[TheForge] Making needles?

Mon Oct 14 18:14:18 EDT 2013

Haw< I'm with you Jerry.
Toby Hickman ( power hammer master) told me a story about an employee in his shop.
He said the guy was smart and talented, but was a compulsive tool maker.
Toby would give him a 20 minute forging job,
and 2 hours later, the guy was just finishing up the tooling for the one-off job.
Toby said he eventually had to fire him.

On Oct 14, 2013, at 3:04 PM, Jerry Frost wrote:

$5.00 each! Yikes, last I bought cost less than that a packet, 6 I think.
There are or were lots of places here that carried them from hardware stores
to sewing stores and leather stores. I'll have to call around and find out,
I may be sitting on a gold mine!

The triangular leather needles are sharp as can be but the reason for
triangular is they make holes in leather much easier than round needles,
only the corners rub.

My next thought, right after sending my last post was making guide blocks.
Drill between two steel blocks very slightly smaller than the needle Dia.
Just put a sheet of typewriter paper between the blocks then drill. Sand the
grooves lightly so they don't damage the needle with sharp edges. This will
let the blocks clamp the needle solidly without damaging it. Then drill a
hole perpendicular between the blocks a little larger than the punch, go all
the way through so the slug will drop out.

If you want to get fancy, drill and tap the blocks so you can screw the
clamp tight and it'll stay indexed.

Jer

-----Original Message-----
From: theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bruce .
Sent: Sunday, October 13, 2013 8:20 PM
To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA
Subject: Re: [TheForge] Making needles?

Jerry,
That would be the answer if those damned needles were reasonably priced --
like, if I could find them in a local store.  The cheapest I can find
anything that meets the description is $5 EACH (as compared to about $1 each
for a high quality sewing machine needle).  I can do as well to buy the
entire sewing awl kit at Harbor Freight (though the points may need
sharpening).

BTW, I cut off the needle I'm using now.  Breaking was an option, but
without knowing how brittle the needle was, and especially since the shank
is not round, but is slotted (for the thread), cutting was the better
option.

What I'm really looking for is a shortcut for centering a punch on a wire.
A V-block could come into play, but there's still the need to align the
punch.  No doubt I could figure out how to do this, but I wondered whether
the approach was already known.

The best idea I've had so far:  Clamp two metal blocks together and drill a
small hole along the seam.  Separate the blocks.  Through one of them, drill
a (larger?) hole centered on the seam and perpendicular to it.  Then make a
centerpunch to fit the larger hole.  Clamp wire into the pair of blocks,
insert centerpunch, and give it a whack.

Still, I'd rather do this without making custom tooling, if possible.

On Sun, Oct 13, 2013 at 11:42 PM, Jerry Frost <akfrosty at mtaonline.net>wrote:

> Sorry Bruce, I just realized you said you only need a couple few needles.
> Buy Speedystitch needles and trim them to fit. Snap them or use a 
> Dremel size abrasive cutoff.
> 
> http://www.speedystitcher.com/
> 
> I've had mine for probably 50 years, it's de bomb.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net 
> [mailto:theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bruce .
> Sent: Sunday, October 13, 2013 5:30 PM
> To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA
> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Making needles?
> 
> Actually, here's an even better video on needlemaking, as it shows 
> much more about how the tooling is made and used.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxmJ167obYw
> 
> And here's an article about the largely hand methods used in the 19th
> century:
> 
> http://www.interweave.com/needle/projects/Needlemaking-Article.pdf
> 
> 
> On Sun, Oct 13, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bruce . <freemab222 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> I need a few needles of dimensions I can't find commercially.  The 
>> application is a sewing pliers (US Patent 1,352,508).  I have one of 
>> these pliers and it's great for repairing those damned silly running 
>> shoes you can't seem to avoid these past forty or so years.
>> 
>> The needle needs to be about 1" long, maybe 1.25", "heavy" thickness 
>> (equivalent to a #8 Tandy sewing-awl needle).  Therein lies the rub 
>> -- cutting off the commercial needle to an appropriate length gives 
>> a needle that isn't quite appropriate for mounting in the sewing pliers.
>> I have done this and it can be made to work, but such commercial 
>> needles are not cheap and I'd prefer to make my own than to pay the 
>> price for what ends up being a second-rate needle.
>> 
>> (BTW, sewing-machine needles seem all to be too long and too thin, 
>> though I'm looking into them further.)
>> 
>> Now, commercial needles are made like this:
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZJPpuL2sqQ
>> 
>> In my case, I needn't follow exactly this procedure (even omitting 
>> the machines), but I think the stamping approach to making the eyes 
>> might be the most feasible, if reduced to hand-scale.  I envision 
>> partially flattening the end of a (round) wire, then centerpunching 
>> enough to mark and spread the flat, and either punching it through 
>> or drilling it through.  This would result in a large round hole, 
>> which could be cleaned internally of burrs, then "flattened" 
>> laterally to produce the traditional long, narrow needle eye.
>> 
>> So the question come down to:  How to centerpunch a small, partially 
>> flattened wire such that the punch is exactly centered?  Seems to me 
>> that jigs would be needed, and I haven't figured out simple jigs 
>> that would work.  Ideas would be welcome.
>> 
>> I've considered, but haven't tried, starting with oversized wire and 
>> puncing an eye in that (presumably easier than smaller stuff), then 
>> grinding or filing off the excess.  I've considered folding over the 
>> end and welding it to itself to make the eye.  These both seem like 
>> a lot of extra work.
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Bruce
>> NJ
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Bruce
> NJ
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--
Bruce
NJ
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