[MVMA] MVMA - Survey - Leadership Changes - Meeting This Saturday - BARC Clubhouse
Rob Lindsay
roblindsay at gmail.com
Sat Nov 10 08:22:14 EST 2018
I'll come on up. It will be nice to put a face with some callsigns :-)
Rob Lindsay, W8MRL
On Fri, Nov 9, 2018 at 8:23 PM Fred Stone <w8lly at twc.com> wrote:
> Hi, Bob --
>
>
> I don't think we have ever met but if you are interested in mesh
> networking and the future of MVMA, I would encourage you TO ATTEND tomorrow
> if nothing more than to observe and better understand the current issues
> and future possible options and strategic directions for MVMA.
>
>
> Thank you for your interest and possible future participation in MVMA.
>
>
> 73, Fred W8LLY
>
>
>
> Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Smartphone
>
>
> ------ Original message------
>
> *From: *Rob Lindsay
>
> *Date: *Fri, Nov 9, 2018 19:34
>
> *To: *MVMA Mailing List;
>
> *Subject:*Re: [MVMA] MVMA - Survey - Leadership Changes - Meeting This
> Saturday - BARC Clubhouse
>
>
> I was considering visiting tomorrow. But I believe I should wait until
> next time and the let the business meeting take place without a new face
> being there.
>
> I am so impressed with the polite discussions and debates seen on the
> reflector. I'm sure the group will work through the process of formalizing
> the group and then be ready to keep enjoying this facet of amateur radio.
>
> Rob Lindsay, W8MRL
>
> On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 7:17 PM William Curtice <william.curtice at ieee.org>
> wrote:
>
>> *From:* Bill Curtice, WA8APB
>>
>> *To:* The Miami Valley Mesh Alliance
>>
>> · I'm writing to encourage members to attend the MVMA meeting
>> this Saturday, 10 November 2016, at 9:30 AM at the BARC Clubhouse. Several
>> important issues will be addressed. These Include:
>>
>>
>>
>> § MVMA Purpose and Direction
>>
>> § MVMA Organizational Structure, Charter, and Division of
>> Responsibilities
>>
>> § MVMA Leadership Changes
>>
>> § AREDN Mesh Technical Challenges
>>
>> § MVMA Network Purpose and Focus
>>
>> § MVMA Hardware Inventory and Funding Status
>>
>>
>>
>> We are now at a turning point. Clearly, we need to better define MVMA
>> Leadership Responsibilities, Technical Direction, Goals, and Objectives. I
>> raised some of these points at the October MVMA meeting. I sensed
>> significant diversity in what people want from the MVMA, and what people
>> expect the MVMA to do.
>>
>>
>>
>> · *If you have no time to read further*, and are still
>> interested in the MVMA, *PLEASE*......
>>
>> § Complete the brief survey at the following link
>> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc7m_EGPyZWzWXh1MXNMsyJ2rSzC8AXcmUR9xFLyF7pCMCCEQ/viewform?usp=sf_link
>>
>>
>>
>> § Attend our meeting on Saturday morning.
>>
>> I look forward to seeing you at the meeting!! *Additional details
>> follow.*
>>
>> *Bill Curtice WA8APB*
>>
>> *937-287-0871 <937-287-0871>*
>>
>> ==============================
>>
>> · *BACKGROUND:* Following is background information...
>> presented from my perspective. Those who have lived this history are
>> welcome to offer corrections or different points of view. Please respond
>> to the survey (link above).
>>
>>
>>
>> § *Mesh.... has been a learning process.* The MVMA was originally
>> chartered as a Special Interest Group under the Greene County ARES
>> organization. It was envisioned that MVMA members would become skilled in
>> mesh networking, and serve as a resource to ARES District 3 clubs and
>> individuals as they built their own mesh networks. Over last four years,
>> many in MVMA have worked hard to promote mesh, and to build mesh network
>> infrastructure. Some have watched from the sidelines. The good news is,
>> that as of August, we had over a dozen node sites, supported by over three
>> dozen individual transceivers. The bad news, is that growth in our
>> activities and in our infrastructure has created technical and leadership
>> challenges that must be addressed if MVMA is to move forward.
