[TheForge] shop power

[Ron Childers]

An open neutral wreaks all manner of havoc. Power company put in a new
transformer, finally moved the transformer very close to the house, all
to no avail, Screwed up my Miller 185 mig welder, a grinder, TV, pump,
etc. I hired my own electrician and he found the problem in their supply
line. The power co paid for my damages.
 

-----Original Message-----
From: theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of CGRAF
Sent: Friday, August 03, 2012 10:56 AM
To: Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA
Subject: Re: [TheForge] shop power

This is one of those problems with multiple possible causes.
All of them lead to too little supply for the total load on the circuit.
I think spending a few bucks having a competent electrician, on site to
diagnose the problem is probably money well spent.

My money is on the supply wire being over loaded.
Breaker is not kicking out (Circuit is not over loaded) and it is only
the shop lights that dim? (Ample power in the house ) The only
difference so far is how far the power needs to travel in whatever size
wire.  But then again I am a tinner, so take that analysis for what it
is worth.

An electrician will spot oddball stuff that could also cause the
problem.
I had one recently , someone had put too much on a neutral line. The
electrician came in opened ONE box and went to the circuit breaker. He
asked me how many wires in the 4X4 and their colors. On my end 1 Black 1
blue one brown and one white. His response? "I've got 2 whites on this
end."

That one "brown wire was the neutral for most of the house and was
burning up. Problem solved.

On another occasion the upstairs TV in a customers house would shut down
every time the downstairs furnace came on. (Two separate electric
circuit boxes) The home owner /handyman had done a rewire of his
workshop. The neutral servicing the TV room outlet on the second floor
ended up going to the neutral bar THROUGH the windings of the furnace
motor. I am just glad that both the TV and furnace were on the same leg.

Again this is not the type of thing that one would expect. Most of us
haven't the attuned perception to call the problem out.

Mike Graf


On 8/3/2012 9:26 AM, Rob Fertner wrote:
> He may have an overloaded circuit. Before I got my kitchen remodeled, 
> I would do my grinding, cutting in the garage and every so often I 
> would trip the breaker. The power would go out in the garage, kitchen,

> dining room, and living room. During the remodel, the electrician put 
> in a new breaker box and put in new circuit line for the kitchen and 
> dining room. Now I don't trip the breaker working in the garage. His 
> shop may be sharing a breaker with room(s) in his house and that's too

> much of a load, especially if he his wiring is not big enough.
> Just a thought.
>
> Rob
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net 
> [mailto:theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bob Ehrenberger
> Sent: Friday, August 03, 2012 8:44 AM
> To: theforge
> Subject: Re: [TheForge] shop power
>
> Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2012 07:47:58 -0400
> From: "Ron Childers" <ron at munlaw.net>
> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Light bulbs and shop power
> To: "Blacksmithing List Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>

> Back on topic: The shop lights go very dim every time a friend turns 
> on a grinder in his shop which is over 100 feet from the house. The 
> wiring to the shop is fed from the house and there is no drop box. My 
> guess is the wire is too small to carry the load that far. If someone 
> honks down on the abrasive cut-off saw it trips a breaker in the 
> house. It is an electrician's nightmare that was there when he bought 
> the house and so far is only annoying, but does anyone know of this 
> kind of situation causing a fire? I think it needs heavier copper wire
and a drop box.
> Also, I don't know the amperage of the breaker. I used #6 and don't 
> have that situation.  I feel a bit uneasy about this but need to 
> justify my concerns before beating him up about it. Does anyone have 
> some words of wisdom? Thanx, Ron
>
> ----Reply----
>
> It kind of depends on what he uses his shop for.  If it is just a 
> hobby and he just spends time out there on occasion, he could probably
put up with it.
>
> If he wants his shop to support a business, he should put the money 
> into providing good power. When I built my shop I had them put in a 
> drop/meter for it.  This not only protects the house from surges in 
> the shop, it also makes it easy to claim the power used in the shop on
my taxes.
>
> On a similar note, we just got our first power bill since putting an 
> AC unit in the house. It only added about $20 to cool the house during

> one of the worst heat waves ever (20 days in July over 100).  I was 
> concerned, to say the least.
>
> Robert Ehrenberger
> Shelbyville, Mo.
> eforge at centurytel.net
>
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