chance to survive for two years, 70%, I am
going to have the pair of AR-4 rebuilt and refinish them. I plan to use
them as monitors
with my vintage H.H. Scott equipment for recording purposes. 	

Book shelf speakers: I have often observed some of these and wondered
what kind of bookcase was needed to hold them! Not exactly small and
lightweight. I solved
the floor space issue by ceiling mounting he main speakers.	

Duane W8DBF	

----------
From: Salmons, Michael <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: [Vintage-Audio] Celestion speakers
Date: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 10:53 AM

I thought I would share the enjoyment of a recent acquisition with
anyone on the list who might also like the sound of classic smaller
British speakers. The acqusition is a pair of Celestion Ditton 15s (not
the XR, the original that was first released in 1966). Reportedly at the
time people were startled by the bass response of these smaller
speakers. The Ditton 15 was the first really successful small passive
radiator design. People went nuts over them and they outsold every
bookshelf speaker in its class at that time. There's an 8" woofer and 8"
radiator, both with long-lasting butyl surrounds, and a dome tweeter.
The dimensions are about 22"H X 9"W X 10"D, so not as small as a Rogers
LS/3a by any means, but not huge either. And I'm happy to report the
sound is pleasingly full. The highs are airy without being brittle, the
mids have warmth, and the bass is startling, not muddy in any way, tight
and very authoritative. I'm reminded of Tannoys and Missions, two other
lines of speakers with smaller models generally (barring a few not so
great models, especially recently) quite capable of delivering
satsifying lows. 

I've tried these speakers with a couple of different amp/input combos.
They do my Eico HF-81 justice, although they are a little more power
hungry than my Paradigm references. One of the thing I like about these
Celestions is they can really help a transistor amp shine. I mean, no
speaker is going to make a crappy amp shine, but if you have a decent
amp, the combination can be very pleasing. They seem to like my
(mid-seventies) Dynaco and Denon amps; both brands are sweetened with
these speakers. I sampled some John Coltrane (Blue Train, on 180 gm Blue
Note vinyl) via my old kenwood turntable, armed with a nice A&R
Cambridge cartridge, through the Dynaco. Trane sounded as suave and
manic as ever, jumping right out in the soundstage. The celestions have
a pretty easy time with brass, which is, next to vocals, in my
experience is the greatest challenge for smaller, budget-priced
speakers. For the money (less than $100) they blow away anything Polk or
Infinity have made in twenty years (I'm probably exaggerating- I
certainly haven't heard everything they have made!- but perhaps not by
much). 

Then I tried a CD of the recent thorough remix and mastering of the
Who's Tommy. One of the things I've always liked about that album is its
nifty stereo image, something they apparently really worked hard to
preserve in the new mix. The Celestions fleshed out discrete areas in
the stereo image very handily. I think "Overture/Sparks" is one of the
greatest moments in rock, and I felt totally immersed in the recording.
Chills up and down the spine.

Anyway.. I'm hooked! if any of you have opinions about or experiences
with Celestions or other British speakers, I'd be interested to read
them!

Michael 

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