[Uniden] Keeping Digital Scanners Out Of The Wrong Hands.

Sat, 24 May 2003 15:21:18 -0700

sorry about the last line should read "would being able to listen to these 
services be a way to make these services accountable to the public they 
serve?"

----Original Message Follows----

would it just be as easy to cross the boarder and purchase a digital 
scanner, and how is monitoring a digital transmission any different than an 
analouge transmission aside from the conversion from a digital signal to an 
analouge one? it is only one more step to go through to get the same end 
result... soound out of a speaker???
i could see if there was a form of encryption, but the format is an industry 
"standard" (i think) even thoug it is only one of a bunch of different 
trunking "standards" everyone does there own thing makes for a huge mess 
when different agencies need to talk to each other.
$9000 for a radio that is worth how much??? just to be able to listen to 
what the CPS is saying to each other and they(CPS) still sensor what the 
media is able to listen to?!!!!!! outragous. but i do belive that there are 
comms that the public should not be permitted to listen to like ERT,it is 
hard to have an opinion that is uniform as it is a very complex issure to 
deal with especially post 9/11.
keep scanners out of the wrong hands is not as important as keeping 
transcievers out of the wrong hands, and that can even include ham 
operators, there is one ham, not named, near where i live that has alegedly 
used his ham trancievers to cause interfierence with public safety services, 
where i live all the RCMP(139.000Mhz), BC ambulance(139.000Mhz-150.000Mhz) 
and local fire departments(150.000Mhz-156Mhz) are conventional/analouge 
equipment that is in the VHF, and as we all know *most* ham equipment can be 
modified to tx outside of the legal ham bands, would not being able to 
listen to these services be a way to be accountable to the public they 
serve?
just my 2 cents worth
Kiernan

This is from another list--but has so much info I thought it was nessesary 
to
post it here!

Bob
WB3DYE
======================================================
Subj:   Re: [DigiScan]
Date:   05/24/2003 4:22:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From:� � [email protected] (Willingham, Shaun)
Reply-to:� � [email protected]
To:� � [email protected]

Hi,

As a Canadian, a ham operator, a communications technician, and a
paramedic, I'll offer you my opinion on the matter.

First off, Industry Canada has their head's so far up their %#$ it's not
even funny. They truely believe that the APCO25 technology (digital in
nature) was developed to get rid of "scanner listeners". I was told this
by the RCMP last year, after I was arrested for monitoring their ASTRO
communications. I was not charged, and no equipment was taken.

Industry Canada believes that the media, and the public, has no right to
monitor these "in the clear" radio transmissions, which are just digital
in nature - no different than analog. It really bothers me. Most American
vendors will not ship the BC785/BC250 scanners to Canada, out of fear that
they are breaking some non-existant law. In fact, there is no law stating
that monitoring digital communications is illega, but rather an Industry
Canada "IPC" document (Internal Policy Circular) that suggests a license
should be required - but this is not law. Many people have read in to the
IPC document the wrong way, and as a result the entire scanning community
is misinformed.

Every person has the right to monitor a radio broadcast, which is
transmitted in the clear. As much as I hate to say it, even terrorists
have the "right" to tune in. Although they are absolutely disgusting
people, it is up to law enforcement to take steps to protect their
communications - otherwise they are subject to interception. I don't mind
scanner folk listening in on my comms at work - I've done it for 13 years
too. It's sad how the government of Canada is using this whole "digital"
thing as a scapegoat to define privacy. Things aren't defined enough here.
It's strange that the FCC gave the OK to digital scanners, considering the
USA is a target for terrorism, yet in Canada where things seem to be more
tame, the scanners are "illegal" unless licensed.

I will bring a few links to your attention:

First, this is the actual Industry Canada Circular (IPC) document, that is
at the center of the the debate (Canadian debate, anyway)

http://strategis.ic.gc.ca/SSI/sf/ipc2104.pdf

Second, review this thread on trunkedradio.net, which has quite a few
valid points to it:

http://www.trunkedradio.net/groups/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3380

And finally, I will include a post from the scanont yahoogroup, which was
forwarded from the Alberta scanner group, discussing various problems the
media out there has run in to, with the digital scanner licensing. Sorry
for the long post, but I find this whole saga quite interesting, since I
was arrested for being a "terrorist scanner hobbyist" only a year ago.

