From freemab222 at gmail.com  Wed Oct  1 08:12:38 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2025 08:12:38 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] Renaissance wax formula
In-Reply-To: <07af8b3fc0da3fdf1a1bee2d64b7a1d7@smithlist.net>
References: <1603005224.665654.1758954838915@connect.xfinity.com>
	<CAD1TJUY3=tgoQ+Buj_Lqs5NeOY8CaSpWQYAsSGhk1GkDW1Jagw@mail.gmail.com>
	<1748312741.669480.1758985324293@connect.xfinity.com>
	<005d01dc2fc7$df9e8ea0$9edbabe0$@dthayes.com>
	<607726061.721307.1759216562671@connect.xfinity.com>
	<001d01dc3246$40852780$c18f7680$@dthayes.com>
	<07af8b3fc0da3fdf1a1bee2d64b7a1d7@smithlist.net>
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUbyy7d-FGN7r4j8KVfA4qKa0g99ntdQDbGB3RO8gv7JGg@mail.gmail.com>

"Absolute fluff" could also be called "dangerous lies."  When seeking a
source for wax, that might not be a big deal, but ...
... a few months ago I was seeking a readily available material that I
could use to keep a friend's EpiPen at room temperature despite high or low
temperature short-term storage.  (That would be equivalent to putting
something in an ice-water bath, in which case, the temperature would remain
at 32 F = 0 C for a time, regardless of the ambient temperature.)  The
material had to be nontoxic, melt at about room temperature, and preferably
have a high heat capacity.  I tried using ChatGPT but it kept recommending
TOXIC materials, and when I pointed that out to it, it would say something
like "my mistake" and recommend some other toxic material.  Dangerous.

Bruce
NJ


On Tue, Sep 30, 2025 at 4:19?PM <lorne at smithlist.net> wrote:

> A word of caution on the AI. While very useful and a pretty big
> timesaver it is a master of slipping absolute fluff into its responses
> and wrapping it up so it looks like it belongs. I have even had it slip
> in simple math mistakes, something it really shouldn't do.
>
> Verify everything when you can.
>
> Cheers,
> Lorne
>
> On 2025-09-30 16:10, dhayes at dthayes.com wrote:
> > Mark,
> >
> > AI can be very effective at digging deep into questions like that. The
> > amount of information being entered into the databases is downright
> > scarey (but that's another subject, more for forums like the old
> > ARTmetal mailing list). Not only does AI come up with deep dive answers
> > to direct questions but it also suggests where to go with the answers
> > and dive deeper. Anyway, here is the AI response to the direct question
> > on sources of high quality microcrystalline wax as well and the first
> > follow up question and answer. The responses can get quite lengthy so I
> > tried to keep it to a length appropriate for this list. Questions and
> > answers separated by asterisks. Hope you find it helpful.
> >
> > **********
> >
> > "Please find a source for high-grade microcrystalline wax. General Wax
> > in California may be one. Are there others?"
> >
> > **********
> >
> > Yes, Daniel ? General Wax is one option, but here are several other
> > reputable suppliers of high-grade microcrystalline wax worth
> > considering:
> > ? Top Suppliers of Microcrystalline Wax
> >
> > 1. IGI Wax (International Group, Inc.)
> > - Location: Texas-based, serving North America
> > - Grades: Cosmetic, food, and industrial-grade waxes
> > - Specs: Melt points from 145?F to 194?F; hardness from 7 to 36 ASTM
> > D1321
> > - Formats: Bulk liquid, granules, pellets, slabs
> > - Highlights: Offers custom blends and has a fully integrated supply
> > chain
> >
> > 2. Blended Waxes Inc.
> > - Location: Wisconsin
> > - Grades: BW-405 to BW-431, ranging from soft/tacky to hard/brittle
> > - Specs: Melt points from 145?F to 195?F; FDA-compliant for food and
> > cosmetic use
> > - Applications: Cosmetics, candles, adhesives, coatings, sculpting
> > - Highlights: Over 45 years of experience in custom wax blends
> >
> > 3. King Honor International
> > - Location: China (bulk export available)
> > - Grades: M70, M80, and hydrogenated variants
> > - Certifications: ISO9001
> > - Applications: Chewing gum, cosmetics, dental materials, industrial
> > coatings
> > - Highlights: Competitive pricing and broad product range for global
> > buyers
> >
> > 1) igiwax.com
> > 2) blendwaxes.com
> > 3) www.khonorwax.com
> >
> > If you're looking for domestic sourcing with high purity and
> > customization, IGI and Blended Waxes are especially strong contenders.
> > Want help comparing melt points, oil content, or bulk pricing across
> > these? I can model that next.
> >
> > **********
> >
> > "yes"
> >
> > **********
> >
> > Here are several verified sources for high-grade microcrystalline wax,
> > including General Wax and others that cater to industrial, cosmetic,
> > and conservation-grade needs:
> > ? Verified Suppliers of Microcrystalline Wax
> >
> > Supplier:
> > Location:
> > Grade Offered:
> > Notable Features:
> >
> > Supplier: General Wax & Candle Co.
> > Location: North Hollywood, CA
> > Grade Offered: Cosmetic, candle, industrial
> > Notable Features: Known for custom blends and bulk supply
> >
> > Supplier: IGI Wax (International Group, Inc.)
> > Location: Houston, TX
> > Grade Offered: Food, cosmetic, industrial
> > Notable Features: Offers high-purity waxes with detailed spec sheets
> >
> > Supplier: Blended Waxes Inc.
> > Location: Oshkosh, WI
> > Grade Offered: BW-405 to BW-431
> > Notable Features: FDA-compliant, tailored blends for conservation and
> > cosmetics
> >
> > Supplier: Paramelt B.V.
> > Location: Netherlands (global distribution)
> > Grade Offered: Microcrystalline and paraffin blends
> > Notable Features: High-end waxes for packaging, coatings, and pharma
> >
> > Supplier: King Honor International
> > Location: China
> > Grade Offered: M70, M80, hydrogenated
> > Notable Features: Bulk export, ISO-certified, competitive pricing
> >
> > Supplier: Strahl & Pitsch Inc.
> > Location: West Babylon, NY
> > Grade Offered: SP-89, SP-105, SP-179
> > Notable Features: Premium grades for cosmetics, dental, and
> > conservation use
> >
> > ? Tips for Sourcing
> > ?     Conservation-grade: Strahl & Pitsch is often preferred for museum
> and
> > archival use (e.g., Renaissance Wax replication).
> > ?     Bulk industrial: IGI and Paramelt offer robust supply chains and
> > technical support.
> > ?     Custom blends: Blended Waxes and General Wax are flexible for
> > small-batch or specialty formulations.
> >
> > Would you like help comparing melt points, oil content, or sourcing
> > samples for testing? I can model specs or help draft outreach language.
> >
> > **********
> >
> > Getting the above answers took seconds, re-formatting the table into
> > test-only mailing list format much longer.
> >
> > AI is an incredibly useful research tool but it can also be deep and
> > tempting  rabbit hole to fall into.
> >
> > Dan
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> > <theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Mark Williams via
> > TheForge
> > Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2025 3:16 AM
> > To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> > Subject: Re: [TheForge] Renaissance wax formula
> >
> > Dan,
> > If you can find a source for high-grade microcrystalline wax let me
> > know. I found one source as General Wax located in California. In
> > looking through my collection of old containers, I found some wax I had
> > made a long while ago but the spirit has gone. I'll try to melt this
> > outdoors and mix white spirit with it, storing the result in screwtop
> > glass jars so the spirits don't depart.
> >
> > Mark
> > Snow Hill, MD
> >> On 09/27/2025 12:00 PM EDT dhayes at dthayes.com wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> I've been using search engines like Google for years to research and
> >> look up just about everything and have always been amazed at how much
> >> information is out there and how effective you can be at finding it.
> >> AI is taking it to a whole new level. I entered the following in
> >> Copilot (more business oriented, probably not the best AI tool for
> >> researching something like this):
> >>
> >> "What is the formula Brian Gilbert published in the Hammer's Blow some
> >> years ago for microcrystalline wax & white spirits and that replicated
> >> Renaissance Wax?"
> >>
> >> The following is what AI had to say:
> >>
> >> *****
> >> Brian Gilbert?s formula, published in The Hammer?s Blow (a publication
> >> of the Artist-Blacksmith?s Association of North America), was a DIY
> >> attempt to replicate the properties of Renaissance Wax using
> >> accessible materials. While the exact article isn't publicly archived
> >> online, the formula he shared has circulated widely among conservation
> >> and metalworking communities. Here's the core recipe attributed to
> >> Gilbert:
> >> ? Brian Gilbert?s Renaissance Wax Replica Formula
> >> - Microcrystalline wax: 1 part by weight
> >> - White spirits (mineral spirits): 2 parts by weight
> >> ? Preparation Notes
> >> - Gently heat the white spirits in a double boiler setup (never over
> >> direct flame due to flammability).
> >> - Slowly add the microcrystalline wax, stirring until fully dissolved.
> >> - Allow the mixture to cool and solidify in a sealed container.
> >> This blend mimics the consistency and protective qualities of
> >> Renaissance Wax?clear, non-acidic, and moisture-resistant?ideal for
> >> metal, wood, and leather surfaces. Some users tweak the ratio slightly
> >> for a softer or firmer finish, and a few add polyethylene wax for
> >> closer fidelity to the original Renaissance formula.
> >>
> >> Would you like help sourcing high-grade microcrystalline wax or
> >> adjusting the formula for specific applications like firearms, optics,
> >> or archival preservation.
> >>
> >> *******
> >> Anyway, AI makes researching arcane subjects easy (not that
> >> blacksmithing is arcane but much of what is published tends to be a
> >> bit off the mainstream).
> >>
> >> Dan
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> >> <theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Mark Williams via
> >> TheForge
> >> Sent: Saturday, September 27, 2025 11:02 AM
> >> To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA <theforge at mailman.qth.net>;
> >> Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Renaissance wax formula
> >>
> >> Thanks for the help. I wrote the info down. Seems that site wants you
> >> to join for monthly $$ in order to download. I'll let you know how it
> >> works.
> >>
> >> Mark
> >> > On 09/27/2025 8:13 AM EDT Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Hey, Mark,
> >> >
> >> > I don't have that issue, but I used my usual trick of searching the
> >> > internet (Google or Duckduckgo) with your phrase, "formula that used
> >> > microcrystalline wax & white spirits and replicated Renaissance Wax"
> >> > and got a hit or two that way.
> >> > https://www.scribd.com/document/333585278/Renaissance-Wax-Recipe#:~:
> >> > te
> >> > xt=The%20recipe%20for%20our%20Renaissance,1kg%20batch%20of%20combine
> >> > d%
> >> > 20wax
> >> > .
> >> >
> >> > All the best,
> >> >
> >> > Bruce
> >> > NJ
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Sat, Sep 27, 2025 at 2:34?AM Mark Williams via TheForge <
> >> > theforge at mailman.qth.net> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Some years ago, Brian Gilbert published in the Hammer's Blow a
> >> > > formula that used microcrystalline wax & white spirits and
> >> > > replicated Renaissance Wax. I have misplaced my copy of the
> >> > > formula and hoped that one of you could remember  and send it.
> >> > >
> >> > > Thanks in advance
> >> > > Mark Williams
> >> > > Snow Hill, MD
> >> > > ______________________________________________________________
> >> > > TheForge mailing list
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> >> > >
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> >> > >
> >> > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
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> >> > > freemab222 at gmail.com
> >> > >
> >> > ______________________________________________________________
> >> > TheForge mailing list
> >> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> >> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> >> > Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> >> >
> >> > TheForge mail list group photo site is http://www.shutterfly.com
> >> > Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> >> > Password: anvil
> >> >
> >> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
> >> > email
> >> > list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
> >> > williamsiron at comcast.net
> >> ______________________________________________________________
> >> TheForge mailing list
> >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> >> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> >>
> >> TheForge mail list group photo site is http://www.shutterfly.com
> >> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> >> Password: anvil
> >>
> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
> >> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
> >> dhayes at dthayes.com
> >>
> >> ______________________________________________________________
> >> TheForge mailing list
> >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> >> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> >>
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> >> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> >> Password: anvil
> >>
> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
> >> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
> >> williamsiron at comcast.net
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > TheForge mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> >
> > TheForge mail list group photo site is
> > http://www.shutterfly.com
> > Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> > Password: anvil
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > Message delivered to dhayes at dthayes.com
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > TheForge mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> >
> > TheForge mail list group photo site is
> > http://www.shutterfly.com
> > Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> > Password: anvil
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > Message delivered to lorne at smithlist.net
> ______________________________________________________________
> TheForge mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
>
> TheForge mail list group photo site is
> http://www.shutterfly.com
> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> Password: anvil
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to freemab222 at gmail.com

