[TheForge] Re: reducing fuel costs by improving forge efficiency.

Mon Jul 26 07:22:14 EDT 2004

        Frosty,
        Doug claims he can place two bricks six inches apart from the center
of the burner and forge weld with it.  I haven't tried that - but it works
for him.  I guess that covers the topic of improving forge
efficiency.........We move bricks......not try to suck hot air upon intake.

        For the size space it will heat compared to what I use it for most
of the time, this works well on one burner with the idle incorperated when
talking, phone, layout, etc.
        When you need to heat six to eight items with a 20 inch
heat.........then your talking heavy gas consumption(about $60-100 per
month) for the work I do - which is mostly railings.  I just consider this a
cost I take in stride with the business of making iron work.

        Adaptability is where these unit really shines.  One burner or
two.......the side walls changed from any configuration..........(as long as
the side towards the burners is left in). I love being able to work on a 4
foot radius to an arch of a gazebo or rose trellis arch...........just try
that in a pipe forge!  The pile of bricks on a table is an idea which you
just can't argue with (Thanks again for those tapes Clifton).

        The nice thing about those side arm burners you suggested I make( a
couple years ago).......is they tend to be somewhat windproof.  I like just
puting large parts on the Acorn table and heating them with a firebrick
under them............that takes away the handling of heavy objects while
hot..........you just do it where it sits, by prying it up and sliding the
bricks out to use the jig table it's on.  Beats trying to muscle a 3/4 x 1
1/2 flat that's 5-10 foot long for a railing section in and out of the forge
to get the work done.  My goal was to work on large projects without needing
to hire help - it works.  I think it's a good stopping point as compared to
going to huge rosebuds with high oxygen inputs required to move large stock.
There is a point working by yourself, that you have to stop - on size of
material and cost of heating.

        After looking at Marc Godbout's forge site with the light weight
refractory in the domed top.........I can see this would be a really nice
option for another version of his  and my lift top sytle forge. I would like
something more durable than the Kaowool board for a ceiling, and the domed
shape may have some added benefits.  I'd keep the caster table I've got,
allow it to still pivot, the hard brick floor for durability, and insulating
high temp bricks for the sides, and then put the formed lid with refractory
on as a top.
        The caster table and jack post become really handy sections of the
forge as a tool rack.  The base not only allows the unit to be stowed away
and come out when needed, but the storage off all size bricks (and broken
bricks to act as diverters and heat shields) is great to aim and localize
heat.  The jack post has a rack to hold the reach in poker, the small pick
up tongs, and the larger two radius pick up tongs for moving any object
around or flipping them to get the heat to soak into large items, and the
handle on the side is where I keep the brick tongs for moving the hot
bricks.  So it's a totally self contained tool, with all the accessories
rolling around with it - when it's needed.  I see Marc went with what he
had, and incorportated the ideas of rolling cabinet and lifting the lid with
a mechanical mechanism (scissor jack) to change the firebox when it's hot.
When you do your clamshell (if you have a cement floor in your shop, that
is) - I'd keep casters, pivoting tower, and mechanical lifting top on the
list of priorities for your design.
        This sounds like a winning combination for your clamshell.  Right
now I'm so loaded with work that my spare time is going to working on
rebuilding the 3B I picked up last summer.  If you get a chance to make up
your clamshell this year, I'd love to see the results you get.  Your designs
have always impressed me, and led me to some of the completed projects I've
got now.  ( I've still got that swage stand drawing I want to get to some
day!)

        Marc and I have talked with a fellow in Rhode Island who wants to do
a workshop on burners and gas forges later this fall.......this might be a
nice time to make one "experimental unit" while there are 8 - 10 guys
looking to keep busy on a group participation project.
        After making 9 different style (trial and error) burners to get to
the one's I like now.........I can see why I get all the e-mails and phone
calls from members of our club experimenting with which burner to run with.
I think a workshop and newsletter article will clear up a lot of questions
for the folks working on gas forges.......besides being a great way to spend
the day with a bunch of good folks.  :-)

Ralph

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Frost" <frosty at customcpu.com>
To: "Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2004 2:42 PM
Subject: Re: [TheForge] Re: reducing fuel costs by improving forge
efficiency.


> Ralph:
>
> The only reason your forge isn't fuel "efficient" is you don't think of it
> that way.
>
> Picture this: A number of different sized burners from say 1/2" - 1 1/4"
> with adapters for the mounts, idle circuit of course. Install one 1/2"
> burner, lower the lid on two light firebricks laying flat about 3/4" apart
> and you're not wasting fuel working on tiny items. Mount a couple four 1
> 1/4" burners and open it to max width and height and you're ready for
large
> and odd shapes.
>
> With the open table and firebrick walls it's easy to set up for spot
heating
> on large or odd shaped pieces, something not normally possible for gas
> forges.
>
> Efficiency, fuel and otherwise, is often found in adaptability.
>
> Frosty
> ------------------------
> If it ain't forged
> it ain't real.
> Wrought iron is.
> The FrostWorks
>
> Meadow Lakes, AK.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ralph Sproul" <brhlbsmt at mcttelecom.com>
> To: "Sponsored by ABANA" <theforge at mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Sunday, July 25, 2004 6:38 AM
> Subject: Re: [TheForge] Re: reducing fuel costs by improving forge
> efficiency.
>
>
> >         Frosty, (Yup, that was me)
> >          I loaned my forge to Joe Bonifas and Mike Bendele in the ABBA
> tent
> > in Kentucky.  I got some real good comments from them in using it for
> Mike's
> > 14" copper dish demo, and Joe's power hammer demo.
> >
> >         I also brought 12 sets of the gas forge plans to the conference
> and
> > Keane Paradiso was selling them in the tailgating area. People who'd
asked
> > questions about the forge that Mike and Joe were using bought all of
them.
> >
> >         With the topic of this thread though........my forge is not a
fuel
> > efficient unit......it just gets the job done, and is made from steel
yard
> > and hardware store fittings (except for the stainless parts).
> >
> > Ralph
> >
> >
>
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