[TheForge] hot portable atmospheric forges may need propylene

[David E. Smucker]

Recuperation is a much more practical direction to up grade the temperature 
/ reduce the total required energy to run the forge.  As of now I know of 
one design for a gas forge to do this.  Basically we use the waste heat 
being exhausted to preheat the air entering the forge.  Some older coal 
forge designs did this with an air "cooled" fire pot -- using the blast air 
that was heated.  The open hearth furnace for making steel using coal as the 
base fuel would not have be possible without the regenerative heating 
system.  This is an area that smiths could do a lot of experimental work I 
would think.

Dave Smucker
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Chris Kilpatrick" <crimsonkil at lycos.com>
To: "Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 6:04 PM
Subject: Re: [TheForge] hot portable atmospheric forges may need propylene


My thought was not running the forge off of the O2 and H2, but putting more 
oxygen and maybe some hydrogen into the air intakes on an atmospheric forge 
to boost temp.

-Chris K.

----- Original Message -----
From: "James Binnion" <jbin at well.com>
To: "Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [TheForge] hot portable atmospheric forges may need  propylene
Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2005 14:16:47 -0700

>
> > Now the dumb question:  Can't you separate water into O2 and H2
> > and funnel the gases into the burner nozzle?  Battery charger,
> > fish tank, hood and fan?
> >
> > -Chris K.
>
> Electrolysis works quite well. the drawback is the cost of the
> electricity. It takes a lot of current to create any significant
> volume of gas. The torches used by the jewelers use about a
> kilowatt of electricity to produce a flame that is coming out of a
> .040" orifice about 5" long. The gas flow very low and at almost 0
> pressure. This is why it doesn't self ignite. Larger systems do
> exist, we used one to generate our breathing oxygen on the
> submarine but of course we had a nuclear reactor to provide power
> for it. It used hundreds of kilowatts and might produce enough gas
> flow to run a forge :-) It operated at very high pressure and was
> designed so that the H and O2 did not come in contact with each
> other. It was known as the "bomb"  because one of the early systems
> had a malfunction that allowed the gasses to mix at operating
> pressure and it promptly exploded killing the operator. The large
> amounts of electrical power required is the main problem with
> generating hydrogen via electrolysis.
> -- Jim Binnion
>
> James Binnion Metal Arts
> Phone (360) 756-6550
> Toll Free (877) 408 7287
> Fax (360) 756-2160
> http://www.mokume-gane.com
> jbin at mokume-gane.com
> Member of the Better Business Bureau
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