From kc7pme at gmail.com  Wed Oct  1 12:01:44 2025
From: kc7pme at gmail.com (Jeff Wilson)
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2025 09:01:44 -0700
Subject: [TheForge] Ren wax safety data sheet
Message-ID: <CAHwy9HPv3pb--=3zaeWSRTastx4NYfB6LheEZfTfcw1Rg+-3OA@mail.gmail.com>

The "white spirits" is naphtha.  Aprox 80 % by volume.

 "
https://conservationsupportsystems.com/system/assets/msds/Renaissance_Wax.pdf?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email

"When we work in the workshop, we crave nothing more than new problems to
solve."
      N. Offerman

From akfrosty at mtaonline.net  Wed Oct  1 17:03:15 2025
From: akfrosty at mtaonline.net (JERRY FROST)
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2025 17:03:15 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] Renaissance wax formula
In-Reply-To: <CAD1TJUbyy7d-FGN7r4j8KVfA4qKa0g99ntdQDbGB3RO8gv7JGg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1603005224.665654.1758954838915@connect.xfinity.com>
	<CAD1TJUY3=tgoQ+Buj_Lqs5NeOY8CaSpWQYAsSGhk1GkDW1Jagw@mail.gmail.com>
	<1748312741.669480.1758985324293@connect.xfinity.com>
	<005d01dc2fc7$df9e8ea0$9edbabe0$@dthayes.com>
	<607726061.721307.1759216562671@connect.xfinity.com>
	<001d01dc3246$40852780$c18f7680$@dthayes.com>
	<07af8b3fc0da3fdf1a1bee2d64b7a1d7@smithlist.net>
	<CAD1TJUbyy7d-FGN7r4j8KVfA4qKa0g99ntdQDbGB3RO8gv7JGg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1068865156.246310047.1759352595410.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>

Ayup. Opening the markets to the world without any sort of vetting or testing requirements a decade ago led to not having products that give more than lip service to quality. This morning I'm taking out SUV BACK to the shop to see if THIS cruise control will function reliably. Had to leave but now I'm back and discovered the problem with the car is a frayed wire between the steering wheel and column so turning the wheel breaks or makes contact to the cruise switch. 

Took an old school mechanic reading the codes AND experimenting with the wheel, wires and ...stuff to find it. Then we were able to duplicate the problem driving. The parts ordered from the Dodge dealer, NO idea where it will actually come from.

Yeah, AI has a LOT of potential but not being able to trust the people making the chips means nothing online or computer is confidential.

Anyway, I think we can just hope whatever we get can be made to do what we need.

Frosty.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce" <freemab222 at gmail.com>
To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Wednesday, October 1, 2025 4:12:38 AM
Subject: Re: [TheForge] Renaissance wax formula

"Absolute fluff" could also be called "dangerous lies."  When seeking a
source for wax, that might not be a big deal, but ...
... a few months ago I was seeking a readily available material that I
could use to keep a friend's EpiPen at room temperature despite high or low
temperature short-term storage.  (That would be equivalent to putting
something in an ice-water bath, in which case, the temperature would remain
at 32 F = 0 C for a time, regardless of the ambient temperature.)  The
material had to be nontoxic, melt at about room temperature, and preferably
have a high heat capacity.  I tried using ChatGPT but it kept recommending
TOXIC materials, and when I pointed that out to it, it would say something
like "my mistake" and recommend some other toxic material.  Dangerous.

Bruce
NJ


On Tue, Sep 30, 2025 at 4:19?PM <lorne at smithlist.net> wrote:

> A word of caution on the AI. While very useful and a pretty big
> timesaver it is a master of slipping absolute fluff into its responses
> and wrapping it up so it looks like it belongs. I have even had it slip
> in simple math mistakes, something it really shouldn't do.
>
> Verify everything when you can.
>
> Cheers,
> Lorne
>
> On 2025-09-30 16:10, dhayes at dthayes.com wrote:
> > Mark,
> >
> > AI can be very effective at digging deep into questions like that. The
> > amount of information being entered into the databases is downright
> > scarey (but that's another subject, more for forums like the old
> > ARTmetal mailing list). Not only does AI come up with deep dive answers
> > to direct questions but it also suggests where to go with the answers
> > and dive deeper. Anyway, here is the AI response to the direct question
> > on sources of high quality microcrystalline wax as well and the first
> > follow up question and answer. The responses can get quite lengthy so I
> > tried to keep it to a length appropriate for this list. Questions and
> > answers separated by asterisks. Hope you find it helpful.
> >
> > **********
> >
> > "Please find a source for high-grade microcrystalline wax. General Wax
> > in California may be one. Are there others?"
> >
> > **********
> >
> > Yes, Daniel ? General Wax is one option, but here are several other
> > reputable suppliers of high-grade microcrystalline wax worth
> > considering:
> > ? Top Suppliers of Microcrystalline Wax
> >
> > 1. IGI Wax (International Group, Inc.)
> > - Location: Texas-based, serving North America
> > - Grades: Cosmetic, food, and industrial-grade waxes
> > - Specs: Melt points from 145?F to 194?F; hardness from 7 to 36 ASTM
> > D1321
> > - Formats: Bulk liquid, granules, pellets, slabs
> > - Highlights: Offers custom blends and has a fully integrated supply
> > chain
> >
> > 2. Blended Waxes Inc.
> > - Location: Wisconsin
> > - Grades: BW-405 to BW-431, ranging from soft/tacky to hard/brittle
> > - Specs: Melt points from 145?F to 195?F; FDA-compliant for food and
> > cosmetic use
> > - Applications: Cosmetics, candles, adhesives, coatings, sculpting
> > - Highlights: Over 45 years of experience in custom wax blends
> >
> > 3. King Honor International
> > - Location: China (bulk export available)
> > - Grades: M70, M80, and hydrogenated variants
> > - Certifications: ISO9001
> > - Applications: Chewing gum, cosmetics, dental materials, industrial
> > coatings
> > - Highlights: Competitive pricing and broad product range for global
> > buyers
> >
> > 1) igiwax.com
> > 2) blendwaxes.com
> > 3) www.khonorwax.com
> >
> > If you're looking for domestic sourcing with high purity and
> > customization, IGI and Blended Waxes are especially strong contenders.
> > Want help comparing melt points, oil content, or bulk pricing across
> > these? I can model that next.
> >
> > **********
> >
> > "yes"
> >
> > **********
> >
> > Here are several verified sources for high-grade microcrystalline wax,
> > including General Wax and others that cater to industrial, cosmetic,
> > and conservation-grade needs:
> > ? Verified Suppliers of Microcrystalline Wax
> >
> > Supplier:
> > Location:
> > Grade Offered:
> > Notable Features:
> >
> > Supplier: General Wax & Candle Co.
> > Location: North Hollywood, CA
> > Grade Offered: Cosmetic, candle, industrial
> > Notable Features: Known for custom blends and bulk supply
> >
> > Supplier: IGI Wax (International Group, Inc.)
> > Location: Houston, TX
> > Grade Offered: Food, cosmetic, industrial
> > Notable Features: Offers high-purity waxes with detailed spec sheets
> >
> > Supplier: Blended Waxes Inc.
> > Location: Oshkosh, WI
> > Grade Offered: BW-405 to BW-431
> > Notable Features: FDA-compliant, tailored blends for conservation and
> > cosmetics
> >
> > Supplier: Paramelt B.V.
> > Location: Netherlands (global distribution)
> > Grade Offered: Microcrystalline and paraffin blends
> > Notable Features: High-end waxes for packaging, coatings, and pharma
> >
> > Supplier: King Honor International
> > Location: China
> > Grade Offered: M70, M80, hydrogenated
> > Notable Features: Bulk export, ISO-certified, competitive pricing
> >
> > Supplier: Strahl & Pitsch Inc.
> > Location: West Babylon, NY
> > Grade Offered: SP-89, SP-105, SP-179
> > Notable Features: Premium grades for cosmetics, dental, and
> > conservation use
> >
> > ? Tips for Sourcing
> > ?     Conservation-grade: Strahl & Pitsch is often preferred for museum
> and
> > archival use (e.g., Renaissance Wax replication).
> > ?     Bulk industrial: IGI and Paramelt offer robust supply chains and
> > technical support.
> > ?     Custom blends: Blended Waxes and General Wax are flexible for
> > small-batch or specialty formulations.
> >
> > Would you like help comparing melt points, oil content, or sourcing
> > samples for testing? I can model specs or help draft outreach language.
> >
> > **********
> >
> > Getting the above answers took seconds, re-formatting the table into
> > test-only mailing list format much longer.
> >
> > AI is an incredibly useful research tool but it can also be deep and
> > tempting  rabbit hole to fall into.
> >
> > Dan
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> > <theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Mark Williams via
> > TheForge
> > Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2025 3:16 AM
> > To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> > Subject: Re: [TheForge] Renaissance wax formula
> >
> > Dan,
> > If you can find a source for high-grade microcrystalline wax let me
> > know. I found one source as General Wax located in California. In
> > looking through my collection of old containers, I found some wax I had
> > made a long while ago but the spirit has gone. I'll try to melt this
> > outdoors and mix white spirit with it, storing the result in screwtop
> > glass jars so the spirits don't depart.
> >
> > Mark
> > Snow Hill, MD
> >> On 09/27/2025 12:00 PM EDT dhayes at dthayes.com wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> I've been using search engines like Google for years to research and
> >> look up just about everything and have always been amazed at how much
> >> information is out there and how effective you can be at finding it.
> >> AI is taking it to a whole new level. I entered the following in
> >> Copilot (more business oriented, probably not the best AI tool for
> >> researching something like this):
> >>
> >> "What is the formula Brian Gilbert published in the Hammer's Blow some
> >> years ago for microcrystalline wax & white spirits and that replicated
> >> Renaissance Wax?"
> >>
> >> The following is what AI had to say:
> >>
> >> *****
> >> Brian Gilbert?s formula, published in The Hammer?s Blow (a publication
> >> of the Artist-Blacksmith?s Association of North America), was a DIY
> >> attempt to replicate the properties of Renaissance Wax using
> >> accessible materials. While the exact article isn't publicly archived
> >> online, the formula he shared has circulated widely among conservation
> >> and metalworking communities. Here's the core recipe attributed to
> >> Gilbert:
> >> ? Brian Gilbert?s Renaissance Wax Replica Formula
> >> - Microcrystalline wax: 1 part by weight
> >> - White spirits (mineral spirits): 2 parts by weight
> >> ? Preparation Notes
> >> - Gently heat the white spirits in a double boiler setup (never over
> >> direct flame due to flammability).
> >> - Slowly add the microcrystalline wax, stirring until fully dissolved.
> >> - Allow the mixture to cool and solidify in a sealed container.
> >> This blend mimics the consistency and protective qualities of
> >> Renaissance Wax?clear, non-acidic, and moisture-resistant?ideal for
> >> metal, wood, and leather surfaces. Some users tweak the ratio slightly
> >> for a softer or firmer finish, and a few add polyethylene wax for
> >> closer fidelity to the original Renaissance formula.
> >>
> >> Would you like help sourcing high-grade microcrystalline wax or
> >> adjusting the formula for specific applications like firearms, optics,
> >> or archival preservation.
> >>
> >> *******
> >> Anyway, AI makes researching arcane subjects easy (not that
> >> blacksmithing is arcane but much of what is published tends to be a
> >> bit off the mainstream).
> >>
> >> Dan
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> >> <theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Mark Williams via
> >> TheForge
> >> Sent: Saturday, September 27, 2025 11:02 AM
> >> To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA <theforge at mailman.qth.net>;
> >> Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Renaissance wax formula
> >>
> >> Thanks for the help. I wrote the info down. Seems that site wants you
> >> to join for monthly $$ in order to download. I'll let you know how it
> >> works.
> >>
> >> Mark
> >> > On 09/27/2025 8:13 AM EDT Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Hey, Mark,
> >> >
> >> > I don't have that issue, but I used my usual trick of searching the
> >> > internet (Google or Duckduckgo) with your phrase, "formula that used
> >> > microcrystalline wax & white spirits and replicated Renaissance Wax"
> >> > and got a hit or two that way.
> >> > https://www.scribd.com/document/333585278/Renaissance-Wax-Recipe#:~:
> >> > te
> >> > xt=The%20recipe%20for%20our%20Renaissance,1kg%20batch%20of%20combine
> >> > d%
> >> > 20wax
> >> > .
> >> >
> >> > All the best,
> >> >
> >> > Bruce
> >> > NJ
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Sat, Sep 27, 2025 at 2:34?AM Mark Williams via TheForge <
> >> > theforge at mailman.qth.net> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Some years ago, Brian Gilbert published in the Hammer's Blow a
> >> > > formula that used microcrystalline wax & white spirits and
> >> > > replicated Renaissance Wax. I have misplaced my copy of the
> >> > > formula and hoped that one of you could remember  and send it.
> >> > >
> >> > > Thanks in advance
> >> > > Mark Williams
> >> > > Snow Hill, MD
> >> > > ______________________________________________________________
> >> > > TheForge mailing list
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> >> > williamsiron at comcast.net
> >> ______________________________________________________________
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> >> dhayes at dthayes.com
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> >> williamsiron at comcast.net
> > ______________________________________________________________
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Message delivered to akfrosty at mtaonline.net

