[Logic] Canadian Sect. and Mult. Confusion

Thu, 8 Jan 2004 19:44:11 -0600

The problem is that you are trying to put the square peg in the round hole.
Logic is not designed to be a contest logger. Every contest could have a
different list that is totally unrelated to the country codes, post office
codes, states , islands or anything else. Logic has one table of valid
values and it is not related to a contest name. Just forget using Logic as a
contest logger is the best thing you can do. Get a free logger like N1MM
logger or pay for WriteLog ( I would use N1MM myself) and your problems are
solved. Use Logic for what it is good at, general logging.

Gil, W0MN http://webpages.charter.net/gbaron
N 44.082056  W 92.513024 1050'
Hierro Candente, Batir de repente

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]On
> Behalf Of Bradford J. Williams - N8GLS
> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 7:23 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: RE: [Logic] Canadian Sect. and Mult. Confusion
>
>
> Hi Mel,
>
> That's pretty much my feeling as well.
>
> I wasn't trying to ruffle the masses, and this dead horse can't be beat
> anymore, so I think I'll just go back to messing with LOGic to
> see how I can
> get the multipliers to handle correctly from a contest logform.
>
> 73, de Brad
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]On
> Behalf Of Mel
> Sent: Thursday, 08 January, 2004 7:37 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: RE: [Logic] Canadian Sect. and Mult. Confusion
>
>
> "as it has not been a problem in many years, and is well ingrained among
> thousands of contesters."
>
> Well that's complete moose manure!!! I lose a LOT of time every contest
> explaining that the multiplier for Quebec is QC and not PQ, which the
> ARRL used to use ( and did change because I used to have to explain why
> it was PQ and not QC ) And I've seen long discussions on reflectors of
> people trying to understand why there are 14 provinces.
>
> Since they used the postal abbreviations for the US states... It would
> be a courtesy if they would do the same for Canada, as THAT is what most
> people expect. And using NWT for NT because they used NT as a section
> identifier is really confusing. I'm sure their heart is in the right
> place, but I wish they would straighten this out once and for all!
>
> To sum up... They should use postal codes for Provinces... There should
> be 13, and they can use whatever they like for Sections... If they
> insist on 14 divisions for some contest... DON"T CALL THEM PROVINCES!!!
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [email protected]
> > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bradford J.
> > Williams - N8GLS
> > Sent: January 8, 2004 19:06
> > To: [email protected]
> > Subject: RE: [Logic] Canadian Sect. and Mult. Confusion
> >
> >
> > Hi Bob,
> >
> > Sorry, but I think were all beating a dead horse.  The
> > responses I got back from the ARRL stack-up like this:
> >
> > The ARRL Sections have nothing to do with contests.
> > Several contests "conveniently" use the ARRL Section list as
> > multipliers. The multiplier abbreviations will be "whatever
> > works".  There is nothing in the rules that says they have to
> > follow US or Canadian postal abbreviations. There is no
> > reason to change anything as it has not been a problem in
> > many years, and is well ingrained among thousands of contesters.
> >
> > So, it boils down to this.  In the eyes of the ARRL, there
> > are 14 Provinces in Canada, period......forget the fact that
> > there are 13, it doesn't matter because they are "just"
> > multipliers.  Now, there are three ARRL contests that treat
> > Canadian "provinces" as multipliers (I should have said
> > ARRL's "view" of what Canada's provinces are), they are ARRL
> > Int'l DX, 10-Meter, and RTTY Round-up.  For these contests,
> > the multipliers are AB, BC, LB, MB, NB, NF, NS, NU, NWT, ON,
> > PEI, QC, SK, and YT.
> >
> > Now, this leaves those contests that "conveniently" use the
> > ARRL Sections as multipliers, they are the 160 Meter contest
> > and the November Sweepstakes, for them the multipliers are
> > AB, BC, MAR, MB, NL, NT, ON, QC, and SK.
> >
> > So for any other contests, your at the mercy of yourself,
> > your logging/contest software maker, or a reflector like this