>>
>>
>>
>> § *Technical Challenges: *Growth of our network infrastructure has
>> enabled us to better understand our mesh performance limitations. While
>> there is no imminent technical threat to our operations, it is clear that
>> the failure of the routing protocol used by AREDN, to correctly manage
>> traffic across the mesh, impacts our operations. Both Chuck Gelm (NC8Q)
>> and Moe Riggins (AB8XA) deserve MVMA hero badges for the work they have
>> done to study, define, and document these issues, and to find a
>> "work-around" solution that meets our immediate needs. However, I believe
>> the work-around solution forces a tradeoff of network performance (link
>> speed and capacity) vs. network resiliency and survivability for EmComm
>> applications. These tradeoffs need to be carefully considered by a
>> steering committee representing both EmComm and Technical communities.
>> Additional detail regarding my perception of this issue may be found at the
>> end of this letter.
>>
>>
>>
>> § *MVMA Network Purpose:* The above trade-off leads me to ask .....
>> what is the primary purpose of the MVMA Network Infrastructure... be it a
>> pure mesh or anything else? Does MVMA build and support a backbone network
>> and primary net access points primarily for:
>>
>> · Learning and experimentation?
>>
>> · Creating high-speed data communications between and among
>> participating players?
>>
>> · Emergency Communications Support to Served Agencies? (If so...
>> we have a lot of work to do to make each primary node mains-power
>> independent.)
>>
>> · Tech demonstration to youth?
>>
>> · Some other purpose?
>>
>> What takes first priority?
>>
>> § *MVMA Hardware Inventory and Financial Tracking:* We have records of
>> expenditures of both individual contributions to MVMA, and the DARA grant
>> received a few years ago. A complete hardware inventory and financial
>> report will be available at Saturday's meeting.
>>
>>
>>
>> § *Organization and Leadership:* Since its inception, I have served as
>> the default leader of the MVMA. John Joseph, N8JJ, has served as our
>> treasurer, and keeper of the bank account. Tim Procuniar, N8NQH handled
>> recruiting, and configuration and test of hardware prior to installation.
>> We have no formal charter. That worked fine, as long as MVMA activities
>> were limited in scope, and as long as I had abundant time to give. Over
>> the last couple years, my situation changed. As the scope and time demands
>> of the MVMA expanded, my available time decreased, owing to other
>> responsibilities which I place ahead of my support of the MVMA. I believe
>> MVMA now needs:
>>
>> § A clearly defined organizational structure
>>
>> § A division of responsibilities across the membership
>>
>> § A New leader
>>
>> *I will not continue as a "solo act" leading the MVMA.* I will continue
>> to support the club as an active member, will continue to maintain my own
>> mesh station, and will support MVMA activities. I recommend the MVMA adopt
>> a traditional organizational structure, with a President, Vice President,
>> Secretary, Treasurer, Technical Steering Committee, and sub committees as
>> needed. I will not serve as president. A list of the "service
>> opportunities" available is shown below; *please consider where you
>> might contribute. *
>>
>> · *MVMA Organization Responsibilities*.... From my view, the
>> following responsibilities within MVMA need to be addressed, assuming MVMA
>> direction and purpose remain unchanged..