From williamsiron at comcast.net  Mon Oct  6 01:04:53 2025
From: williamsiron at comcast.net (Mark Williams)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2025 01:04:53 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] Ren Wax info
Message-ID: <1675135734.846534.1759727093686@connect.xfinity.com>

Thanks to all who responded. In cleaning out some trash, I came upon Brian Gilbert's original article. The Hammer's Blow Spring 2006 page 8. He attributes the formula to Mac Beal. The formula is 4 parts microcrystalline wax, 1 part polythene "A" wax are melted together and the result is poured into "white spirit" Store the finished product in screw top glass jars or a metal can with a tight-fitting lid like a paint can.
Polythene "A" wax is a hard polyethylene-based wax with a melting point of 98 to 108 degrees C. 
I found a source in General Wax and Candle, North Hollywood, CA https://generalwaxcandlemaking.com/
Micro Wax 175  10 lb is minimum cost about $40
Poly AC-6A (called wax additive) 1 lb minimum cost about $10 per lb
white spirit is odorless mineral spirit you can get at a hardware store.
The amount of white spirit determines whether you have a slushy semiliquid all the way to a hard solid. Brian used a hotplate outdoors to melt the two waxes. He then poured a little mineral spirits into the melted wax to thin it some. He then poured the mix into more mineral spirit,  stirring to even the consistency. A double boiler could work but 108C is higher than the boiling point of water.
 
Mark Williams
Snow Hill, Maryland

From jwmsmith64 at att.net  Mon Oct  6 15:47:28 2025
From: jwmsmith64 at att.net (Jim Smith)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2025 15:47:28 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers
References: <766A27C1-7144-4C47-AB5A-D03140CFB9B2.ref@att.net>
Message-ID: <766A27C1-7144-4C47-AB5A-D03140CFB9B2@att.net>

My cardiologist says I need a pacemaker.  When my father in law got one he was told he couldn?t use his stick welder anymore.  I think some may now be shielded from electromagnetic radiation.  Anyone have experience with this?

Jim Smith
Sent from my iPad
Love ?thinketh no evil,? imputes no motive, sees the bright side, puts the best construction on every action. What a delightful state of mind to live in! What a stimulus and benediction even to meet with for a day! To be trusted is to be saved. And if we try to influence or elevate others, we shall soon see that success is in proportion to their belief of our belief in them. For the respect of another is the first restoration of the self-respect a person has lost; our ideal of what they are becomes to them the hope and pattern of what they may become.


From freemab222 at gmail.com  Mon Oct  6 22:39:11 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2025 22:39:11 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers
In-Reply-To: <766A27C1-7144-4C47-AB5A-D03140CFB9B2@att.net>
References: <766A27C1-7144-4C47-AB5A-D03140CFB9B2.ref@att.net>
	<766A27C1-7144-4C47-AB5A-D03140CFB9B2@att.net>
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUa7rGhcUL+Kq7jPTBxP5o+ELmvwTe8qK2oFuGWQfrYcvw@mail.gmail.com>

I have no direct knowledge on the subject, but it is commonly known that
electric arcs emit broadband electromagnetic radiation.  An Internet search
turns up any number of articles on pacemakers vs. arc welding, but some
suggest that limiting amps or using DC only might reduce the risk -- but
don't quote me.

It wouldn't surprise me if effective shielding were possible to prevent
adverse effects, but aside from using a metal box -- a Faraday cage --
around the workpiece (or around yourself!), I couldn't suggest how to
accomplish this.

Of course, acetylene welding would not affect a pacemaker at all.

Bruce
NJ


On Mon, Oct 6, 2025 at 3:48?PM Jim Smith <jwmsmith64 at att.net> wrote:

> My cardiologist says I need a pacemaker.  When my father in law got one he
> was told he couldn?t use his stick welder anymore.  I think some may now be
> shielded from electromagnetic radiation.  Anyone have experience with this?
>
> Jim Smith
> Sent from my iPad
> Love ?thinketh no evil,? imputes no motive, sees the bright side, puts the
> best construction on every action. What a delightful state of mind to live
> in! What a stimulus and benediction even to meet with for a day! To be
> trusted is to be saved. And if we try to influence or elevate others, we
> shall soon see that success is in proportion to their belief of our belief
> in them. For the respect of another is the first restoration of the
> self-respect a person has lost; our ideal of what they are becomes to them
> the hope and pattern of what they may become.
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> TheForge mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
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> TheForge mail list group photo site is
> http://www.shutterfly.com
> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> Password: anvil
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
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From xlch58 at swbell.net  Tue Oct  7 22:48:18 2025
From: xlch58 at swbell.net (Charles)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2025 02:48:18 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers
In-Reply-To: <CAD1TJUa7rGhcUL+Kq7jPTBxP5o+ELmvwTe8qK2oFuGWQfrYcvw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <766A27C1-7144-4C47-AB5A-D03140CFB9B2.ref@att.net>
	<766A27C1-7144-4C47-AB5A-D03140CFB9B2@att.net>
	<CAD1TJUa7rGhcUL+Kq7jPTBxP5o+ELmvwTe8qK2oFuGWQfrYcvw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <266633414.617287.1759891698269@mail.yahoo.com>

 Ten years ago I had a severe heart attack that significantly damaged my heart.? ?I had a pacemaker (actually an ICD) installed a couple of years ago as once in a while the Dr thought I was experience atrial fibrillation added to the fact that due to the damage, there is always a chance my heart could just stop.? I got the same warnings, as well as to avoid standing to close to generators, alternators, etc.? The one I got was MRI safe, as well as metal detector safe, so the warnings seemed odd to me.? I have mostly ignored them and have continued mig/tig and arc welding, working on generators and living my life the same way.? If I get close to a strong magnetic field my unit will start emiting a tone.? ?This is because the way they disable the unit for surgery is to place a magnet over it.? So basically, if I get near a strong magnet it could disable the unit.? ?I am regularly backpacking mountains, welding, smithing and I work in power plants.? My Dr connects to my device remotely on a regular basis and dumps a report.? So far no issues from all of my contraindicated activities.? It barely ever kicks in, like once every three months or so some light pacing.? ?Make your own decisions, but if you get an MRI safe unit you should be fine,
Charles
    On Monday, October 6, 2025 at 09:43:09 PM CDT, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:  
 
 I have no direct knowledge on the subject, but it is commonly known that
electric arcs emit broadband electromagnetic radiation.? An Internet search
turns up any number of articles on pacemakers vs. arc welding, but some
suggest that limiting amps or using DC only might reduce the risk -- but
don't quote me.

It wouldn't surprise me if effective shielding were possible to prevent
adverse effects, but aside from using a metal box -- a Faraday cage --
around the workpiece (or around yourself!), I couldn't suggest how to
accomplish this.

Of course, acetylene welding would not affect a pacemaker at all.

Bruce
NJ


On Mon, Oct 6, 2025 at 3:48?PM Jim Smith <jwmsmith64 at att.net> wrote:

> My cardiologist says I need a pacemaker.? When my father in law got one he
> was told he couldn?t use his stick welder anymore.? I think some may now be
> shielded from electromagnetic radiation.? Anyone have experience with this?
>
> Jim Smith
> Sent from my iPad
> Love ?thinketh no evil,? imputes no motive, sees the bright side, puts the
> best construction on every action. What a delightful state of mind to live
> in! What a stimulus and benediction even to meet with for a day! To be
> trusted is to be saved. And if we try to influence or elevate others, we
> shall soon see that success is in proportion to their belief of our belief
> in them. For the respect of another is the first restoration of the
> self-respect a person has lost; our ideal of what they are becomes to them
> the hope and pattern of what they may become.
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> TheForge mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
>
> TheForge mail list group photo site is
> http://www.shutterfly.com
> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> Password: anvil
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to freemab222 at gmail.com
______________________________________________________________
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Message delivered to xlch58 at swbell.net   

From akfrosty at mtaonline.net  Tue Oct  7 23:34:58 2025
From: akfrosty at mtaonline.net (JERRY FROST)
Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2025 23:34:58 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers
In-Reply-To: <266633414.617287.1759891698269@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <766A27C1-7144-4C47-AB5A-D03140CFB9B2.ref@att.net>
	<766A27C1-7144-4C47-AB5A-D03140CFB9B2@att.net>
	<CAD1TJUa7rGhcUL+Kq7jPTBxP5o+ELmvwTe8qK2oFuGWQfrYcvw@mail.gmail.com>
	<266633414.617287.1759891698269@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1561409590.270868767.1759894498550.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>

A few months ago my wife Deb had a reverse shoulder replacement and then she noticed having sort of fuzzy spells, sometimes disorientation, etc. so she scheduled a check up and was given a heart monitor. After wearing it 24/7 for less than two weeks she got a hone call around 7am telling her to get a ride to the local ER. Besides an arrythmia her heart had stopped for 8 seconds that morning. An alarm alerted the fellow keeping an eye on monitors, he ran it by the on call cardiologist and they called, offering her an ambulance ride. I was already up and took her in, picked her up the next day after spending a night for observation and adjustments. 

