[PPRAANet] Waldo Canyon Fire info

Mick Sparling mickspa at comcast.net
Mon Jul 1 18:34:20 EDT 2013 

After the evacuation, the resources left, leaving the homes undefended 
(no people in them)!  See the problem???

On 7/1/2013 2:54 PM, Dick-W0RAA wrote:
> The firefighters are professional.  If they suggest mandatory 
> evacuation you'd be smart to evacuate the area.  But it's your life 
> and your property.  So, if you think you know all about it, then stay 
> and take the risk.  Hopefully you will survive, but if not, we can all 
> say he was a nice guy.
>
> Dick
> My memory isn't as good as it used to be.
> Also, my memory isn't as good as it used to be.
>
> On Jul 1, 2013, at 2:19 PM, Mick Sparling <mickspa at comcast.net 
> <mailto:mickspa at comcast.net>> wrote:
>
>> I was listening to Internet "scanner radio" about 2:00 AM when the 
>> fire went through the Flying W Ranch and was baring down on Mountain 
>> Shadows. What I heard really bothered me!  A fire fighter, on the 
>> scene, asked for assistance saying "...this fire is going to take all 
>> these homes, one-at-a-time, unless we get some resources here..."  
>> But none were forthcoming until much later when the whole place was 
>> ablaze. *...I heard it with my own ears! *
>>
>> This may sound cynical, but, sorry, it's just the way I see it:
>> If you evacuate (_Mandatory Evacuation_), then they watch your house 
>> burn.  If you don't, then they try to save you by saving your home in 
>> the process.
>> Sorry again, but screw mandatory evacuation! I'm NOT leaving my home 
>> until I see flames on my property.  It seems like the wooden decks 
>> fire up first, then the fire gets sucked up into the attic through 
>> the ventilation ducts or starts burning it from the outside.  
>> Spraying water on the deck to cool it down and plugging the attic 
>> ducts and doing all the fire mitigation stuff (like getting high 
>> grass, wood and pine needles away from the house would help, but I'm 
>> looking into DIY foam (so much better than water).
>>
>> I guess high winds trump all, but this Mandatory Evacuation thing 
>> really sucks and puts whole neighborhoods in jeopardy by diverting 
>> resources away when there's still stuff we can do, ourself, to 
>> protect our homes!
>>
>> I suppose this anti-mandatory evacuation idea might piss-off the 
>> professionals, but, like I said, I heard it with my own ears!*
>> *Your thoughts and comments are welcomed.
>>
>>
>> On 6/26/2013 7:21 PM, DickT-W0RAA wrote:
>>> Thanks for all that information, Paul. Interesting reading.
>>>
>>> Dick
>>> W0RAA
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Signorelli" <w0rw1 at msn.com>
>>> To: "PPRAA" <ppraanet at mailman.qth.net>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2013 4:48 PM
>>> Subject: [PPRAANet] Waldo Canyon Fire info
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> In case you missed my previous email here are some details about 
>>>> the Waldo Canyon fire:
>>>> It started 1 Year ago.  28-29 June 2012.
>>>> Paul   w0rw
>>>> -------
>>>> i live about 7
>>>> miles away from the fire.
>>>>
>>>> i was driving on Highway 24 a few hours after
>>>> it started, pretty scary...It had
>>>> a big mushroom cloud at first.
>>>> The
>>>> side of Highway 24 is now charred in a few places but the fire damage
>>>> isn't
>>>> really too noticeable.
>>>> If the fire had jumped Highway 24 (Also
>>>> known as the Ute Pass) it would have
>>>> gone up the north side of Pikes
>>>> Peak.
>>>> When they could not stop the fire from Queens canyon, with the wind
>>>> conditions,
>>>> it got over the top of the last ridge and down into
>>>> COS.
>>>> The winds were from thunder storm outflow winds, not like the Santa
>>>> Ana Winds
>>>> that last for weeks.
>>>>
>>>> If you have never been around a
>>>> fire like this, here is what happens:
>>>> The local fire departments were
>>>> first to hike into the fire.
>>>> Waldo Canyon is a popular hiking trail that
>>>> runs 3 miles back into the hills