>>
>> § The usual complement of elected office holders
>>
>> · President
>>
>> · Vice President
>>
>> · Secretary
>>
>> · Treasurer (John Joseph)
>>
>> · Steering Committee (5 Members)
>>
>> § Committee and Staff Assignments
>>
>> § MVMA Charter Committee
>>
>> · Draft
>>
>> · Review
>>
>> · Member Approval
>>
>> § Meeting Pre-Planning
>>
>> · Agenda
>>
>> · Announcements and Meeting Notifications
>>
>> · Meeting Location Reservations
>>
>> · Invitations to Speakers
>>
>> · Demonstration coordination
>>
>> § Outreach to Clubs, Organizations, and Individuals
>>
>> · Mailing List Management
>>
>> · Soliciting Clubs to Invite MVMA Presentations and Demos
>>
>> · Presentation Graphics: Update and Management
>>
>> · Web Site Content Management
>>
>> · Web Master (Stan Leeds)
>>
>> · New Member Recruiting and Support (Elmer)
>>
>> · Create propagation plots for prospective members
>>
>> · Loaner Kit Management
>>
>> · Demo Deployments – Show and Tell
>>
>> § Maker Faire (Chuck Gelm)
>>
>> § TechFest
>>
>> § Hamvention Support and Participation
>>
>> · AREDN Coordination
>>
>> · Inside Exhibits Coordination
>>
>> · Demonstration Systems Planning
>>
>> · Install, Use, Removal of Hardware
>>
>> · Scheduling of Booth Support
>>
>> § MVMA Network Design, Integration, Optimization
>>
>> · Network design and performance optimization
>>
>> · Accommodating holes, deficiencies
>>
>> · Integration of peripheral players
>>
>> · Hardware selection and planning
>>
>> · Tunnel Management
>>
>> · Site Hardening
>>
>> · Lightning Protection
>>
>> · Solar Power
>>
>> · MVMA Network Administration
>>
>> · Day to Day Network Performance Monitoring (Moe Riggins)
>>
>> · Network Security
>>
>> § Secure Community Support and Operating Sites
>>
>> · Build Relationships
>>
>> · EMAs and County EOCs
>>
>> · DARA, Other Area Clubs, ARES, RACES
>>
>> · GDAHA, KHN, Premier
>>
>> · Red Cross
>>
>> · Industry
>>
>> · Government - City, County, Fire, Police
>>
>> · Solicitations for Funding
>>
>> · Applications for Grants
>>
>> · Member Outreach
>>
>> · Evaluate what is offered
>>
>> · Work politics to secure what’s needed
>>
>> · Coordinate Site use – what’s installed
>>
>> · Manage Install
>>
>> · Define long-term support plan
>>
>> § MVMA Installation Crew
>>
>> · Hardware pre-configuration and pre-test
>>
>> · Hardware install
>>
>> · Climbing Crew
>>
>> § MVMA Operating Site Maintenance and Repair
>>
>> § MVMA Equipment Purchase, Storage, Check-Out, and Inventory Control
>>
>> § Book Keeping - Purchases and Ledger(John Joseph)
>>
>> § Tactical Deployments
>>
>> · Go-Kits and Recommended Deployment Configurations
>>
>> · Exercises and Demonstrations
>>
>> · Public Service Events
>>
>> § Net Operations – Network Real-time Use
>>
>> · Network applications evaluations
>>
>> · Standards for Net Apps
>>
>> · Standards for net clients (cameras, servers, etc.)
>>
>> · Available bandwidth management
>>
>> § Net Control Station for weekly ARES Mesh Discussion Net
>>
>>
>>
>> · *OLSR Failure:* I am concerned about the failure of Optimized
>> Link State Routing Protocol (OLSR) to effectively route traffic on AREDN
>> Mesh Networks. These comments refer to the most recent release of AREDN
>> firmware, which incorporates the most recent release of OLSR.
>>
>> § As I understand it, there are three routing protocol issues impacting
>> us:
>>
>> · First, is that the routing protocol (OLSR) used is not capable
>> of selecting the best (or fastest) route through the mesh. Instead, it
>> selects routes based on the least number of radio transmissions, which
>> loosely relates to the least number of node hops. Often, performance of
>> the selected shortest route, with the least number of hops, is *far*
>> worse than other routing options requiring more hops.
>>
>> · Second, is that OLSR provides no manual route management
>> capability, needed to trim or disable links that are too weak to support
>> traffic. Weak links serve only to add a significant processing burden for
>> nodes at each end, and in so doing, significantly degrade the ability of
>> those nodes to passing traffic from other valid links.