I have to tell you, she's WAY better now, energy, alert, good color, etc. 

Pace makers are improving all the time and are pretty well shielded from EM and can still be read and programmed wirelessly. 

I offer a toast to modern medicine!

Frosty

----- Original Message -----
From: "Charles" <xlch58 at swbell.net>
To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Tuesday, October 7, 2025 6:48:18 PM
Subject: Re: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers

Ten years ago I had a severe heart attack that significantly damaged my heart.? ?I had a pacemaker (actually an ICD) installed a couple of years ago as once in a while the Dr thought I was experience atrial fibrillation added to the fact that due to the damage, there is always a chance my heart could just stop.? I got the same warnings, as well as to avoid standing to close to generators, alternators, etc.? The one I got was MRI safe, as well as metal detector safe, so the warnings seemed odd to me.? I have mostly ignored them and have continued mig/tig and arc welding, working on generators and living my life the same way.? If I get close to a strong magnetic field my unit will start emiting a tone.? ?This is because the way they disable the unit for surgery is to place a magnet over it.? So basically, if I get near a strong magnet it could disable the unit.? ?I am regularly backpacking mountains, welding, smithing and I work in power plants.? My Dr connects to my device remotely on a regular basis and dumps a report.? So far no issues from all of my contraindicated activities.? It barely ever kicks in, like once every three months or so some light pacing.? ?Make your own decisions, but if you get an MRI safe unit you should be fine,
Charles
  

From impublius at gmail.com  Wed Oct  8 13:25:38 2025
From: impublius at gmail.com (Andrew Vida)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2025 13:25:38 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <mailman.11.1759939207.20746.theforge@mailman.qth.net>
References: <mailman.11.1759939207.20746.theforge@mailman.qth.net>
Message-ID: <CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>

What about laser welders?  Seems they have come a very long way.

how's everyone doing?

On Wed, Oct 8, 2025 at 12:00?PM <theforge-request at mailman.qth.net> wrote:

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>
>    1. Re: Electric welding and pacemakers (Charles)
>    2. Re: Electric welding and pacemakers (JERRY FROST)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2025 02:48:18 +0000 (UTC)
> From: Charles <xlch58 at swbell.net>
> To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers
> Message-ID: <266633414.617287.1759891698269 at mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
>  Ten years ago I had a severe heart attack that significantly damaged my
> heart.? ?I had a pacemaker (actually an ICD) installed a couple of years
> ago as once in a while the Dr thought I was experience atrial fibrillation
> added to the fact that due to the damage, there is always a chance my heart
> could just stop.? I got the same warnings, as well as to avoid standing to
> close to generators, alternators, etc.? The one I got was MRI safe, as well
> as metal detector safe, so the warnings seemed odd to me.? I have mostly
> ignored them and have continued mig/tig and arc welding, working on
> generators and living my life the same way.? If I get close to a strong
> magnetic field my unit will start emiting a tone.? ?This is because the way
> they disable the unit for surgery is to place a magnet over it.? So
> basically, if I get near a strong magnet it could disable the unit.? ?I am
> regularly backpacking mountains, welding, smithing and I work in power
> plants.? My Dr connects to my device re
>  motely on a regular basis and dumps a report.? So far no issues from all
> of my contraindicated activities.? It barely ever kicks in, like once every
> three months or so some light pacing.? ?Make your own decisions, but if you
> get an MRI safe unit you should be fine,
> Charles
>     On Monday, October 6, 2025 at 09:43:09 PM CDT, Bruce <
> freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>  I have no direct knowledge on the subject, but it is commonly known that
> electric arcs emit broadband electromagnetic radiation.? An Internet search
> turns up any number of articles on pacemakers vs. arc welding, but some
> suggest that limiting amps or using DC only might reduce the risk -- but
> don't quote me.
>
> It wouldn't surprise me if effective shielding were possible to prevent
> adverse effects, but aside from using a metal box -- a Faraday cage --
> around the workpiece (or around yourself!), I couldn't suggest how to
> accomplish this.
>
> Of course, acetylene welding would not affect a pacemaker at all.
>
> Bruce
> NJ
>
>
> On Mon, Oct 6, 2025 at 3:48?PM Jim Smith <jwmsmith64 at att.net> wrote:
>
> > My cardiologist says I need a pacemaker.? When my father in law got one
> he
> > was told he couldn?t use his stick welder anymore.? I think some may now
> be
> > shielded from electromagnetic radiation.? Anyone have experience with
> this?
> >
> > Jim Smith
> > Sent from my iPad
> > Love ?thinketh no evil,? imputes no motive, sees the bright side, puts
> the
> > best construction on every action. What a delightful state of mind to
> live
> > in! What a stimulus and benediction even to meet with for a day! To be
> > trusted is to be saved. And if we try to influence or elevate others, we
> > shall soon see that success is in proportion to their belief of our
> belief
> > in them. For the respect of another is the first restoration of the
> > self-respect a person has lost; our ideal of what they are becomes to
> them
> > the hope and pattern of what they may become.
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > TheForge mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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> >
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> > http://www.shutterfly.com
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> > Password: anvil
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
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> > Message delivered to freemab222 at gmail.com
> ______________________________________________________________
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> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
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> Message delivered to xlch58 at swbell.net
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2025 23:34:58 -0400 (EDT)
> From: JERRY FROST <akfrosty at mtaonline.net>
> To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers
> Message-ID:
>         <1561409590.270868767.1759894498550.JavaMail.zimbra at mtaonline.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> A few months ago my wife Deb had a reverse shoulder replacement and then
> she noticed having sort of fuzzy spells, sometimes disorientation, etc. so
> she scheduled a check up and was given a heart monitor. After wearing it
> 24/7 for less than two weeks she got a hone call around 7am telling her to
> get a ride to the local ER. Besides an arrythmia her heart had stopped for
> 8 seconds that morning. An alarm alerted the fellow keeping an eye on
> monitors, he ran it by the on call cardiologist and they called, offering
> her an ambulance ride. I was already up and took her in, picked her up the
> next day after spending a night for observation and adjustments.
>
> I have to tell you, she's WAY better now, energy, alert, good color, etc.
>
> Pace makers are improving all the time and are pretty well shielded from
> EM and can still be read and programmed wirelessly.
>
> I offer a toast to modern medicine!
>
> Frosty
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Charles" <xlch58 at swbell.net>
> To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 7, 2025 6:48:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers
>
> Ten years ago I had a severe heart attack that significantly damaged my
> heart.? ?I had a pacemaker (actually an ICD) installed a couple of years
> ago as once in a while the Dr thought I was experience atrial fibrillation
> added to the fact that due to the damage, there is always a chance my heart
> could just stop.? I got the same warnings, as well as to avoid standing to
> close to generators, alternators, etc.? The one I got was MRI safe, as well
> as metal detector safe, so the warnings seemed odd to me.? I have mostly
> ignored them and have continued mig/tig and arc welding, working on
> generators and living my life the same way.? If I get close to a strong
> magnetic field my unit will start emiting a tone.? ?This is because the way
> they disable the unit for surgery is to place a magnet over it.? So
> basically, if I get near a strong magnet it could disable the unit.? ?I am
> regularly backpacking mountains, welding, smithing and I work in power
> plants.? My Dr connects to my device rem
>  otely on a regular basis and dumps a report.? So far no issues from all
> of my contraindicated activities.? It barely ever kicks in, like once every
> three months or so some light pacing.? ?Make your own decisions, but if you
> get an MRI safe unit you should be fine,
> Charles
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> TheForge mail list group photo site is
> http://www.photoaccess.com
> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> Password: anvil
>
>
>
>
>
> End of TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
> ****************************************
>

From calvinjean2 at comcast.net  Wed Oct  8 14:01:05 2025
From: calvinjean2 at comcast.net (CraigS)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2025 11:01:05 -0700
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3FBA83CB-A9B9-4CE9-BE9B-745F9110BDD8@comcast.net>

Fine here in central Oregon but rarely post. 

Wonder how I would hide a $30k machine from my wife??

