[TheForge] Making Ferric Chloride Revisited - Correction

[April & Bill Clemens]

Correction, The HCL  plus Rust has a stronger reaction with copper than the
HCL plus Forge Scale (which has some reaction)  Maybe someone who knows
which oxides rust and forge scale are can explain this.

Bill

-----Original (Corrected)Message----- 
From: theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of April & Bill Clemens
Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 9:03 PM
To: 'Sponsored by ABANA'
Subject: [TheForge] Making Ferric Chloride Revisited

I decided to take the experimental approach.

Sources:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(III)_chloride
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(II)_chloride
http://www.sci-spot.com/Chemistry/liqimag.htm(an interesting article on
making ferrofluids)


1.  HCL (muratic acid) plus Iron(Steel Wool) 

Resulted in a very active reaction and a yellow green liquid (ferrous
chloride - FeCl2) according to the sources I previously noted.

2.  HCL (muratic acid) plus Forge Scale

and

3.  HCL (muratic acid) plus Rust 

Both resulted in a Reddish Liquid that had yellow appearance where it wetted
the sides of the container when swirled.  Seems to confirm the formula I
previously posted:

Ferric Oxide plus HCL results in Ferrous Chloride and Ferric Chloride 

Fe3O4 plus 8HCL yields  FeCl2 plus 2FeCl3 plus 4H2O

I also added steel wool to Ferric Chloride and it turned yellow green and
eventually would not react with additional steel wool added.

Finally I tested each fluid by putting a piece of bare copper wire into each
and also into straight Ferric Chloride,  1 to 4  diluted  Ferric Chloride,
and HCL

The results were as suspected:

 No reaction in HCL although the wire above the liquid line did tarnish
(dark brown/black)

HCL plus Steel Wool - no noticeable reaction

HCL plus forge scale - some reaction with copper 

HCL plus rust  - more reaction similar to Diluted Ferric Chloride

Diluted Ferric Chloride - very apparent step/reduction  in wire size below
liquid level

Ferric Chloride - most reaction dissolved about  1/2 the wire diameter 

Ferric Chloride with steel wool added til no more absorbed - No noticeable
reaction


Conclusion:  Cleaning Rusty and Forge Scaled Iron in HCL(Muratic Acid) will
result in a solution of 2 parts Ferric Chloride(Red Liquid) and one Part
Ferrous Chloride(Yellow Green Liquid)  The concentration of Ferric Chloride
will be reduced by the length of time that clean iron is left in the liquid
converting the Ferric Chloride to Ferrous Chloride.  

My wife just told me I need to put my chemistry set away before I go to bed
so that's all for now...

Bill















 



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