From brian at lessonsinlutherie.com  Sun Nov  2 11:50:13 2014
From: brian at lessonsinlutherie.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2014 08:50:13 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Big Nick's HBR-12
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAKvYVrVAyrFNg9oG+8bBGCwBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>

Hello All,

 

I'm sure most of you are familiar with "Big Nick's" radios---KC9KEP. He
deserves some kind of award for making some of the best looking home-brew
sets ever. One of his latest efforts is an HBR-12, and he has posted some
excellent hi-rez photos of it on his website. Well worth a visit, if you
haven't seen them. The HBR-12 is at the upper right:

 

http://www.bignick.net/Morgan_Radio/Radio.htm

 

Cheers,

 

Brian

 

 



---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

From brian at lessonsinlutherie.com  Sun Nov  2 19:28:58 2014
From: brian at lessonsinlutherie.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2014 16:28:58 -0800
Subject: [HBR] K4CHE website
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAESuTBhA0sBPocXYNk2A1uABAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>

Hello All,

 

In surfing around I've just come across Breck's website---k4che.com. His
notes and photos of his build of the HBR-14 are nothing short of awesome!
And, I almost never use that word!

 

I couldn't find an email address anywhere, so, in hopes that he looks at the
HBR list once in a while---Thank you Breck!

 

Cheers,

 

Brian

 

 



---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

From hbr at mailman.qth.net  Tue Nov  4 18:46:48 2014
From: hbr at mailman.qth.net (Gary Wells via HBR)
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 2014 23:46:48 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [HBR] "HBR Receiver Data & More" CD
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIogmXEwtNNGg0h5b+vSKrcBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIogmXEwtNNGg0h5b+vSKrcBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <1743035489.662233.1415144808718.JavaMail.yahoo@jws10691.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>


I know I have one somewhere......I'll start a search and rescue mission later tonight and advise.?




Gary

WB9AYD

HBR-11C owner

      From: Brian Burns <brian at lessonsinlutherie.com>
 To: 'HBR Receiver List' <hbr at mailman.qth.net> 
 Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2014 12:26 PM
 Subject: [HBR] "HBR Receiver Data & More" CD
   
Hello All,

 

As I am into HBR information gathering mode, I checked with Kees to see if
his CD "HBR Receiver Data & More" is still available. It seems that his
master disk is no longer readable, but he said that it would be Ok to try to
find a readable one, and make a copy. 

 

So, does anyone have a working disk that can be copied? I can do the copying
myself if need be. In any case, I'm glad to pay any costs involved.

 

Many thanks,

 

Brian Burns

 

 



---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com
______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


  

From brian at lessonsinlutherie.com  Fri Nov  7 20:22:59 2014
From: brian at lessonsinlutherie.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2014 17:22:59 -0800
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>

Hello All,

 

In searching the usual places, and with the usual methods, I've not been
able to come up with any data on covering the WARC bands with HBR's. Has
anybody got any suggestions for where to look?

 

Cheers,

 

Brian

 

 

 



---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

From whitebear1122 at comcast.net  Fri Nov  7 21:41:31 2014
From: whitebear1122 at comcast.net (Whitebear1122)
Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2014 20:41:31 -0600
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>

I've not seen any WARC band coil data published.   I'm still in the process of building my HBR-13 and my plan is to calculate the inductance of the coil for a band close by, then translate that to the WARC frequency, then wind a coil from that data,  and see if it works. If I do it first, I'll publish it here.  If you do it first, please publish here.  

I have a picture of the HBR-13 chassis up on qrz.com before I attached the main parts.

73, Scott WA9WFA with an HBR-13 mechanicals done, getting ready to start wiring in a few weeks



From smithab11 at comcast.net  Fri Nov  7 22:01:43 2014
From: smithab11 at comcast.net (B. Smith)
Date: Fri, 07 Nov 2014 22:01:43 -0500
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <545D8797.7040108@comcast.net>