Craig

> On Oct 8, 2025, at 10:26?AM, Andrew Vida <impublius at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?What about laser welders?  Seems they have come a very long way.
> 
> how's everyone doing?
> 
>> On Wed, Oct 8, 2025 at 12:00?PM <theforge-request at mailman.qth.net> wrote:
>> 
>> Send TheForge mailing list submissions to
>>        theforge at mailman.qth.net
>> 
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>        http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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>> 
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of TheForge digest..."
>> 
>> 
>> Today's Topics:
>> 
>>   1. Re: Electric welding and pacemakers (Charles)
>>   2. Re: Electric welding and pacemakers (JERRY FROST)
>> 
>> 
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2025 02:48:18 +0000 (UTC)
>> From: Charles <xlch58 at swbell.net>
>> To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
>> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers
>> Message-ID: <266633414.617287.1759891698269 at mail.yahoo.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>> 
>> Ten years ago I had a severe heart attack that significantly damaged my
>> heart.? ?I had a pacemaker (actually an ICD) installed a couple of years
>> ago as once in a while the Dr thought I was experience atrial fibrillation
>> added to the fact that due to the damage, there is always a chance my heart
>> could just stop.? I got the same warnings, as well as to avoid standing to
>> close to generators, alternators, etc.? The one I got was MRI safe, as well
>> as metal detector safe, so the warnings seemed odd to me.? I have mostly
>> ignored them and have continued mig/tig and arc welding, working on
>> generators and living my life the same way.? If I get close to a strong
>> magnetic field my unit will start emiting a tone.? ?This is because the way
>> they disable the unit for surgery is to place a magnet over it.? So
>> basically, if I get near a strong magnet it could disable the unit.? ?I am
>> regularly backpacking mountains, welding, smithing and I work in power
>> plants.? My Dr connects to my device re
>> motely on a regular basis and dumps a report.? So far no issues from all
>> of my contraindicated activities.? It barely ever kicks in, like once every
>> three months or so some light pacing.? ?Make your own decisions, but if you
>> get an MRI safe unit you should be fine,
>> Charles
>>    On Monday, October 6, 2025 at 09:43:09 PM CDT, Bruce <
>> freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> I have no direct knowledge on the subject, but it is commonly known that
>> electric arcs emit broadband electromagnetic radiation.? An Internet search
>> turns up any number of articles on pacemakers vs. arc welding, but some
>> suggest that limiting amps or using DC only might reduce the risk -- but
>> don't quote me.
>> 
>> It wouldn't surprise me if effective shielding were possible to prevent
>> adverse effects, but aside from using a metal box -- a Faraday cage --
>> around the workpiece (or around yourself!), I couldn't suggest how to
>> accomplish this.
>> 
>> Of course, acetylene welding would not affect a pacemaker at all.
>> 
>> Bruce
>> NJ
>> 
>> 
>>> On Mon, Oct 6, 2025 at 3:48?PM Jim Smith <jwmsmith64 at att.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>> My cardiologist says I need a pacemaker.? When my father in law got one
>> he
>>> was told he couldn?t use his stick welder anymore.? I think some may now
>> be
>>> shielded from electromagnetic radiation.? Anyone have experience with
>> this?
>>> 
>>> Jim Smith
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> Love ?thinketh no evil,? imputes no motive, sees the bright side, puts
>> the
>>> best construction on every action. What a delightful state of mind to
>> live
>>> in! What a stimulus and benediction even to meet with for a day! To be
>>> trusted is to be saved. And if we try to influence or elevate others, we
>>> shall soon see that success is in proportion to their belief of our
>> belief
>>> in them. For the respect of another is the first restoration of the
>>> self-respect a person has lost; our ideal of what they are becomes to
>> them
>>> the hope and pattern of what they may become.
>>> 
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> TheForge mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
>>> 
>>> TheForge mail list group photo site is
>>> http://www.shutterfly.com
>>> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
>>> Password: anvil
>>> 
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to freemab222 at gmail.com
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> TheForge mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
>> 
>> TheForge mail list group photo site is
>> http://www.shutterfly.com
>> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
>> Password: anvil
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to xlch58 at swbell.net
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2025 23:34:58 -0400 (EDT)
>> From: JERRY FROST <akfrosty at mtaonline.net>
>> To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
>> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers
>> Message-ID:
>>        <1561409590.270868767.1759894498550.JavaMail.zimbra at mtaonline.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>> 
>> A few months ago my wife Deb had a reverse shoulder replacement and then
>> she noticed having sort of fuzzy spells, sometimes disorientation, etc. so
>> she scheduled a check up and was given a heart monitor. After wearing it
>> 24/7 for less than two weeks she got a hone call around 7am telling her to
>> get a ride to the local ER. Besides an arrythmia her heart had stopped for
>> 8 seconds that morning. An alarm alerted the fellow keeping an eye on
>> monitors, he ran it by the on call cardiologist and they called, offering
>> her an ambulance ride. I was already up and took her in, picked her up the
>> next day after spending a night for observation and adjustments.
>> 
>> I have to tell you, she's WAY better now, energy, alert, good color, etc.
>> 
>> Pace makers are improving all the time and are pretty well shielded from
>> EM and can still be read and programmed wirelessly.
>> 
>> I offer a toast to modern medicine!
>> 
>> Frosty
>> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Charles" <xlch58 at swbell.net>
>> To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 7, 2025 6:48:18 PM
>> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Electric welding and pacemakers
>> 
>> Ten years ago I had a severe heart attack that significantly damaged my
>> heart.? ?I had a pacemaker (actually an ICD) installed a couple of years
>> ago as once in a while the Dr thought I was experience atrial fibrillation
>> added to the fact that due to the damage, there is always a chance my heart
>> could just stop.? I got the same warnings, as well as to avoid standing to
>> close to generators, alternators, etc.? The one I got was MRI safe, as well
>> as metal detector safe, so the warnings seemed odd to me.? I have mostly
>> ignored them and have continued mig/tig and arc welding, working on
>> generators and living my life the same way.? If I get close to a strong
>> magnetic field my unit will start emiting a tone.? ?This is because the way
>> they disable the unit for surgery is to place a magnet over it.? So
>> basically, if I get near a strong magnet it could disable the unit.? ?I am
>> regularly backpacking mountains, welding, smithing and I work in power
>> plants.? My Dr connects to my device rem
>> otely on a regular basis and dumps a report.? So far no issues from all
>> of my contraindicated activities.? It barely ever kicks in, like once every
>> three months or so some light pacing.? ?Make your own decisions, but if you
>> get an MRI safe unit you should be fine,
>> Charles
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
>> TheForge mail list group photo site is
>> http://www.photoaccess.com
>> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
>> Password: anvil
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> End of TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
>> ****************************************
>> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> TheForge mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> 
> TheForge mail list group photo site is
> http://www.shutterfly.com
> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> Password: anvil
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to calvinjean2 at comcast.net


From akfrosty at mtaonline.net  Wed Oct  8 15:59:00 2025
From: akfrosty at mtaonline.net (JERRY FROST)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2025 15:59:00 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <3FBA83CB-A9B9-4CE9-BE9B-745F9110BDD8@comcast.net>
References: <CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
	<3FBA83CB-A9B9-4CE9-BE9B-745F9110BDD8@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1512684608.274126386.1759953540661.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>

What about laser welders Andy? They HAVE come a long way and in several directions. I'm expecting to see battery powered hand held units any time now. We're getting close to room temperature super conductors and those'll make batteries to make a practical electric airplane doable.

What you been up to?

I have 2 easy answers for you Craig, hide your 30k machine at my place, there's plenty of space behind the shop and Deb never goes that direction. 

Does your wife actually go into your shop? If so it's too clean and quiet, Man cave it Bro!

Frosty

----- Original Message -----
From: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2025 10:01:05 AM
Subject: Re: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5

Fine here in central Oregon but rarely post. 

Wonder how I would hide a $30k machine from my wife??

Craig

> On Oct 8, 2025, at 10:26?AM, Andrew Vida <impublius at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?What about laser welders?  Seems they have come a very long way.
> 
> how's everyone doing?
> 
>> On Wed, Oct 8, 2025 at 12:00?PM <theforge-request at mailman.qth.net> wrote:
>> 

From mpa at marc3rd.com  Wed Oct  8 17:32:54 2025
From: mpa at marc3rd.com (mpa at marc3rd.com)
Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2025 17:32:54 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <1512684608.274126386.1759953540661.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
References: <CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
	<3FBA83CB-A9B9-4CE9-BE9B-745F9110BDD8@comcast.net>
	<1512684608.274126386.1759953540661.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
Message-ID: <451f99d8-7194-4640-9888-7a7357c7583b@marc3rd.com>

Old and cold here in michigan. 2 months til home in Maui. 
Maybe we should have a hammer in about the end of jan?

?Get BlueMail for Android ?

On Oct 8, 2025, 3:59?PM, at 3:59?PM, JERRY FROST <akfrosty at mtaonline.net> wrote:
>What about laser welders Andy? They HAVE come a long way and in several
>directions. I'm expecting to see battery powered hand held units any
>time now. We're getting close to room temperature super conductors and
>those'll make batteries to make a practical electric airplane doable.
>
>What you been up to?
>
>I have 2 easy answers for you Craig, hide your 30k machine at my place,
>there's plenty of space behind the shop and Deb never goes that
>direction. 
>
>Does your wife actually go into your shop? If so it's too clean and
>quiet, Man cave it Bro!
>
>Frosty
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA"
><theforge at mailman.qth.net>
>To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
>Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2025 10:01:05 AM
>Subject: Re: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
>
>Fine here in central Oregon but rarely post. 
>
>Wonder how I would hide a $30k machine from my wife??
>
>Craig
>
>> On Oct 8, 2025, at 10:26?AM, Andrew Vida <impublius at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> ?What about laser welders?  Seems they have come a very long way.
>> 
>> how's everyone doing?
>> 
>>> On Wed, Oct 8, 2025 at 12:00?PM <theforge-request at mailman.qth.net>
>wrote:
>>> 
>______________________________________________________________
>TheForge mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
>
>TheForge mail list group photo site is
>http://www.shutterfly.com
>Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
>Password: anvil
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>Message delivered to mpa at marc3rd.com 

From akfrosty at mtaonline.net  Wed Oct  8 23:54:01 2025
From: akfrosty at mtaonline.net (JERRY FROST)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2025 23:54:01 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <451f99d8-7194-4640-9888-7a7357c7583b@marc3rd.com>
References: <CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
	<3FBA83CB-A9B9-4CE9-BE9B-745F9110BDD8@comcast.net>
	<1512684608.274126386.1759953540661.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
	<451f99d8-7194-4640-9888-7a7357c7583b@marc3rd.com>
Message-ID: <1591420049.275628858.1759982041919.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>

I could go for Maui in January, maybe one of these coming Winters, depends on how Deb schedules us. I'll mention it to her maybe do some tactical persuading.

Frosty

----- Original Message -----
From: mpa at marc3rd.com
To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2025 1:32:54 PM
Subject: Re: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5

Old and cold here in michigan. 2 months til home in Maui. 
Maybe we should have a hammer in about the end of jan?

?Get BlueMail for Android 

From mpa at marc3rd.com  Thu Oct  9 01:44:21 2025
From: mpa at marc3rd.com (mpa at marc3rd.com)
Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2025 01:44:21 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <1591420049.275628858.1759982041919.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
References: <CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
	<3FBA83CB-A9B9-4CE9-BE9B-745F9110BDD8@comcast.net>
	<1512684608.274126386.1759953540661.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
	<451f99d8-7194-4640-9888-7a7357c7583b@marc3rd.com>
	<1591420049.275628858.1759982041919.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
Message-ID: <848038a6-0e91-4dcc-a703-447064adbcf8@marc3rd.com>

Sounds great uncle Jerry. Glad you're doing well. Hug aunt Deb for me. 

?Get BlueMail for Android ?

On Oct 8, 2025, 11:54?PM, at 11:54?PM, JERRY FROST <akfrosty at mtaonline.net> wrote:
>I could go for Maui in January, maybe one of these coming Winters,
>depends on how Deb schedules us. I'll mention it to her maybe do some
>tactical persuading.
>
>Frosty
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: mpa at marc3rd.com
>To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
>Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2025 1:32:54 PM
>Subject: Re: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
>
>Old and cold here in michigan. 2 months til home in Maui. 
>Maybe we should have a hammer in about the end of jan?
>
>?Get BlueMail for Android 
>______________________________________________________________
>TheForge mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
>
>TheForge mail list group photo site is
>http://www.shutterfly.com
>Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
>Password: anvil
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>Message delivered to mpa at marc3rd.com 

From williamsiron at comcast.net  Thu Oct  9 10:08:18 2025
From: williamsiron at comcast.net (Mark Williams)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2025 10:08:18 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <451f99d8-7194-4640-9888-7a7357c7583b@marc3rd.com>
References: <CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
	<3FBA83CB-A9B9-4CE9-BE9B-745F9110BDD8@comcast.net>
	<1512684608.274126386.1759953540661.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
	<451f99d8-7194-4640-9888-7a7357c7583b@marc3rd.com>
Message-ID: <1444442046.59852.1760018898429@connect.xfinity.com>

If you need something to do in January, come to Maryland's Eastern Shore, Easton, MD to be precise for the Bill Gichner Memorial Hammer-In. It will be 2, 3, & 4 January at Eric Harvey's shop. We're having Drew Alexander as our demonstrator. Don't know a cost but will soon. Check the MASA website.

