[TheForge] Dont put your tongue on a frozen anvil round 2

Thu Sep 30 08:49:55 EDT 2004

OK.  Let's cut to the chase.  It takes me a bit of thinking before I get my
thoughts in order.

Certainly there is a lot to be said for the statements on work hardening.
And it is real, and measurable.  But in the "real world," things are
different.  Reason is, because some things are assumed, some things are
ignored, some things aren't really important in certain circumstances.

Example:
If I move into the oncoming traffic lane, and push the accelerator pedal to
the floor, I should NOT have to worry if my drive shaft will fall out onto
the ground, whip around, and cut my truck in half.  I have 280,000 miles on
this truck (I'm a Chevy car person, but a Ford truck person), and put a
similar amount on the one before.  The first one only stopped me once on the
side of the road.  This one never (not yet anyway<G>).

So, things are designed to stand a certain amount of service.  Worrying
about the driveshaft, in a reasonable truck, is useless worry.  I bought the
truck for rough duty, and treat it with respect, but roughly.  Sort of like
how I chose my wife<G>, hope she doesn't read this.

SO,,,,,  the anvil.  It is designed for rough duty.  They expect that folks
will take a 40 pound anvil, and use it where a 100 pound anvil should have
been used.  Been there, done that.  Under "normal rough duty," an anvil
should not be something that you have to worry about.

Now, take a star punch.  I spent a bunch of my youth with a sledge hammer
and a star punch/chisel hammering holes into concrete, so that we could sink
bolts into it.  This was before the days of cheap power tools (or before we
could afford them anyway).  The end of the star punch would ear over after
many hammerings.  Yes, this is severe use.  Yes, it was expected that you
would have to grind off the ears.  But this was a hard hammer head hitting
on a hard punch head.  The standard unstoppable force hitting the unmovable
object<G>.

But an anvil is different.  When you hammer on an anvil, you have a
marshmallow puff of hot metal (poetic license here folks, go with the flow,
I'm on a roll) between that mean ol' Mr. hammer and Ms. Anvil.  The hot
metal softens the blow considerably.  How many times have you missed the
metal, hit the anvil solid with the hammer, and had the hammer zip right
back up leg wetting close to your head, before you got it back under
control??

So.  All being said and true, there are considerations.  I wouldn't worry,
unless I was on the ice floe in Antartica, and even then, I wouldn't be out
there hammering in an icy breeze (unless my life depended upon it), too cold
for me<G>.  I have never seen an anvil come with a specification sheet,
which included temperatures of storage and temperatures of operation on it.
Seen it a bunch on other things I have purchased.  So, it appears,
distinctly, that an anvil may be used in any circumstances that a human
would possibly be standing, and in good enough condition to do so<G>.

I stand by for incoming rounds<G>.

-----Original Message-----
From: theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:theforge-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Dan Tull
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 7:33 PM
To: Sponsored by ABANA
Subject: Re: [TheForge] FW: [The_Anvil] Dont put your tongue on a frozen
anvil

Hulls of Icebreaker ships?
dan tull
georgia
abba, afc, S.C. psba, obg,sofa
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Chris Kilpatrick" <crimsonkil at lycos.com>
To: "Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 11:31 AM
Subject: RE: [TheForge] FW: [The_Anvil] Dont put your tongue on a frozen
anvil

the major thing being overlooked in this conversation is not the difference
in heat between 1800 and 20 degrees, but the properties of steel at 20
degrees.  The colder steel gets the more3 brittle it gets.  The more work
hardening that is done in the cold weather, the exponentially worse it gets.
Each hit on a cold anvil causes more stress risers to appear than a hit on a
warm anvil, as the steel is to brittle to absorb and dissipate all the force
it would at a warmer temp.

-Chris K.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Hufford, David" <David.Hufford at EKU.EDU>
Date: Wed, 29 Sep 2004 10:44:39 -0400
To: "Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: RE: [TheForge] FW: [The_Anvil] Dont put your tongue on a frozen
anvil

> I've heard tales about horns breaking off anvils when struck cold.
However, seems it would take a heavy blow to accomplish this even on a cold
anvil.  What do the metallurgists have to say about this?  I think the major
problem with a cold anvil is as a heat sink ... the work piece does seem to
cool more quickly.  Thus, in the winter, I use a magnetic engine block
heater (available from tractor supply) to keep the anvil warm between
forging sessions (I have an unheated shop).
> David Hufford
> Richmond KY
>
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It is I who formed the blacksmith,
who fans the flame into a fire and
fashions a weapon fit for it's work.

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