[TheForge] Nazel 4b

[Steve Smith]

I bought a 50kg hammer from Tom Clark. At that time they were called 
Sayha, now they are Say-mak. I don't know what the difference is (if 
any). At any rate, very nice Turkish air hammers. He also has a 60kg model.

I really like my hammer. It did a quick job a couple of weeks ago making 
a piece of 2" axel into a splitting wedge. It has fine enough control to 
put a point on 1/4" stock. Not that I use it for that... The hammer 
allows me to get a lot more work done when I get a chance to be in the 
shop.

Tom brings your hammer into his shop, sets it up and makes sure it works 
right. Then he ships or delivers them in person (I think he charges now 
for delivery, but it is worth every penny). He stocks parts, and 
provides *excellent* service. With a hammer, you get a pretty serious 
discount on his power hammer class, which is pretty good if you don't 
have  alot of time on power hammers. Bob Patrick taught ours.

I guess what I hear about the Chinese hammers makes me pretty worried. I 
don't mind the idea of a sub $200 bandsaw needing tweaks and 
improvements, but not an expensive air hammer.

Sounds like you really ought to try out the various types. Tom will 
certainly tell you who in your area has one of his hammers. For this 
kind of money, you ought to know in advance pretty much what you're 
getting, worth some travel. I drove down to Peter Happney's to try out 
his Sayha. He put me to work, which was a great way to learn how I liked 
the machine.

Steve

Justin Fellenz wrote:

> Hmm. Darn. I was just about convinced that a cast body was worth more
> than German engineering. So...the Nazels and chambersburgs are pretty
> much out of the ballpark financially, the fabricated machines (kuhn,
> sahindler) I hear are very very loud and don't hit as hard as the
> cast-body machines; and the chinese cast machines have poor iron
> (anyang) and bad build quality or just bad build quality (striker).
> 
> Whats the answer? Thoughts? Sounds like the Striker is still the best
> option, given a willingness to fix the check valves, replace cheap
> bolts, and add an oil-temp-regulation system (heater/cooler). Kind of a
> hassle but not the end of the world and still cheaper than an amaerican
> hammer.
> 
> J
> 
> --- Cameron Stoker <cameron at stoker.net> wrote:
> 
> 
>>I work in the same shop with Helmut, and use his Chinese hammer quite
>>a 
>>bit. I'm curious what they mean by double oiling system. The hammer
>>in 
>>question does have a double valve 'pneumatic oil pump' with a
>>separate 
>>hose for the drive & work cylinders - I guess that could be a double 
>>system. The issue with it is that the check valves that keep the 
>>lubricant from slipping back down the tubes don't check. You have to 
>>prime the oilers every start-up or it just lubes with air for the
>>first 
>>20 minutes. The other issue with it, is that the oiler box vibrates 
>>loose every two to three weeks. The bondo beneath the mounting bolt 
>>bosses crumbles out and the loose-tolerance bolts don't play well
>>with 
>>locktite.
>>
>>We've been meaning to replace the sloppy check valves with some
>>little 
>>viton-seal plastic ones, but haven't gotten around to it yet.
>>
>>The other lubrication issue is that the feel of the hammer is coupled
>>
>>with the oil viscosity and temperature. You have to adjust the amount
>>of 
>>wd-40 and warm-up time for the type of forging you want to do. Hot & 
>>thin oil give you hard, fast and wild blows - cool and thick oil
>>gives 
>>more precise blows for small stock, but lacks a lot of the oomph.
>>We've 
>>learned how to deal with this over the last two years, but it's
>>always a 
>>fiddly process.
>>
>>After having used this hammer for about two years, I'd really look at
>>
>>acquiring and rebuilding an old piece of nazel or chambersburg iron
>>if 
>>the prices were within the same ballpark. Of course, the machine work
>>on 
>>a #300 hammer can easily run $15000 if it needs much.
>>
>>
>>
>>Justin Fellenz wrote:
>>
>>>Huh. The striker adveises a "double oiling" system, whatever that
>>
>>is,
>>
>>>so it indicates they realize it's an issue. Were the problems your
>>>friend ran into lubrication issues, or something else?
>>>
>>>J
>>>
>>
>>-- 
>>		Cameron Stoker
>>		Cameron at stoker.net
>>		"May you run like a vicuna!"
>>		pgp key: http://keys.stoker.net
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