Mark
Snow Hill, MD
> On 10/08/2025 5:32 PM EDT mpa at marc3rd.com <mpa at marc3rd.com> wrote:
> 
>  
> Old and cold here in michigan. 2 months til home in Maui. 
> Maybe we should have a hammer in about the end of jan?
> 
> ?Get BlueMail for Android ?
> 
> On Oct 8, 2025, 3:59?PM, at 3:59?PM, JERRY FROST <akfrosty at mtaonline.net> wrote:
> >What about laser welders Andy? They HAVE come a long way and in several
> >directions. I'm expecting to see battery powered hand held units any
> >time now. We're getting close to room temperature super conductors and
> >those'll make batteries to make a practical electric airplane doable.
> >
> >What you been up to?
> >
> >I have 2 easy answers for you Craig, hide your 30k machine at my place,
> >there's plenty of space behind the shop and Deb never goes that
> >direction. 
> >
> >Does your wife actually go into your shop? If so it's too clean and
> >quiet, Man cave it Bro!
> >
> >Frosty
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA"
> ><theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> >To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> >Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2025 10:01:05 AM
> >Subject: Re: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
> >
> >Fine here in central Oregon but rarely post. 
> >
> >Wonder how I would hide a $30k machine from my wife??
> >
> >Craig
> >
> >> On Oct 8, 2025, at 10:26?AM, Andrew Vida <impublius at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> 
> >> ?What about laser welders?  Seems they have come a very long way.
> >> 
> >> how's everyone doing?
> >> 
> >>> On Wed, Oct 8, 2025 at 12:00?PM <theforge-request at mailman.qth.net>
> >wrote:
> >>> 
> >______________________________________________________________
> >TheForge mailing list
> >Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> >Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> >Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> >
> >TheForge mail list group photo site is
> >http://www.shutterfly.com
> >Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> >Password: anvil
> >
> >This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> >Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >Message delivered to mpa at marc3rd.com 
> ______________________________________________________________
> TheForge mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> 
> TheForge mail list group photo site is
> http://www.shutterfly.com
> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> Password: anvil
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to williamsiron at comcast.net

From williamsiron at comcast.net  Thu Oct  9 10:10:04 2025
From: williamsiron at comcast.net (Mark Williams)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2025 10:10:04 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <848038a6-0e91-4dcc-a703-447064adbcf8@marc3rd.com>
References: <CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
	<3FBA83CB-A9B9-4CE9-BE9B-745F9110BDD8@comcast.net>
	<1512684608.274126386.1759953540661.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
	<451f99d8-7194-4640-9888-7a7357c7583b@marc3rd.com>
	<1591420049.275628858.1759982041919.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
	<848038a6-0e91-4dcc-a703-447064adbcf8@marc3rd.com>
Message-ID: <343997635.59948.1760019004553@connect.xfinity.com>

Marc,

Are you visiting Allen Park again?

Mark
> On 10/09/2025 1:44 AM EDT mpa at marc3rd.com <mpa at marc3rd.com> wrote:
> 
>  
> Sounds great uncle Jerry. Glad you're doing well. Hug aunt Deb for me. 
> 
> ?Get BlueMail for Android ?
> 
> On Oct 8, 2025, 11:54?PM, at 11:54?PM, JERRY FROST <akfrosty at mtaonline.net> wrote:
> >I could go for Maui in January, maybe one of these coming Winters,
> >depends on how Deb schedules us. I'll mention it to her maybe do some
> >tactical persuading.
> >
> >Frosty
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: mpa at marc3rd.com
> >To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> >Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2025 1:32:54 PM
> >Subject: Re: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
> >
> >Old and cold here in michigan. 2 months til home in Maui. 
> >Maybe we should have a hammer in about the end of jan?
> >
> >?Get BlueMail for Android 
> >______________________________________________________________
> >TheForge mailing list
> >Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> >Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> >Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> >
> >TheForge mail list group photo site is
> >http://www.shutterfly.com
> >Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> >Password: anvil
> >
> >This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> >Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> >Message delivered to mpa at marc3rd.com 
> ______________________________________________________________
> TheForge mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> 
> TheForge mail list group photo site is
> http://www.shutterfly.com
> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> Password: anvil
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to williamsiron at comcast.net

From freemab222 at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 10:14:28 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2025 10:14:28 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <CAJkmkExxrkZQtMPf2m1Vvp0wgaRqUnmZSWSv0+AWGXBBQjf6Dg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJkmkExxrkZQtMPf2m1Vvp0wgaRqUnmZSWSv0+AWGXBBQjf6Dg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUYd4CqCAKYbBsGPvxg4YU06aA7eCLBMZZf-KNpDqZVZhQ@mail.gmail.com>

Bruce
NJ


---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: David Collier <davcollier at gmail.com>
Date: Fri, Sep 12, 2025 at 4:11?PM
Subject: Gichner's Hammer-in

The registration for the Gichner even is now up:
https://www.masasmiths.org/news/

-- 
Dave Collier
Broken Hammer Forge
http://www.brokenhammerforge.com/

From torin at panix.com  Thu Oct  9 12:33:52 2025
From: torin at panix.com (Todd Rich)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2025 16:33:52 +0000 ()
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.11.1759939207.20746.theforge@mailman.qth.net>
	<CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.2510091632050.90@panix2.panix.com>



On Wed, 8 Oct 2025, Andrew Vida wrote:

> What about laser welders?  Seems they have come a very long way.

how's everyone doing?

I've been lusting after a few different models.  Maybe in the next few 
years.

Mostly doing well in Eastern PA, though I seem to have picked up something 
that has made me very weak.  If it is what the neuromuscular specalist 
thinks it is (CIDP - pure motor) there is treatment that should get me 
back up and running at full strength soon.  I should know before the end 
of the year.



From akfrosty at mtaonline.net  Thu Oct  9 13:19:52 2025
From: akfrosty at mtaonline.net (JERRY FROST)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2025 13:19:52 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.2510091632050.90@panix2.panix.com>
References: <mailman.11.1759939207.20746.theforge@mailman.qth.net>
	<CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
	<Pine.NEB.4.64.2510091632050.90@panix2.panix.com>
Message-ID: <606346991.277747750.1760030392528.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>

WOW, the list is coming back to life! All of a sudden folks are posting again, many I haven't heard from in a way too long time. It's funny how that works, I've been hanging out on Iforgeiron for years and recently traffic there has dropped from hundreds of posts a day to 10-15.

Boy you gave me something to look up this morning Todd. It seems myelin related disorders have been increasing in recent years but treatments are being developed. CRSPR is one avenue that's being seriously researched for a number of things and neuro was one. It's been a while since reading about it though you'd think being a TBI survivor neurological issues would stick in what's left of my memory.

I see an old habit is coming back to me. . . Remember to trim your submissions!

Frosty

----- Original Message -----
From: "Todd Rich" <torin at panix.com>
To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Thursday, October 9, 2025 8:33:52 AM
Subject: Re: TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5

On Wed, 8 Oct 2025, Andrew Vida wrote:

> What about laser welders?  Seems they have come a very long way.

how's everyone doing?

I've been lusting after a few different models.  Maybe in the next few 
years.

Mostly doing well in Eastern PA, though I seem to have picked up something 
that has made me very weak.  If it is what the neuromuscular specalist 
thinks it is (CIDP - pure motor) there is treatment that should get me 
back up and running at full strength soon.  I should know before the end 
of the year.



From akfrosty at mtaonline.net  Thu Oct  9 13:36:25 2025
From: akfrosty at mtaonline.net (JERRY FROST)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2025 13:36:25 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5
In-Reply-To: <606346991.277747750.1760030392528.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
References: <mailman.11.1759939207.20746.theforge@mailman.qth.net>
	<CAMAaHg-Hy=YpHu38LZAsoL7M+Uaat7FiSNqux5X02KMcO=zScw@mail.gmail.com>
	<Pine.NEB.4.64.2510091632050.90@panix2.panix.com>
	<606346991.277747750.1760030392528.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
Message-ID: <1594984384.277817052.1760031385869.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>

Oh GREAT! Whoever is list mom would you please delete my double post? 

Frosty The chagrinned. 

----- Original Message -----
From: "JERRY FROST" <akfrosty at mtaonline.net>
To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Thursday, October 9, 2025 9:19:52 AM
Subject: Re: [TheForge] TheForge Digest, Vol 222, Issue 5

WOW, 

From freemab222 at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 19:52:36 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2025 19:52:36 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] Remind me: How does a newcomer subscribe to theForge?
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUZKSw4pSwJP4GRjzTfeogbTAz+Zj6=srnjppfU_4pGb1Q@mail.gmail.com>

I figure it has to do with one of the addresses that appears on the bottom
of each message, but I can't figure out which.  We've got some newbies who
might benefit from the list.

Bruce
NJ

From xlch58 at swbell.net  Thu Oct  9 22:15:42 2025
From: xlch58 at swbell.net (Charles)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2025 02:15:42 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [TheForge] Remind me: How does a newcomer subscribe to theForge?
In-Reply-To: <CAD1TJUZKSw4pSwJP4GRjzTfeogbTAz+Zj6=srnjppfU_4pGb1Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD1TJUZKSw4pSwJP4GRjzTfeogbTAz+Zj6=srnjppfU_4pGb1Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1909450111.1472675.1760062542030@mail.yahoo.com>

 If you click on theForge homepage in the footer of every message it gives you an option of subscribing.? If you know someone that wants to subscribe, forward one of the emails to them.?
Charles(new listmom)
    On Thursday, October 9, 2025 at 06:53:35 PM CDT, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:  
 
 I figure it has to do with one of the addresses that appears on the bottom
of each message, but I can't figure out which.? We've got some newbies who
might benefit from the list.

Bruce
NJ
______________________________________________________________
TheForge mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net

TheForge mail list group photo site is
http://www.shutterfly.com
Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
Password: anvil

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to xlch58 at swbell.net 
  

From freemab222 at gmail.com  Thu Oct  9 22:58:35 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2025 22:58:35 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] Remind me: How does a newcomer subscribe to theForge?
In-Reply-To: <1909450111.1472675.1760062542030@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <CAD1TJUZKSw4pSwJP4GRjzTfeogbTAz+Zj6=srnjppfU_4pGb1Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<1909450111.1472675.1760062542030@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUZ_onVsRu+RBrqz4qWZg+=OvckdeduCtXK1rnawULQY+g@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks.  That's what I needed.

Bruce
NJ

>
>

From MLAWTON38321 at roadrunner.com  Thu Oct  9 23:01:05 2025
From: MLAWTON38321 at roadrunner.com (MLAWTON38321 at roadrunner.com)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2025 03:01:05 +0000
Subject: [TheForge] Remind me: How does a newcomer subscribe to theForge?
Message-ID: <db706fcaaa9f963f3b51e2200f5e1c930afa60ad@webmail>

Please take me off this mailing list.

I do not want to receive anymore.

	-----------------------------------------From: "Charles" 
To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA"
Cc: 
Sent: Thursday October 9 2025 10:16:07PM
Subject: Re: [TheForge] Remind me: How does a newcomer subscribe to
theForge?

 If you click on theForge homepage in the footer of every message it
gives you an option of subscribing. If you know someone that wants to
subscribe, forward one of the emails to them. 
 Charles(new listmom)
 On Thursday, October 9, 2025 at 06:53:35 PM CDT, Bruce  wrote:

 I figure it has to do with one of the addresses that appears on the
bottom
 of each message, but I can't figure out which. We've got some newbies
who
 might benefit from the list.

