[TheForge] Interchangeable LG dies

[Ralph Sproul]

        Hi Walt,  You wouldn't make interchangeable dies for top and bottom
as the top dies can't be made the same width as the bottom dies.........as
the ram is not as wide as the anvil.  The bolt pattern might end up smaller
on the top dies (bear in mind I haven't built the top bolt on die yet, I'm
just running a bottom bolt on unit that I've made dies for) and I use flat
dies opposing them, not drawing dies.

        Little giant dies are marked W and N for wide and narrow for the
lower key to be driven in from the right, and the ram key to be driven in
from the left.  The dies are machined for the straight dovetail to keep the
dies aligned............so Y is taken care of, the X is determined by how
you place the dies left to right in the dovetail slot prior to driving the
keys.  You'd definietly want to work off a center line in making the dies
for the top if the bolt pattern was different.

Ralph

----- Original Message -----
From: "Walter L. Mullett" <wmullett at bright.net>
To: "Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Sunday, October 10, 2004 11:08 AM
Subject: Re: [TheForge] Interchangeable LG dies


> I guess my question wasn't clear.    See below....
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ralph Sproul <brhlbsmt at mcttelecom.com>
> To: Sponsored by ABANA <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> Date: Saturday, October 09, 2004 2:01 PM
> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Interchangeable LG dies
>
>
> >Hi Walt,  Spring dies are nice and easy to slip in and out......no
doubting
> >that.
> >
> >I find the lower bolt on dies nice for making a weld up, forged and
> drilled,
> >or machined die that is one sided, like if you want to make collars and
> >drive a piece of stock into a half rounded swage to create that "D" shape
> >for a collar of that type.  When you want to expand the radius of the
lower
> >die to something greater (like a rail cap), that can be fastened in as
> well.
> >Clapper dies tend to jounce around on certain items.....like long runs
and
> >don't have the accuracy of fixed dies running opposite of each other.
Two
> >handed sterring of the material is nice as well.
> ------
> A one sided bottom die --- no argument, this works.
> -------
> >Now picture if you want to run a fuller across from a flat die to make a
> >foot merely by turning your piece.  If you have a few to do........you
use
> a
> >hand held tool for doing them.......it you've got lots to do, you could
> make
> >the dies hold the tool and you can rotate your stock with two hands - to
> get
> >the results....... like lets say You've got to make 200 parts for a
> railing,
> >then the dies make sense to put something together for that application.
> --------
> Still a one sided die.  What you suggest is the top die is bolted to the
> bottom and this makes sense.  This would be the best of both setups.  The
> mating of a spring die with the bolt on.... fixed.... bottom die.   And it
> really doesn't have to be a spring die.  It could be a pivoted arm holding
> the top die that could be swapped to give you different top tools with the
> same bottom.... or a two posted top die that maintains its alignment
without
> pinching as a spring die does.
>
> My real concern was that I didn't feel that you could do a good job of
> mating the top and bottom for a truely interchangeable setup.  I think the
> X, Y and rotation would not be easy to do with the wedged adjustment.
> Somehow you would have to determine the true neutral axis and get both die
> holders placed there.
>
> Could you set it up in place and make adjust your dies for however your
die
> holders are placed? .... no doubt but then you would have to mark your
dies
> for left/right and top/bottom and they are not interchangeable, just
> changeable.  That is what I was having trouble with.
>
> I can see that a bottom, quick change die would be great, especially if it
> had a couple of sleeves at each end for a drop over top die and just leave
> the fixed drawing top die alone.  Everthing is aligned everytime.
>
> Walt
>
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