>>>> from Highway 24 just west of Manitou
>>>> Springs, CO.
>>>>
>>>> When i went by the Canyon the USFS already had about 20
>>>> trucks there at the
>>>> trail head.
>>>>
>>>> The USFS sends a spotter plane in to
>>>> direct all the fire fighting efforts.
>>>> This plane is called "Waldo Air
>>>> Attack".
>>>> They set up at TFR (Temporary Flight Restriction) air perimeter
>>>> and no other
>>>> aircraft are allowed to enter without approval.
>>>> The
>>>> Incident Commander sets a map perimeter around the fire (Assigning 
>>>> sectors
>>>> A
>>>> through Z, clockwise around the fire) and then assigns Division
>>>> Chiefs
>>>> to each each sector.
>>>>
>>>> "Air Attack" orbits the fire at around
>>>> 1000 feet above the fire and directs all
>>>> the other aircraft into the fire and
>>>> relays ground support requests.
>>>> He is the air traffic controller for the
>>>> fire zone.
>>>>
>>>> The Waldo Fire had about 10 choppers flying around one
>>>> day.
>>>>
>>>> When they need slurry Bombers they send in another "Lead"
>>>> plane.
>>>> The "Lead" plane orbits 500 feet below "Air Attack" and He (or She -
>>>> Great job
>>>> Mary) becomes the flight controller for the Bombers.
>>>>
>>>> The
>>>> "Air Attack" assigns the slurry targets and the "Lead" plane will 
>>>> guide
>>>> the
>>>> bombers into the target.
>>>> Many of the Bomber pilots have never seen
>>>> the terrain so the "Lead" plane will
>>>> make a first pass run at the
>>>> target.
>>>> This is called a "Show Me" pass and He sprays a little water or
>>>> smoke so the
>>>> bomber can see the exact drop target.
>>>>
>>>> This BLM Procedure
>>>> is at
>>>> <http://www.blm.gov/pgdata/etc/medialib/blm/nifc/directives.Par.58885.File.dat/i\ 
>>>>
>>>> mof&a2003008a1.pdf>
>>>>
>>>> The
>>>> "Air Attack" must clear all of the guys on the ground out of the 
>>>> target
>>>> zone
>>>> and He keeps all of the choppers about 2 miles away.
>>>> He tells all
>>>> aircraft what is happening so they don't have any collisions.
>>>> When the
>>>> Bombers are returning to base for reloading, the "Lead" plane calls in
>>>> the
>>>> bucket drops to reduce the smoke over the target so the
>>>> Bombers can see
>>>> the target.
>>>> Most of the Bombers fly at 120 Knots during the drop and they
>>>> accelerated
>>>> during the drop as they loose mass..
>>>>
>>>> We had 4 MAFF's
>>>> (Military C130's) assigned to the fire also. They are like big
>>>> spray paint
>>>> canisters. They can make up to a quarter mile splash
>>>> and vary the spay
>>>> width. They lost #7 in South Dakota.
>>>>
>>>> The "Air Attack" has a pilot
>>>> and a Fire Boss. The Fire Boss is directing the
>>>> Fire Suppression Operations
>>>> and working 2 radios with 3 frequencies each..
>>>> He has to control all the
>>>> choppers on VHF AM and all the aircraft on VHF FM.
>>>> He gets them assigned
>>>> to a division and then switches the to a secondary air to
>>>> ground frequency or
>>>> hands them off to the "Lead" plane for slurry drops.
>>>> "Air Attack" is
>>>> usually orbiting over the fire zone for 12 hours in 3 or 4
>>>> shifts.
>>>> The
>>>> "Lead" plane is a usually a single seat plane.
>>>>
>>>> The guys on the ground
>>>> work 12 hours on and 12 hours off. We had around 1500
>>>> fire fighters here but
>>>> now moved on.
>>>>
>>>> The community really
>>>> appreciated the work of the fire fighters. Several
>>>> restaurants have signs
>>>> reading "Free Hamburgers for Firefighters".
>>>>
>>>> i did a little fire work in
>>>> the past.
>>>> See CQ Mag. June 2010, p.60-63.
>>>> i even spent the night in a
>>>> 'Spike Camp'.
>>>> You can see a live picture of the fire area from the top of
>>>> Pikes Peak at
>>>> <http://www.cograilway.com/Summit/WeatheratSummitB.htm>
>>>>
>>>> The
>>>> Waldo Canyon Fire map and additional fire information and videos 
>>>> can be
>>>> found
>>>> at:
>>>> <http://www.inciweb.org/>
>>>> and
>>>> <http://springsgov.com/>
>>>>
>>>> Paul  W0RW
>>>>
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