 Bruce
 NJ
 ______________________________________________________________
 TheForge mailing list
 Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
 /> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
 /> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net

 TheForge mail list group photo site is
 http://www.shutterfly.com [1]
 Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
 Password: anvil

 This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net [2]
 Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
 /> Message delivered to xlch58 at swbell.net

 ______________________________________________________________
 TheForge mailing list
 Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
 /> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
 /> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net

 TheForge mail list group photo site is
 http://www.shutterfly.com [3]
 Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
 Password: anvil

 This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net [4]
 Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
 /> Message delivered to mlawton38321 at roadrunner.com 

Links:
------
[1] http://www.shutterfly.com
[2] http://www.qsl.net
[3] http://www.shutterfly.com
[4] http://www.qsl.net


From mpa at marc3rd.com  Mon Oct 13 00:48:49 2025
From: mpa at marc3rd.com (mpa at marc3rd.com)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2025 00:48:49 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] Remind me: How does a newcomer subscribe to theForge?
In-Reply-To: <CAD1TJUZ_onVsRu+RBrqz4qWZg+=OvckdeduCtXK1rnawULQY+g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD1TJUZKSw4pSwJP4GRjzTfeogbTAz+Zj6=srnjppfU_4pGb1Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<1909450111.1472675.1760062542030@mail.yahoo.com>
	<CAD1TJUZ_onVsRu+RBrqz4qWZg+=OvckdeduCtXK1rnawULQY+g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <036da0b4-cbf9-4926-a404-613403e6bfa7@marc3rd.com>

Hi guys.

Marc of the Hammer

?Get BlueMail for Android ?

On Oct 9, 2025, 10:58?PM, at 10:58?PM, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
>Thanks.  That's what I needed.
>
>Bruce
>NJ
>
>>
>>
>______________________________________________________________
>TheForge mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
>
>TheForge mail list group photo site is
>http://www.shutterfly.com
>Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
>Password: anvil
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>Message delivered to mpa at marc3rd.com 

From akfrosty at mtaonline.net  Mon Oct 13 14:31:21 2025
From: akfrosty at mtaonline.net (JERRY FROST)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2025 14:31:21 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] Remind me: How does a newcomer subscribe to theForge?
In-Reply-To: <036da0b4-cbf9-4926-a404-613403e6bfa7@marc3rd.com>
References: <CAD1TJUZKSw4pSwJP4GRjzTfeogbTAz+Zj6=srnjppfU_4pGb1Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<1909450111.1472675.1760062542030@mail.yahoo.com>
	<CAD1TJUZ_onVsRu+RBrqz4qWZg+=OvckdeduCtXK1rnawULQY+g@mail.gmail.com>
	<036da0b4-cbf9-4926-a404-613403e6bfa7@marc3rd.com>
Message-ID: <1254099586.291126409.1760380281446.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>

All RIGHT! More of the gang is appearing, meeting at the forge so to speak. How the heck are you and what have you been up to?

Frosty

----- Original Message -----
From: "mpa" <mpa at marc3rd.com>
To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2025 8:48:49 PM
Subject: Re: [TheForge] Remind me: How does a newcomer subscribe to theForge?

Hi guys.

Marc of the Hammer

?Get BlueMail for Android 


From freemab222 at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 16:48:09 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2025 16:48:09 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] Remind me: How does a newcomer subscribe to theForge?
In-Reply-To: <1254099586.291126409.1760380281446.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
References: <CAD1TJUZKSw4pSwJP4GRjzTfeogbTAz+Zj6=srnjppfU_4pGb1Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<1909450111.1472675.1760062542030@mail.yahoo.com>
	<CAD1TJUZ_onVsRu+RBrqz4qWZg+=OvckdeduCtXK1rnawULQY+g@mail.gmail.com>
	<036da0b4-cbf9-4926-a404-613403e6bfa7@marc3rd.com>
	<1254099586.291126409.1760380281446.JavaMail.zimbra@mtaonline.net>
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUYso6oQhDqqCENjx_St1WiuTDcc3DzDJ6AVhqQFETTHFQ@mail.gmail.com>

Keeping too busy, but not with blacksmithing.  The last few years have been
dominated by other matters.  I'm in the process of *attempting *to get my
house and shop cleaned up and usable for crafts again.

"Crafts" includes more than blacksmithing.  I took a pottery class this
spring and learned the basics of throwing a pot -- something I'd long
wanted to learn.  Unfortunately I have very limited ability to fire pots,
so am a bit stalled on that aspect.  Most of what I threw and glazed in the
class I've actually put to use, however.

NJBA is doing well. Our member numbers haven't recovered since the
pandemic, but it is growing slowly, mostly without my help.  I've offloaded
the big jobs to others, and just keep my hands in on the mundane stuff that
takes less time.  We'll be at Princeton U. again this coming Saturday,
introducing their students to forging.  (We have six portable forging
stations for this purpose.)  Even heading up that effort I've offloaded on
another NJBA Director, but I will be participating.

This "new computer for Windows 11" mandate has wasted a bunch of my time
and money.  I gave in and just bought a minicomputer with Windows 11 pro,
but without MS Office, so I've started looking for alternatives to that.
(I Hate Microsoft!)  I need to transfer files from the old computer(s) to
the new one and am working on that, hoping to enlist the brains at the
local (computer-oriented) Makerspace on some technical questions.

Never got a garden in last spring, due to other stuff.  I'm hoping to
change my front and side lawns away from grass next spring, and maybe into
a flower meadow.  Too soon by far to tell.  (I also hate mowing lawns.)  I
may try alternative crop plants, especially those that are also ornamental
like amaranth, as well as whatever perennials that seem likely.

I hope the rest of you are doing okay.

Bruce
NJ

From freemab222 at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 13:59:50 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2025 13:59:50 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] OLD bridge collapse north of Baltimore
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUbDDJqj87qT8g6yi8n3ObYRZu4BTGejb3Xf4KcpcoMDPQ@mail.gmail.com>

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E1MUxI3nlk

Looks like a riveted construction.  Whaddaya wanna bet it's wrought iron?
Anyone care to salvage it?  I doubt it will be renovated again, more likely
replaced with some pre-fab.

Bruce
NJ

From lp.brown at verizon.net  Sun Oct 26 20:28:05 2025
From: lp.brown at verizon.net (LAWRENCE BROWN)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2025 20:28:05 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] OLD bridge collapse north of Baltimore
In-Reply-To: <CAD1TJUbDDJqj87qT8g6yi8n3ObYRZu4BTGejb3Xf4KcpcoMDPQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD1TJUbDDJqj87qT8g6yi8n3ObYRZu4BTGejb3Xf4KcpcoMDPQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9F883A10-212F-4861-A7AD-CBDECD4C233C@verizon.net>

The original bridge would have definitely been wrought, when they re did it anything changed would not be. Comment say that a road crew attached a cable to the tree for some reason and as the bridge failed it pulled the tree down(tree looks dead).. Driver should get new underwear and pants!
Have a battery powered sawsall? I wonder if they finished inspecting it?
Larry

> On Oct 26, 2025, at 1:59?PM, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E1MUxI3nlk
> 
> Looks like a riveted construction.  Whaddaya wanna bet it's wrought iron?
> Anyone care to salvage it?  I doubt it will be renovated again, more likely
> replaced with some pre-fab.
> 
> Bruce
> NJ
> ______________________________________________________________
> TheForge mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
> 
> TheForge mail list group photo site is
> http://www.shutterfly.com
> Login: blacksmithblacksmith at hotmail.com
> Password: anvil
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to lp.brown at verizon.net


From mspencer at tallships.ca  Mon Oct 27 02:34:43 2025
From: mspencer at tallships.ca (Mike Spencer)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2025 03:34:43 -0300
Subject: [TheForge]  Re: OLD bridge collapse north of Baltimore
In-Reply-To: <9F883A10-212F-4861-A7AD-CBDECD4C233C@verizon.net> (message from
	LAWRENCE BROWN via TheForge on Sun, 26 Oct 2025 20:28:05 -0400)
References: <CAD1TJUbDDJqj87qT8g6yi8n3ObYRZu4BTGejb3Xf4KcpcoMDPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<9F883A10-212F-4861-A7AD-CBDECD4C233C@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <202510270634.59R6YhTT000376@enoch.nodomain.nowhere>


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E1MUxI3nlk

There was a bridge of similar age, size and construction in Petite
Riviere, NS, also surely old enough to be wrought iron -- 1880s I think.

In 2002, a log truck with an unsecured hydraulic loading boom rounded
the sharp curve just before the bridge and entered the bridge's single
lane.  The boom swung around and trashed one of the trusses.  Bridge
and truck ended up in the Petite River.  Driver unharmed, alert
passer-by spotted a rowboat nearby and rescued the driver.

That interrupted a lot of local traffic.  The work-around was a
narrow, poorly maintained gravel road along the edge of a ravine with
no guard rails and too narrow for two full-sized cars to pass
abreast.  For something like a year, there were temporary traffic
lights at either end of that bypass.

I tried to get a few pieces of the smaller components to make some
souvenirs for friends but the entire wreckage was moved to a
provincial highway dept. staging area.  They didn't want to part with
a single piece until the investigating engineers had done their thing.
The resulting red tape was more than I wanted to cope with.

There are probably pics on the web if you gwgl enough.

From williamsiron at comcast.net  Mon Oct 27 09:41:21 2025
From: williamsiron at comcast.net (Mark Williams)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2025 09:41:21 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] OLD bridge collapse north of Baltimore
In-Reply-To: <202510270634.59R6YhTT000376@enoch.nodomain.nowhere>
References: <CAD1TJUbDDJqj87qT8g6yi8n3ObYRZu4BTGejb3Xf4KcpcoMDPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<9F883A10-212F-4861-A7AD-CBDECD4C233C@verizon.net>
	<202510270634.59R6YhTT000376@enoch.nodomain.nowhere>
Message-ID: <866588946.290577.1761572481238@connect.xfinity.com>

The bridge in MD was built in 1879 so likely wrought iron. It was upgraded in 2006 but doubt the wrought iron went away. You could contact either the county or the state to see about getting part of it.

Mark 
Snow Hill, MD
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From freemab222 at gmail.com  Mon Oct 27 10:07:29 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2025 10:07:29 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] OLD bridge collapse north of Baltimore
In-Reply-To: <9F883A10-212F-4861-A7AD-CBDECD4C233C@verizon.net>
References: <CAD1TJUbDDJqj87qT8g6yi8n3ObYRZu4BTGejb3Xf4KcpcoMDPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<9F883A10-212F-4861-A7AD-CBDECD4C233C@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUYDdpLUsFsga3vq1PFi9LYAU+gROfzgbmMg4G+JckmTuQ@mail.gmail.com>

Better bring an A/C sawsall and a generator.  I think I'll leave the task
to younger folks -- who have the equipment to haul it all away.  I just
hope any wrought iron gets distributed to those who appreciate it.  Still,
one of us (not me) could put in a bid for the removal and "disposal" of the
wrecked bridge and we could hire contractors to do the actual work.

WHY would there have been a cable to the tree?  If that be true, then maybe
the truck really was overweight for the bridge and the driver will need new
underwear and a new job.