>>
>> · Third, is that AREDN code developers are fast approaching a
>> wall on processor speed and memory size for older Ubiquiti hardware
>> (Bullet, AirGrid, etc.). It may be difficult for them to significantly
>> improve the OLSR function, within constraints of the old hardware. This
>> implies that given OLSR/AREDN does improve the performance of OLSR.....
>> older hardware will likely not be supported, and we will be forced to purge
>> our system of the Bullets, AirGrids, AirRouters, etc. In time... as we
>> abandon 2.4 GHz and migrate to 3.4 and 5.8 GHz hardware, we may wish to do
>> that anyway.
>>
>> At this point, there appears to be no near-term OLSR-based solution in
>> sight; we have what we have. However, Chuck and Moe demonstrated that the
>> performance of the 2.4 GHz Omni nodes can be significantly improved if:
>>
>> · They are prevented from communicating with distant nodes, by
>> assigning different SSID identifiers to nodes in different areas. In
>> essence, RF links to each 2.4 Omni will be limited to a few select other
>> nodes, or if:
>>
>> · Strong 2.4 nodes which serve no particular user, are shut down.
>>
>> The upside of doing this... is that it fixes the performance problem.
>> The down side... is that the network no longer functions as a true
>> RF-based mesh; some mesh performance characteristics, important to EmComm,
>> will continue to exist only to the extent that we replace both primary and
>> secondary network links with 3.4 or 5..8 backbone connections. Even then,
>> OLSR will not assure best path selection. If all mesh links were perfect
>> (100% LQ), this would not be an issue; routing by the least number of hops
>> would be acceptable. In the Midwest, and I suspect in many other parts of
>> the country, mesh networks will automatically create links of varying
>> quality. Even the marginal links may be useful to someone, and may be the
>> only links surviving a disaster. The ability of OLSR to route smartly...
>> selecting the best quality route paths.... is crucial.
>>
>> As a practical matter, our physical access to many MVMA sites is limited,
>> to where we can install hardware for only one or two backbone links (and in
>> some cases, none). Given segregation of the RF mesh, and lacking multiple,
>> redundant backbone paths, the resiliency and survivability of the mesh
>> network is reduced. It is a tradeoff; performance vs. resiliency. Right
>> now... we appear headed for performance.
>>
>> OLSR performance is primarily an issue for mesh systems on 2.4 GHz;
>> however, even when we move into use of 3.4 GHz with faster equipment, the
>> problem may follow us until AREDN and their supporting OLSR developers
>> create some new magic. I see this as a global challenge for AREDN; if they
>> do not fix OLSR, I see little future for mesh. The more mesh networks are
>> segregated using SSID changes, channel jumps, height reductions and power
>> reductions, and the more backbone links are manually configured and
>> hardwired .... the more our mesh networks begin to look like ordinary
>> 801.11 commercial wireless communications networks. The virtues of a
>> "mesh" evaporate. I expect AREDN users globally will discover that they
>> can build high-speed, multi-media, digital, RF based, fixed configuration
>> 802.11 networks .... independent of AREDN mesh ... by using and manually
>> configuring stock WiFi Access Point hardware, running stock software
>> (AirOS). *AREDN deserves our encouragement, support, and participation
>> on this issue.*
>>
>> If you have read this far..... you certainly passed the test. You must
>> have *SOME* interest in Mesh Networks. Given that..... *PLEASE:*
>>
>> · Take the time to tell us what YOU think!
>>
>> · Respond to the survey at
>> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc7m_EGPyZWzWXh1MXNMsyJ2rSzC8AXcmUR9xFLyF7pCMCCEQ/viewform?usp=sf_link
>>
>>
>> · Nominate people for the elected positions, share your
>> opinions, and indicate which of the tasks above you are willing to lead or
>> support.
>>
>> · If at all possible, attend Saturday's meeting. I look forward
>> to seeing you there.
>>
>> *Bill Curtice WA8APB*
>>
>> 937-287-0871
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
>
> --
> Rob Lindsay, W8MRL
>
>
>
--
Rob Lindsay, W8MRL
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