[TheForge] NJ Fairgrounds - Attn: Phlip

[Saint Phlip]

On 3/1/07, Dave Mudge <dave at magichammer.net> wrote:
> > I realize that, too. Thing is, if Dave's negative attitude is typical
> > of the Board, then that's a prime reason why we aren't having a
> > conference in 2008. "No way we can do it, so no way it can be done".
>
> ..........'scuse me? how many board members have you actually talked
> to? All of their contact info is on the web site. How many have given
> you any feed back? enough said.
> The "prime reason " as you put it that we are not having a conference
> is that we made no money from the last conference. period.

You and Clare, so far, that I know of.

> > Well, despite this, I am going forward, and seeing if I, knowing
> > little of the specific details they seem to be bogged down in, can
> > find a way to do it.
>
> ..........We are not bogged down in any small details. The ingredients
> for a conference are money, time and local support. We ran out of all
> of those.

Yep. Mere details ;-D

> >Yes, I'm quite well aware of Tom Clark's efforts-
> > I'd like to meet that man, because he's got the sort of "can do"
> > attitude this effort needs.
>
> .......... Rather than re-inventing the wheel (as the board is so
> often accused of) You would probably do better to offer your support
> to Tom Clark and Bill Calloway. They both have first hand knowledge of
> what it really takes to put on a conference. They want to do it in
> Missouri. I think that is a good idea.

Seriously considering that.

> > Thing is, though, Dave's "taste" is only coming when he can use it to
> > tell me it's impossible- and several of his "impossibilities" I've
> > addressed in previous posts. OTOH, getting the information I need to
> > start figuring this out is like pulling teeth. But, as long as he's
> > giving me information when he's giving the negatives, I'm going to
> > take his lemons, and forget the lemonade, I'm going to make lemon
> > frappe ;-)
>
> ........... Wait a minute, you are the woman who said that you could
> put on an ABANA conference for way under $100k. I have given you a lot
> more information than you ever thought of and now you are saying that
> I am only giving you a "taste". You said that you already knew how to
> do it.

No, you've given me objections to all my ideas, which incidently
contain useful information. But, I kinda look at this like buying a
car. Yes, I can buy a car. Now, I need to know what car to buy, and
work down to little details like trim and what style of radio you
want. But, it all satarts with deciding to buy a car in the first
place.

> > > Stop overlaying psychic/emotional flack on the problem.
> > > Gather all the info possible, shed the emotive obfuscations, and
> > > we will all poke at it till damn well it cooperates.....pf
> >
> > Unfortunately, there IS emotion involved, but I'm reminded of one of
> > those annoying sales slogans I got bombarded with back when I was in
> > sales:
> >
> > "Direct your thoughts,
> > Control your emotions,
> > Ordain your destiny."
> >
> > I seriously believe we're at a fork in the road, folks. If we quit on
> > trying to get a conference set up, than we've taken a big step down
> > the road towards letting ABANA die.

>
> Both Clare and I have told you why there is not going to be a 2008
> conference in New York.

Yep. And I'm betting you'd change your minds, if it got handed to you,
"Here it is, all you need to do is show up- and pay the admission fee,
of course, just like everyone else." Well, maybe not- ABANA board
members apparently get in free.

> >Granted, that's no real disaster
> > in the Grand Scheme of Things, but it will be a serious inconvenience
> > later, when we rediscover that a National Organization has its
> > definite uses.
>
> .......... OK, "no real disaster" OK that is the straw that broke the
> camel's back..

It isn't. A corporation is a legal entity, with many of the legal
rights of human beings, but it is still a thing, not a person.
Something like ABANA is needed, but that doesn't mean ABANA, as it is
now is needed.

> >I realize ABANA isn't perfect, but I'm hoping its flaws
> > are fizable. I'm wlling to try to help save it, but if the negatives
> > I'm getting are typical of the attitude of the entire Board, I'm
> > wondering if it's worth doing.
> >They asked for help-

> .........Although Clare did ask for input, she did not direct anyone
> to put together a conference proposal.

Nope. And I'm not actually putting one together. But, there's no
reason I can't construct a virtual conference to look at closely, to
see better how all the pieces need to work together.

> >I'm trying to give
> > it- starting with a suggestion they poll the membership, and find out
> > what WE want in a conference. Yet, I see them taking no steps towards
> > doing that, or anything else except saying it can't be done, as
> > expressed by Dave.
>
> ..........In each conference registration pack, there is a feed back
> questionnaire. Each attendee can fill out the questionnaire and let us
> know what they liked and didn't like and offer suggestions for
> improvement. You would know that if you had ever been to an ABANA
> conference. That constitutes a pole of the people that actually attend
> the conference.

Nope, never been to a conference. Never sat and gossiped with Steve
Kayne, and showed him how I set up one of his cheap Czech hammers, or
sat and watched a bunch of guys smithing in a couple feet of water,
and harpooning inflatable orcas. Nope, never sat with an Australian
aborigine artist, and listened to a sory as he played his digereedoo
(or however it was spelled). Didn't scarf a stick of pure iron that I
later gave to a smith from Wisconsin who wasn't there. And I surely
don't have a little jade Buddha from a Chinese gentleman presenting
his power hammewrs. No, not me.

And CERTAINLY I never sat out in the parking lot eating up all Ries'
oysters <belch>

And, I don't think I ever saw a single blacksmith up a pole while I
was there. I do, however, recall seeing a bribe in the Anvil's Ring,
to try to get people to vote for board members. Always figured that if
people needed to be bribed to vote, they likely didn't give a damn
about the topic of the vote. Wonder why there's such a hotbed of
apathy? Could it just possibly be uninspiring leadership?

> > I'm telling you right now, that it CAN be done- but if the ABANA Board
> > isn't interested in taking positive steps towards saving itself,
> > perhaps it shouldn't be done.
>
> .......... Don't equate the board with a (1) (single) conference. It
> isn't the same.
> And please stop equating ABANA with the SCA.
> Two different things with way different goals.
> Thanks for your input.
> dave m

Really? And what, pray tell, are the goals of each? I see
similarities. What differences do you perceive? If we're going to
disagree, let's at least define our terms.

> >The only reason I'm still trying is
> > because Clare said she's interested in at least looking at other ways
> > to do things. I'll take her on her word, but I need to see a few words
> > of encouragement, too.

-- 
Saint Phlip

Heat it up
Hit it hard
Repent as necessary.

Priorities:

It's the smith who makes the tools, not the tools which make the smith.