Bruce
NJ


On Sun, Oct 26, 2025 at 8:38?PM LAWRENCE BROWN via TheForge <
theforge at mailman.qth.net> wrote:

> The original bridge would have definitely been wrought, when they re did
> it anything changed would not be. Comment say that a road crew attached a
> cable to the tree for some reason and as the bridge failed it pulled the
> tree down(tree looks dead).. Driver should get new underwear and pants!
> Have a battery powered sawsall? I wonder if they finished inspecting it?
> Larry
>
> > On Oct 26, 2025, at 1:59?PM, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E1MUxI3nlk
> >
> > Looks like a riveted construction.  Whaddaya wanna bet it's wrought iron?
> > Anyone care to salvage it?  I doubt it will be renovated again, more
> likely
> > replaced with some pre-fab.
> >
> > Bruce
> > NJ
> > ______________________________________________________________
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From mikemastrangelo100 at gmail.com  Mon Oct 27 10:25:41 2025
From: mikemastrangelo100 at gmail.com (Mike Mastrangelo)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2025 09:25:41 -0500
Subject: [TheForge] OLD bridge collapse north of Baltimore
In-Reply-To: <866588946.290577.1761572481238@connect.xfinity.com>
References: <CAD1TJUbDDJqj87qT8g6yi8n3ObYRZu4BTGejb3Xf4KcpcoMDPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<9F883A10-212F-4861-A7AD-CBDECD4C233C@verizon.net>
	<202510270634.59R6YhTT000376@enoch.nodomain.nowhere>
	<866588946.290577.1761572481238@connect.xfinity.com>
Message-ID: <CADLF=EDKk35eZOmo00Gu8tpY6Wdye6dEHMiTRgWmrC+pegsJTQ@mail.gmail.com>

There was a somewhat analogous situation down here in Texas a while back.
The USS Texas Battleship's engines were beginning to drop through the deck.
The state agency overseeing that state park hired a contractor to lift the
engines and replace the deck with modern steel. A local blacksmith
organization contacted the state agency about the 'scrap'.

The agency agreed to let local blacksmiths pick through the scrap - on
condition that they used half of what they took to make items that could be
used for sale to help fund the restoration. I believe that there was
another iteration of this to help with the current restoration.

On Mon, Oct 27, 2025 at 8:41?AM Mark Williams via TheForge <
theforge at mailman.qth.net> wrote:

> The bridge in MD was built in 1879 so likely wrought iron. It was upgraded
> in 2006 but doubt the wrought iron went away. You could contact either the
> county or the state to see about getting part of it.
>
> Mark
> Snow Hill, MD
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > TheForge mailing list
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From freemab222 at gmail.com  Mon Oct 27 14:14:10 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2025 14:14:10 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] "Free" coal?
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUawZNsRaoMK9dMDtPDLQP=vZKPb-tdMFQnBzDTFm48Oug@mail.gmail.com>

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drX-3hxGHRY

Wait for CSX to finish their work.  Then discretely go glean the coal they
couldn't be bothered about

Bruce
NJ

From lp.brown at verizon.net  Mon Oct 27 15:29:49 2025
From: lp.brown at verizon.net (LAWRENCE BROWN)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2025 15:29:49 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] "Free" coal?
In-Reply-To: <CAD1TJUawZNsRaoMK9dMDtPDLQP=vZKPb-tdMFQnBzDTFm48Oug@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD1TJUawZNsRaoMK9dMDtPDLQP=vZKPb-tdMFQnBzDTFm48Oug@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E431312F-ECBD-49BF-B2A0-7B67BC435D00@verizon.net>

I don?t think they?d miss a few shovels worth!

> On Oct 27, 2025, at 2:14?PM, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drX-3hxGHRY
> 
> Wait for CSX to finish their work.  Then discretely go glean the coal they
> couldn't be bothered about
> 
> Bruce
> NJ
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From williamsiron at comcast.net  Mon Oct 27 20:36:05 2025
From: williamsiron at comcast.net (Mark Williams)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2025 20:36:05 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [TheForge] "Free" coal?
In-Reply-To: <CAD1TJUawZNsRaoMK9dMDtPDLQP=vZKPb-tdMFQnBzDTFm48Oug@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD1TJUawZNsRaoMK9dMDtPDLQP=vZKPb-tdMFQnBzDTFm48Oug@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1375790388.312338.1761611765883@connect.xfinity.com>

You might want to find out where the coal was to be used. Power plant coal is not very useful for blacksmithing, too many clinkers and not much coke.

Mark Williams
Snow Hill, MD
> On 10/27/2025 2:14 PM EDT Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>  
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drX-3hxGHRY
> 
> Wait for CSX to finish their work.  Then discretely go glean the coal they
> couldn't be bothered about
> 
> Bruce
> NJ
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From freemab222 at gmail.com  Tue Oct 28 01:08:15 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2025 01:08:15 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] "Free" coal?
In-Reply-To: <E431312F-ECBD-49BF-B2A0-7B67BC435D00@verizon.net>
References: <CAD1TJUawZNsRaoMK9dMDtPDLQP=vZKPb-tdMFQnBzDTFm48Oug@mail.gmail.com>
	<E431312F-ECBD-49BF-B2A0-7B67BC435D00@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUaS7rpKB4aF5o57hXrdwTuv1jbXUj9DXT9U_eZjwRKeyw@mail.gmail.com>

You can bet they're not going to clean up *every *piece.

Bruce
NJ


On Mon, Oct 27, 2025 at 3:30?PM LAWRENCE BROWN via TheForge <
theforge at mailman.qth.net> wrote:

> I don?t think they?d miss a few shovels worth!
>
> > On Oct 27, 2025, at 2:14?PM, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drX-3hxGHRY
> >
> > Wait for CSX to finish their work.  Then discretely go glean the coal
> they
> > couldn't be bothered about
> >
> > Bruce
> > NJ
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > TheForge mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
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From mpa at marc3rd.com  Tue Oct 28 03:59:57 2025
From: mpa at marc3rd.com (mpa at marc3rd.com)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2025 03:59:57 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] (no subject)
Message-ID: <68eab47a-702a-4a1b-8cec-825ec76160f9@marc3rd.com>



?Get BlueMail for Android ?

From mpa at marc3rd.com  Tue Oct 28 04:02:14 2025
From: mpa at marc3rd.com (mpa at marc3rd.com)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2025 04:02:14 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] "Free" coal?
In-Reply-To: <CAD1TJUaS7rpKB4aF5o57hXrdwTuv1jbXUj9DXT9U_eZjwRKeyw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAD1TJUawZNsRaoMK9dMDtPDLQP=vZKPb-tdMFQnBzDTFm48Oug@mail.gmail.com>
	<E431312F-ECBD-49BF-B2A0-7B67BC435D00@verizon.net>
	<CAD1TJUaS7rpKB4aF5o57hXrdwTuv1jbXUj9DXT9U_eZjwRKeyw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1fead664-c805-4948-9b0e-356dab4ae6e2@marc3rd.com>

I get so much of it in my stocking every year....

?Get BlueMail for Android ?

On Oct 28, 2025, 1:08?AM, at 1:08?AM, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
>You can bet they're not going to clean up *every *piece.
>
>Bruce
>NJ
>
>
>On Mon, Oct 27, 2025 at 3:30?PM LAWRENCE BROWN via TheForge <
>theforge at mailman.qth.net> wrote:
>
>> I don?t think they?d miss a few shovels worth!
>>
>> > On Oct 27, 2025, at 2:14?PM, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drX-3hxGHRY
>> >
>> > Wait for CSX to finish their work.  Then discretely go glean the
>coal
>> they
>> > couldn't be bothered about
>> >
>> > Bruce
>> > NJ
>> > ______________________________________________________________
>> > TheForge mailing list
>> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
>> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> > Post: mailto:TheForge at mailman.qth.net
>> >
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>> > http://www.shutterfly.com
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>> > Password: anvil
>> >
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>> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> > Message delivered to lp.brown at verizon.net
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
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>______________________________________________________________
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From freemab222 at gmail.com  Tue Oct 28 09:00:16 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2025 09:00:16 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] "Free" coal?
In-Reply-To: <1fead664-c805-4948-9b0e-356dab4ae6e2@marc3rd.com>
References: <CAD1TJUawZNsRaoMK9dMDtPDLQP=vZKPb-tdMFQnBzDTFm48Oug@mail.gmail.com>
	<E431312F-ECBD-49BF-B2A0-7B67BC435D00@verizon.net>
	<CAD1TJUaS7rpKB4aF5o57hXrdwTuv1jbXUj9DXT9U_eZjwRKeyw@mail.gmail.com>
	<1fead664-c805-4948-9b0e-356dab4ae6e2@marc3rd.com>
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUaBFiJ=bvcnU4cTFt0FmLs6FcbhEpkypWzKB=Y_B-bKKQ@mail.gmail.com>

That comes from being very, very bad!  (I don't want to know what "treats"
you leave out for Santa Claus.  Probably kefir and raw broccoli and flyers
on how to lose weight.)

Bruce
NJ


On Tue, Oct 28, 2025 at 4:03?AM mpa at marc3rd.com <mpa at marc3rd.com> wrote:

> I get so much of it in my stocking every year....
>
> ?Get BlueMail for Android ?
>
> On Oct 28, 2025, 1:08?AM, at 1:08?AM, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >You can bet they're not going to clean up *every *piece.
> >
> >Bruce
> >NJ
> >
> >
> >On Mon, Oct 27, 2025 at 3:30?PM LAWRENCE BROWN via TheForge <
> >theforge at mailman.qth.net> wrote:
> >
> >> I don?t think they?d miss a few shovels worth!
> >>
> >> > On Oct 27, 2025, at 2:14?PM, Bruce <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drX-3hxGHRY
> >> >
> >> > Wait for CSX to finish their work.  Then discretely go glean the
> >coal
> >> they
> >> > couldn't be bothered about
> >> >
> >> > Bruce
> >> > NJ
> >> > ______________________________________________________________
> >> > TheForge mailing list
> >> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/theforge
> >> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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> >> >
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> >>
> >> ______________________________________________________________
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> >>
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> >> Password: anvil
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> >> Message delivered to freemab222 at gmail.com
> >______________________________________________________________
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From freemab222 at gmail.com  Tue Oct 28 22:05:45 2025
From: freemab222 at gmail.com (Bruce)
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2025 22:05:45 -0400
Subject: [TheForge] Grasshopper Treadle Hammer Plans Online?
Message-ID: <CAD1TJUa8NK+SivVxA5F=Y1uCrqP72v8_KheBFizCOBRgrn_wDA@mail.gmail.com>

Some of you may remember my Grasshopper Treadle Hammer.  Back a decade or
more, I sold plans for this hammer via ebay.  I quit doing that because I
couldn't even break even on it.  (It's about 120 pages and I sold it in a
binder.)
I'm thinking of posting it online for viewing and there are a couple
considerations I need mull over before I could do that.

   1. Should I revise the plans first, and, if so, how?  When I designed
   this treadle hammer, I did not myself know how to weld.  Accordingly, some
   of the assembly is by screws and bolts, and some of these might better be
   welded.  In principal, I could modify all relevant drawings to indicate
   welds, but this could take a long time to accomplish as it would be a fair
   investment in time (always short).  Alternatively, I could annotate where
   welding be recommended in lieu of the indicated fasteners, either on the
   drawings themselves, or on a separate sheet listing such changes, the
   latter being the least work & time required.
   2. Where could I post it?  Perhaps on my Grasshopper webpage -- if it
   can accept this quantity of drawings.  Perhaps in Google Docs, in which
   case I'd want some way of limiting access to read-only. (I think that can
   be done, but haven't used Gdocs enough to know.)

What do you think?

Bruce
NJ