> > one to find out how to handle the inconsistent use of
> > multiplier rules and abbreviations.  For LOGic I will undo
> > what I did last week and go back to VE Provinces that match
> > the above.  That way at least the major contest logforms will
> > still work.
> >
> > Until I or someone else can figure a way to pull multiple
> > variations out of a list of valid values I'll wait to do
> > anything else.
> >
> > 73, de Brad, N8GLS
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [email protected]
> > [mailto:[email protected]]On
> > Behalf Of R Johnson
> > Sent: Thursday, 08 January, 2004 4:43 PM
> > To: [email protected]
> > Cc: [email protected]
> > Subject: [Logic] Canadian Sect. and Mult. Confusion
> >
> >
> > Below are the extracts from the ARRL sponsored contests
> > showing the CAN multipliers. These are taken from the Contest
> > Rules on the ARRL Web Site.
> >
> > This lack of consistency is creating much confusion amongst
> > Contesters and the Authors of Contest Programs.
> >
> > I fail to see why we can not use the use the 13 multipliers
> > as defined by the standard CAN Postal abbreviations. NS
> > (VE1), QC (VE2), ON (VE3), MB (VE4), SK (VE5), AB (VE6), BC
> > (VE7), NT (VE8), NB (VE9) NL (VO1,VO2), NU (VY�), YT (VY1), PE (VY2).
> >
> > Other contests such as RAC Canada Day, RAC Winter and NCJ's
> > NAQP and Sprint all use the 10 Provinces and 3 Territories to
> > give 13 multipliers.
> >
> > The League seems to be out of step with everyone else (MY
> > opinion) !!!! While they as the Contest Sponsors, can define
> > things the way they want, but it sure would nice for all the
> > logging programs to be able to be able to use common
> > definitions to facilitate moving data between each other.
> >
> > 73
> > Bob, K1VU
> > ************************************************************
> > ARRL 10M 2003 (14 CAN Multipliers Defined)
> > 5.2.2. Canada [NB (VE1, 9), NS (VE1), QC (VE2), ON (VE3), MB
> > (VE4), SK (VE5), AB (VE6), BC (VE7), NWT (VE8), NF, (VO1), LB
> > (VO2)], YT (VY1), PEI
> > (VY2) NU (VY�).
> >
> > ************************************************************
> > ARRL 160M 2003 (Nothing Defined)
> > 5.2.1. Northern Territory (NT) multiplier includes the
> > Northwest (NWT), Yukon (VY1) and Nunavut (VY0) territories.
> > Could be 9 Mults where MAR=NB,NS,PEI + NT=NT,NU,NW + NL=NF,LA
> > PLUS QC,ON,MB,SK,AB,BC OR Could be 11 mults where NT=NT,NU,NW
> > + NL=NF,LA PLUS NS,QC,ON,MB,SK,AL,BC,NB,PE
> >   OR
> > Could be 12 mults where NT=NT,NU,NW PLUS
> > NS,QC,ON,MB,SK,AL,BC,NB,NL,LA,PE
> >
> > ************************************************************
> > ARRL Field Day 2003
> > nothing directly defined That I could find easily)
> >
> > ************************************************************
> > ARRL International DX 2004 (14 CAN Multipliers Defined)
> > 5.2.2. DX stations: Sum of US states (except KH6/KL7),
> > District of Columbia (DC), and Canadian
> > provinces/territories: NB (VE1, 9), NS (VE1), QC (VE2), ON
> > (VE3), MB (VE4), SK (VE5), AB (VE6), BC (VE7), NWT (VE8), NF
> > (VO1), LB (VO2), NU (VY0), YT (VY1), PEI (VY2) worked per
> > band (maximum of 63 per band).
> >
> > ************************************************************
> > ARRL November SS 2003 (Nothing Defined)
> > 5.1. Multiplier: Each ARRL Section and RAC Section plus the
> > Canadian NT (Northern Territories - encompassing VE8 / VY1 /
> > VY0) with a maximum number of 80.
> >
> > 5.2. Final score: Multiply QSO points (two per QSO) by the
> > number of ARRL/RAC sections (plus NT VE8/VY1/VY0).
> >
> >
> > Could be 9 Mults where MAR=NB,NS,PEI + NT=NT,NU,NW + NL=NF,LA
> > PLUS QC,ON,MB,SK,AB,BC OR Could be 11 mults where NT=NT,NU,NW
> > + NL=NF,LA PLUS NS,QC,ON,MB,SK,AL,BC,NB,PE
> >   OR
> > Could be 12 mults where NT=NT,NU,NW PLUS
> > NS,QC,ON,MB,SK,AL,BC,NB,NL,LA,PE
> >
> > ************************************************************
> > ARRL RTTY Roundup 2004 (14 CAN Multipliers Defined)
> > 5.2. Multipliers: Each US state (except KH6 and KL7) plus the
> > District of Columbia (DC), Canadian provinces/territories: NB
> > (VE1, 9), NS (VE1), QC (VE2), ON (VE3), MB (VE4), SK (VE5),
> > AB (VE6), BC (VE7), NWT (VE8), NF (VO1), LB (VO2), NU (VY�),
> > YT (VY1), PEI (VY2) and each DXCC country. KH6 and KL7 count
> > only as separate DXCC countries
> >
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