- Shaun

-

Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 08:20:33 -0400
From: Greg Kulin <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: [Scanont] Cross-post from Albertascan regarding media use of
digital scanners - LONG POST

Saw this on Albertascan regarding the media's use of Uniden's scanenrs,
and what IC's response is. This was in two messages. It is long, but very
interesting. To save bandwidth I would recommend we trim our responses.

Msg 1

I have received good information that the A-Channel and CFCN
television are planning on taking action against Industry Canada
regarding the Uniden Digital Scanners.

My source tells me that CFCN is trying to get authorization to use
the digital scanner legally however from their understanding, there
really is no law.� The Calgary City Police prohibits the media from
using these scanners as they are aware that they will receive more
channels then the ones they curently own.� They purchase astro
digital radios direct from the City Police pre-programmed with
limited channels at a cost of $9000.00 per portable.

It would only make sense to purchase a much cheaper piece of
equipment that does a much better job.

I will keep all posted on what I hear down the road.� The process is
on the go.

MSG 2 - IC's response
Here is an email that was sent to me regarding the digital
scanners.� I guess Industry Canada is trying to fight something that
is going to be contreversial with the public and media.� The
interesting thing about all of this is that is also conflicts with
what people are saying about illegal satellite systems and their
signals.

------------------

Thank you for the copy of the contract that you have with the City
of Calgary respecting a "Digital Radio System Licensing Agreement",
as well as your letter in which you outline the reasons why you feel
the media should meet our existing policy considerations for those
individuals or organizations who should be able to hold a licence
for a digital scanner.

The Radiocommunication Act contains the following prohibitions:

9 (1.1) Except as prescribed, no person shall make use of or divulge
a radio-based telephone communication

(a) if the originator of the communication or the person intended by
the originator of the communication to receive it was in Canada when
the communication was made; and

(b) unless the originator, or the person intended by the originator
to receive the communication consents to the use or divulgence.

9(2) Except as prescribed, no person shall intercept and make use
of, or intercept and divulge, any radiocommunication, except as
permitted by the originator of the communication or the person
intended by the originator of the communication to receive it.

9(3) Subsection (2) does not apply in respect of radiocommunication
that consists of broadcasting, a subscription programming signal or
a network feed .

Industry Canada has intentionally limited the licensing of digital
scanners in order to minimize the risk that the public's expectation
of privacy might be compromised.� The licensing criteria for digital
scanners established pursuant to the Radiocommunication Act and
Regulations may be found in the technical standard RSS 135 and the
policy document IPC 2-1-04.

After reviewing your arguments, as well as the content of your
existing agreement with the City of Calgary, we find that neither of
the policy considerations you quote, would be applicable to� enable
a broadcaster such as the media to be issued a licence for a digital
scanner.� These two groups, engaged in:

a) preserving or protecting life and property, which includes
providing emergency assistance, or

b) investigating or prosecuting an alleged contravention of any law
or Canada or a province, or when intended to be in the interest of
the administration of justice.

were included with the intent of capturing law enforcement agencies
or safety services such as fire and ambulance, and it is our view
that generally news gathering agencies or broadcasters do not meet
the criteria for the issuance of a licence for a digital scanner
pursuant to the Radiocommunication Act and Regulations and RSS 135
and IPC-2-1-04.

Furthermore, the issuance of a digital scanner licence that could
tune into all of the City of Calgary's licensed channels may
conflict with several conditions of� the City of Calgary's contract
with the media,� including 2.9 "The Licensee shall not expand, or
permit to be expanded, the capability of the monitoring equipment,
and shall not develop new technology which will permit the expansion
of the monitoring equipment's capability".

If you need further information relating to this matter or any other
subject dealing with policy or regulations regarding spectrum
management in Canada, please feel free to contact me directly.

best regards

_____________________________________

So it looks like the Western region of IC will not issue 'scanner licenses
to the media. Also looks like a federal department will also protect the
city's interest in selling the media a $9000 radio. But then what do you
expect from a country which wants the state to regulate everything in
everyones daily life.

Grge
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