[Scan-DC] Amtrak Corporate Guidelines on Photography and VideoRecording

[Larry Sampas]

Sorry to beat this into the ground, but I was taking pictures in Union
Station in 1996 and was asked to leave because I wasn't allowed to
take photographs of the statues in the non-train part of Union
Station. Ten years later, I learned I wasn't alone.

The reason this policy is news is because Amtrak has a long history of
arrests, harassment, and intimidation against photographers in such
public areas as Union Station that pre-dates 9/11.

There was one arrest of a "cooperative" Amtrak photo contest
participant recently who was taking pictures in a public area of a
train station. When Fox News was doing a story about the pointlessness
of the photography ban in Union Station, local security went after the
news crew. If you Google search a few of the terms, you'll find that
common sense disappeared a long time ago.
(http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2009/02/man_arrested_by.html )

The policy may not be law, but the law doesn't really matter until
you're in a courtroom if police have a policy of arresting people who
look suspicious. And police aren't supposed to frisk you without
probable cause. That's what used to separate us from the commies.

On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 5:51 PM, Samuel C. Dixon <scdixon at comcast.net> wrote:
> Maybe I'm missing something here but as I read this document, all I read is
> that it is agency policy.  My understanding of it is that it is not a law.
> Violation of the policy by my understanding would only constitute a
> trespassing charge.  May they stop you and frisk you?  Absolutely.  Ask you
> to stop the activity or leave?  Absolutely.  However having said that with
> the resources Amtrak PD has I find it hard to believe they are going to
> charge every one with a camera with a criminal charge, let alone make a
> physical arrest.  Just remember being "suspicious" isn't against the law.
> Use common sense and be cooperative and I would think you would be fine.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: scan-dc-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:scan-dc-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Larry Sampas
> Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2009 3:39 PM
> To: Scan-DC at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [Scan-DC] Amtrak Corporate Guidelines on Photography and
> VideoRecording
>
> The policy makes it clear that you can exercise your fourth amendment
> rights to take pictures from public, unrestricted areas of public
> things and still be arrested if the Amtrak police consider you
> "suspicious." While section IV.2 of the policy says photography in and
> of itself isn't suspicious, officers are given discretion to arrest by
> any additional factor. Got a scanner and a camera? Very suspicious.
> Certainly, you'd be able to contest it in court, but only after arrest
> and hiring a lawyer. By the time you got to court, Amtrak would define
> anywhere you were as restricted.
>
> In general, these are the same guidelines they have for the Moscow
> subway, and most public areas of the People's Republic of China. They
> can arrest anyone they want to protect state security.
>
> Despite being funded by the taxpayers, they attempt to retain
> commercial rights to images of trains. If you take a great picture of
> an Amtrak train and sell it to a stock agency, they can come after you
> for a cut.
>
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 11:21 AM,  <b_thom at juno.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 00:59:55 -0400 "Alan Henney" <alan at henney.com>
>> writes:
>>>
>>> http://www.amtrak.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=Amtrak/am2Copy/Si
>>> mple_Copy_Page&c=am2Copy&cid=1178294272520&ssid=11134
>>>
>>> Amtrak Corporate Guidelines on Photography and Video Recording
>> ....
>>
>>> Photography and video recording within restricted areas are
>>> prohibited. Individuals found in a restricted area will be subject
>>> to
>>> investigation and possible arrest and seizure of photography and/or
>>> video recording equipment may occur pursuant to the arrest.
>> ....
>>
>>> Restricted areas include but are not limited to the following:
>>>
>>> Platforms (ticketed passengers are exempt)
>>> Crew and Employee Work Areas
>>> Maintenance Facilities
>>> Unoccupied Trains and Engines
>>> Office Areas
>>> Employee Elevators
>>> Baggage/Delivery Areas
>>> Commissaries
>>> Right of Way and Track Areas
>>> In service train cars
>> ....
>>
>> Platforms and "track areas," which can mean just about anything, are
>> restricted areas. Good luck with that. My picture should be on the wall
>> of the Post Office along with that of Osama bin Laden.
>> ____________________________________________________________
>> Digital Photography - Click Now.
>>
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTDvmQhFvR85F2gYqJLcqk6WSme
> xzIB0yksAUSzIl7eywx0A3sTkRK/
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