       First build a working receiver. The experience gained from 
fabricating coils for 40 meters  will help you with the WARC bands. Take 
your 40 meter coil that you made and  compute  the change in frequency 
from 40 to 30 meters as a percentage. Use this percentage and apply to 
your 40 meter coil windings  to compute turns for 30 meters.  It won't 
be perfect the first time but its not that hard and it fun.   The good 
news is the band spread for the WARC bands  is only 100 khz and that 
will be a piece of cake compared to 300 Khz for 40 meters.   :-)
And it can be done  it in the opposite direction with 160 meter coils 
for the HBR.
k4che
http://k4che.com/HBR/RF%20Mixer%20Osc%20Band%20Coils%20Page%201.htm

On 11/7/2014 9:41 PM, Whitebear1122 wrote:
> I've not seen any WARC band coil data published.   I'm still in the process of building my HBR-13 and my plan is to calculate the inductance of the coil for a band close by, then translate that to the WARC frequency, then wind a coil from that data,  and see if it works. If I do it first, I'll publish it here.  If you do it first, please publish here.
>
> I have a picture of the HBR-13 chassis up on qrz.com before I attached the main parts.
>
> 73, Scott WA9WFA with an HBR-13 mechanicals done, getting ready to start wiring in a few weeks
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>


From wrcromwell at gmail.com  Sat Nov  8 06:41:38 2014
From: wrcromwell at gmail.com (Bill Cromwell)
Date: Sat, 08 Nov 2014 06:41:38 -0500
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <545D8797.7040108@comcast.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
	<545D8797.7040108@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>

Hi,

Another option is to use a converter ahead of the receiver. Winding the 
coils is a better choice but the converter can get you on those bands 
until the coil sets are working.

73,

Bill  KU8H

From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sat Nov  8 11:52:18 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sat, 8 Nov 2014 08:52:18 -0800
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
	<545D8797.7040108@comcast.net> <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAFd1PxGSWv9Ksyjsoymb48wBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello All,

The reason I asked about WARC band coverage at this early stage is that I'm
wondering whether there is a way to stretch 15m and 10m coverage to include
17m and 12m. It's pretty clear that another set of coils will have to be
wound for 30m, as it's a long stretch from there to either 40m or 20m. 

I've got a couple of ideas, but I thought that first I would ask you guys
that have "been there, done that, and got the tee-shirt".

Cheers,

Brian


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From waltah at earthlink.net  Sat Nov  8 14:08:50 2014
From: waltah at earthlink.net (Walt Hutchens)
Date: Sat, 8 Nov 2014 14:08:50 -0500
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAFd1PxGSWv9Ksyjsoymb48wBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
	<545D8797.7040108@comcast.net> <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAFd1PxGSWv9Ksyjsoymb48wBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <993206698.20141108140850@earthlink.net>

Brian said:

> I'm wondering whether there is a way to stretch 15m and 10m coverage
> to include 17m and 12m.

The thing you get into is that any ham band only receiver that does it
directly (the 1st LO is tuned to cover the band) is going to have a
very small tuning cap -- 10-15 mmf maximum or something like that. The
delta-c as a percentage of the total capacitance varies as the square
of the delta-f. (The square is double the percentage, for small
bands.) So you get down to VERY small fixed capacitance values very
quickly when you try to cover bigger bands and that gives you assorted
unpleasant problems.

80 is the widest band for the standard coil set -- 12.5% of the top
end of the band. Bands that are smaller are doable, those that are
larger, not so much.

Walt
KJ4KV


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sat Nov  8 14:33:50 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sat, 8 Nov 2014 11:33:50 -0800
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <993206698.20141108140850@earthlink.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
	<545D8797.7040108@comcast.net> <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAFd1PxGSWv9Ksyjsoymb48wBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<993206698.20141108140850@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAANRyw1jprN1Bl+VWmXse/bwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Walt,

Thanks very much for your explanation of the problem (:->)...

> I'm wondering whether there is a way to stretch 15m and 10m coverage 
> to include 17m and 12m.

~ The thing you get into is that any ham band only receiver that does it
directly (the 1st LO is tuned to cover the band) is going to have a very
small tuning cap -- 10-15 mmf maximum or something like that.

So, if you try to extend the range by going to a larger tuning capacitor,
you end up in the "general coverage" two dial receiver category, and need
the extra complication of a bandspread capacitor and dial?

