[Icom] RE: Lithium Battery Pack..?

Sun, 23 Mar 2003 23:06:37 -0700

Hi,
Ni, and Cadmium is toxic alright. My XYL once treated a pro guitar 
player who was full of heavy
metal poison in his body impeding his liver function. Guitar strings to 
finger tips to liver.
MDs had no idea what's going on. You work there, OM at the smelter, hi.
73,
Tony, VE6CGX

Chris BONDE wrote:

> Thank you very much.  This information is a keeper, as it has the best 
> summary that I have run across.
> The NiCds are becoming harder to find as the Cd metal is said to be 
> toxic.  It is like other things, toxic in what form.  Ni can be very 
> toxic as well, you carry a lot of it in you pocket (the same with Cu)  
> So.
>
> Again Thank you.  Chris opr VE7HCB
>
>
> At 07:11 PM 2003-03-23 -0800, Hsu, Aaron wrote:
>
>> My 2 cents on batteries...
>>
>> NiCd - Nickle Cadmium - The old standby.
>> Pros:  Most number of recharge cycles of the common "rechargable" types.
>> Low internal resistance lends to higher discharge rates (good for "high
>> power" uses).  OK tolerance for over charge/discharge.  Many more 
>> "types" of
>> cell construction suited for different purposes (fast/rapid
>> charge/discharge, high heat, "rugged" use, etc).  Can be charged with a
>> simple circuit (most all battery chargers on the market can charge a 
>> NiCd).
>> Fairly low self-discharge rate.
>> Cons:  Lower capacity than other cell types.  "Memory" effect.  Internal
>> cell shorting.  In my experience, shorted cells are the number #1 
>> cause of
>> cell failure.  Cadmium is a toxic metal and must be properly disposed.
>> General: Actual number of recharges usually limited by care and 
>> condition of
>> cell.  Treat it well and it will serve you until internal shorts start
>> "growing".  Even then, a "zap" will give you a few more cycles.  
>> IMHO, good
>> for high-cyclic, short duration, high duty-cycle use (e.g.  Radios used
>> constantly for a few hours at a time.)
>>
>> NiMH - Nickel Metal-Hydride - The new "king"?
>> Pros:  High number of recharge cycles.  Fairly low internal 
>> resistance.  No
>> memory effect.  High energy/weight ratio.  Can be recharged with 
>> low-current
>> NiCd chargers.
>> Cons:  Less tolerant to overcharge/discharge.  Higher internal 
>> resistance
>> than NiCd causes cell to heat up more than NiCd during high-current 
>> "bulk"
>> charging.  As such, NiMH chargers usually monitor temperature of cell 
>> while
>> charging.  Less recharge cycles vs NiCd.  More expensive vs NiCd (for 
>> now).
>> General:  Good replacement for NiCd's in most applications.  Make 
>> sure to
>> get a NiMH-suitable charger (e.g. deltaT, -deltaV) for high-current 
>> charging
>> due to heat generation.  Low-current NiCd chargers work fine with NiMH.
>> Best when used in moderate draw, constant current applications like 
>> digital
>> cameras, portable audio, etc.
>>
>> Li-ion - Lithium Ion - Lotsa power in small packages
>> Pros:  Very high energy/weight ratio.  Certain cell chemistries (e.g.
>> Li-Polymer) allow for "moldable" cells (new PDA's and TabletPC's will 
>> use
>> Li-Polymer cells where the battery is "squeezed" wherever there's 
>> space).
>> Very low self-discharge rate.
>> Cons:  More expensive than NiCd/NiMH.  Lower number of charge/discharge
>> cycles vs NiCd/NiMH.  *HIGHLY* intolerant to overcharge and heat.  
>> Highly
>> intolerant to 0v discharge, but may recover.  Failed cell not as easily
>> replaceable as NiCd/NiMH.  Not available in "standard" sizes (e.g.
>> AAA/AA/C/D) and for good reason - 3.6v per cell.
>> General:  3.6v per cell *requires* different charger than NiCd/NiMH.  
>> Due to
>> this, Li-ion battery packs may not work with older radios that have 
>> built-in
>> chargers.  Also, each cell in a pack must be monitored individually.  
>> Great
>> for devices that require high energy/weight ratios - digital cameras,
>> camcorders, high-tech electronics (laptops), etc.
>>
>> All of this info as gathered over the past few years.  I'm under the 
>> weather
>> as I type this, so I may have left out some details here or there.
>> Corrections are welcome.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>>   - Aaron, NN6O
>>
>> p.s.  Oh, NiCd/NiMH are 1.2v nominal and are considered fully 
>> discharged at
>> 1.0v.  Li-ion are fully discharged when they reach 2.7v.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Chris BONDE [mailto:[email protected]]
>> Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2003 11:20 AM
>> To: [email protected]
>> Subject: RE: [Icom] Lithium Battery Pack..?
>>
>>
>> I am mixed up.  You say use lithium, then give references to NiMhd
>> batteries.
>>
>> What are the costs of lithium?  Can they be charged with the metal 
>> hydrid
>> type charger?  What voltage do they give?  (I understand that all the
>> different types give a different voltage.)
>>
>> I am starting to change to Metal Hydrides as the NiCd batteries give up.
>>
>> Chris opr VE7HCB
>>
>>
>> At 03:21 PM 2003-03-22 +0000, you wrote:
>> > > Subject: [Icom] Lithium Battery Pack..?
>> >
>> >You could do what I did.  I bought two BP-170 battery packs.  I put 
>> some
>> >1850 mah NiMH batteries in them.  The original BP-173 batteries were
>> lasting
>> >me 4-5 hours at 5 watts output.  Instead of NiMH, use lithium.
>> >
>> >Here is how it worked.
>> >
>> >BP-173  5w out, 650 mah nicd            lasts 4-5 hours
>> >BP-170  1.5w out, 1850 mah nimh         lasts 24+ hours
>> >
>> >The lower power was a problem.  I have never done a measurement, but I
>> >imagine the stock rubber duck is -3dB. (Maybe worse?)  So the 5 watt 
>> output
>> >gets me 2.5 watts ERP. (Maybe less?)
>> >
>> >I changed antennas.  I now use the comet BNC-24.  They claim 2.1 dB 
>> gain.
>> >This takes the 1.5 watt BP-170 output to around 2.5w ERP.  One note, 
>> I did
>> >add some heat shrink to stiffen the BNC-24 a bit.
>> >
>> >So now I can hike two days on one battery pack instead of changing
>> batteries
>> >every few hours.  Additionally, every item I carry on my pack, GPS, 
>> strobe,
>> >flashlight, all use AA batteries.  So I carry less spares as they are
>> >interchangeable.  Longer life, less weight, and same ERP.  It 
>> couldn't be
>> >better, unless they invent a battery that weighs 1 oz, and runs 5 
>> years on
>> >air!
>> >
>> >Mike.  KD9KC
>> >El Paso, TX.
>>
>>
>> ----
>> Your Moderator: Dick Flanagan W6OLD, [email protected]
>> Icom Users Net: Sundays, 1700Z, 14.315 MHz
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>
>
>
> ----
> Your Moderator: Dick Flanagan W6OLD, [email protected]
> Icom Users Net: Sundays, 1700Z, 14.315 MHz
> Icom FAQ: http://www.qsl.net/icom/
>