[TheForge] tig welding, 18 gauge 316 stainless steel, chemical fume hood

Sat Jun 30 10:47:39 EDT 2012

I dont do the actual sanitary pipe welding- my buddy is certified for that- but I am working with him again on Monday, I will quiz him on the settings. I know he does use the pulse settings for stainless.

ries

On Jun 29, 2012, at 9:58 PM, Robert J Hill wrote:

> Ries,
> Are you using pulse?  If so what are the settings?  I have pulse on my  
> work machine but I really don't think I have the real grasp of it and  
> its benefits.
> Thanks,
> Rob
> 
> On Jun 29, 2012, at 12:10, Ries Niemi wrote:
> 
> 
> On Jun 29, 2012, at 11:44 AM, terry l. ridder wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 0. just how difficult is it to work with 18 gauge 316 stainless steel?
>> need to be able to make bends, roll it, etc.
>> 1. knowing that it depends on the individual who would be learning to
>> tig weld, what is a good average length of time for the training?
>> 2. would taking a community college course work in tig welding be
>> sufficient for what needs to be done?
>> 3. what training would members of theforge recommend?
>> 
>> please feel free to provide insights that you may have.
>> 
>> -- 
>> terry l. ridder ><>
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> 
> 
> Stainless steel is tough, as opposed to "hard", but its pretty hard to  
> work with as a result.
> 
> 18 gage SS is a LOT harder to form than 18 gage mild, and you really  
> need some pretty beefy machines to work with it.
> Many of the sheet metal tools, like brakes or rolls, that are rated  
> for 16 gage mild, theoretically will work 18 gage SS, but in reality,  
> are usually too lightweight.
> 
> When you double the thickness of sheet metal, you quadruple the force  
> required to bend it.
> 
> I frequently work with 18ga stainless- and I use a 12gage brake to do  
> it, and a similar rated set of rolls. Both of which are 4 times the  
> weight, mass, and price, of those cheapo chinese 16 gage brakes and  
> rolls. Actually, 4 times is probably not enough, in terms of cost.
> 
> So, unless you are going to be doing a lot of stainless fab, for quite  
> a while, you are going to want to outsource the bending and rolling  
> and punching- The basic tools to do this are just too big, and too  
> expensive, to justify for one job. A good 4' 12 gage finger brake can  
> easily run 4 to 7 grand, the rolls more like 6 grand and up, and on  
> down the line.
> 
> As for the tig welding-
> Tig welding is a hand/eye art. Some people take to it like fish to  
> water. Some people NEVER learn.
> You either can, or you cant.
> I have hired probably 20 guys and gals over the years as full time tig  
> welders. I prefer to have somebody with a 2 year welding degree- those  
> people, of course, are fluent in oxy-fuel, stick, mig, and plasma  
> cutting as well as tig- but the skills all buttress each other, and  
> are all complimentary. That said, a "natural" could probably learn tig  
> welding from a cold start in a 3 month, full time class.
> 
> 18 gage stainless is very tricky to butt weld. Its thin, and easy to  
> melt. Newer technology machines help a lot, though- for somebody who  
> doesnt have a few years of tig welding under their belt, I would  
> absolutely recommend a very good welding machine- preferably a new  
> Miller with pulse, like a Dynasty 200DX. Yep, them puppies cost around  
> 5 grand, new. But for thin stainless, that pulse feature is the bee's  
> knees.
> It makes a huge difference.
> I have recently been helping a buddy doing brewery work- all the  
> welding is on 16 gage, schedule 10 stainless pipe, and every weld must  
> be perfect. He is a certified sanitary pipe welder, and he does  
> amazing welds with the Dynasty. It still takes us a long time, is  
> expensive and fussy, and we still screw up from time to time and have  
> to scrap stuff. And between the two of us, we have been working with  
> stainless for well over 25 years of accumulated experience.
> 
> Now, all that said, if you have somebody who is a good welder, and can  
> weld oxy-fuel well, they can probably pick up tig welding stainless in  
> a class. How long depends on the quality of the instruction, and the  
> natural ability of the welder, but I kinda doubt its gonna be a few  
> days.
> 
> And if you buy a good tig welding machine, and use a design that uses  
> overlap welds, backing plates and angles, you should be able to fab up  
> the 18 gage. It wont look beautiful til you do it for a couple of  
> years, but it should be fume proof and sturdy.
> 
> But send out the bending and forming and punching- thats another 2-5  
> year learning curve, and cheap tools are only going to drive you  
> crazy. A decent sheet metal shop to fab 18 gage SS can easily run 30  
> to 50 thousand dollars in tools.
> 
> ries
> 
> 
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