73,

Brian
 









---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From waltah at earthlink.net  Sat Nov  8 17:07:48 2014
From: waltah at earthlink.net (Walt Hutchens)
Date: Sat, 8 Nov 2014 17:07:48 -0500
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAANRyw1jprN1Bl+VWmXse/bwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
	<545D8797.7040108@comcast.net> <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAFd1PxGSWv9Ksyjsoymb48wBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<993206698.20141108140850@earthlink.net>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAANRyw1jprN1Bl+VWmXse/bwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <19025576.20141108170748@earthlink.net>

Brian said:

> So, if you try to extend the range by going to a larger tuning capacitor,
> you end up in the "general coverage" two dial receiver category, and need
> the extra complication of a bandspread capacitor and dial?

You can go that route but in addition to the extra complication you
get a performance hit: Stability and dial accuracy are going to be
substantially hurt.

The larger a tuning capacitor is, the more difficult it is to make it
stable.  The W6TC sets use accurate and stable FIXED capacitors for
most of the capacitance; you can then use a fairly inexpensive tuning
cap to do the small amount that must be variable.

I've had good results using caps designed for the FM receivers of that
day. They're just 'consumer grade' but because the FM sets needed
reasonable stability at 88-108 mcs they're not bad at all for an HBR.
Of course the specified caps are nicer but I think any improvement in
stability will be masked by other factors in the design -- wiring and
chassis movement, changes in tube parameters, the fact that zero temp.
coefficient caps aren't, and so on.

The thing about the W6TC sets is that they were designed to allow a
ham of modest technical skills and wallet produce a receiver that was
generally the equal of the best commercial sets for the ham market and
FAR ahead of anything for similar money. You could -- still can --
work about anything on any of the bands they cover. Once you add a
larger variable capacitor (even as a band set cap) and the wiring that
goes with it, equal stability really isn't possible. So you can do
okay on the lower bands on AM but SSB and the higher bands probably
not.

It is true that the Collins receivers -- particularly the military
sets -- did many bands and even general coverage with first-rate
performance. It's also true that they cost ten or more times what a
ham set cost and used techniques that are well beyond hams -- like
precision gears and linear permeability tuning.

As others have said the way to go for WARC bands is to wind coils for
them. Get your receiver built and make at least a couple of coil sets
for the standard bands. Then wind the coils for the additional bands
as desired. You'll end up with a first rate receiver for those bands
and any time you want another, you can wind those coils.

Walt
KJ4KV


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sat Nov  8 17:24:58 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sat, 8 Nov 2014 14:24:58 -0800
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <19025576.20141108170748@earthlink.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
	<545D8797.7040108@comcast.net> <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAFd1PxGSWv9Ksyjsoymb48wBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<993206698.20141108140850@earthlink.net>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAANRyw1jprN1Bl+VWmXse/bwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<19025576.20141108170748@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAACO4OFSWlkJOnBhqjVURYmsBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Walt,

Excellent advice! The stability issue hadn't crossed my mind. Thank you very
much!

Cheers,

Brian

-----Original Message-----
From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Walt Hutchens
Sent: Saturday, November 08, 2014 2:08 PM
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: Re: [HBR] WARC bands?

Brian said:

> So, if you try to extend the range by going to a larger tuning 
> capacitor, you end up in the "general coverage" two dial receiver 
> category, and need the extra complication of a bandspread capacitor and
dial?

You can go that route but in addition to the extra complication you get a
performance hit: Stability and dial accuracy are going to be substantially
hurt.

The larger a tuning capacitor is, the more difficult it is to make it
stable.  The W6TC sets use accurate and stable FIXED capacitors for most of
the capacitance; you can then use a fairly inexpensive tuning cap to do the
small amount that must be variable.

I've had good results using caps designed for the FM receivers of that day.
They're just 'consumer grade' but because the FM sets needed reasonable
stability at 88-108 mcs they're not bad at all for an HBR.
Of course the specified caps are nicer but I think any improvement in
stability will be masked by other factors in the design -- wiring and
chassis movement, changes in tube parameters, the fact that zero temp.
coefficient caps aren't, and so on.

The thing about the W6TC sets is that they were designed to allow a ham of
modest technical skills and wallet produce a receiver that was generally the
equal of the best commercial sets for the ham market and FAR ahead of
anything for similar money. You could -- still can -- work about anything on
any of the bands they cover. Once you add a larger variable capacitor (even
as a band set cap) and the wiring that goes with it, equal stability really
isn't possible. So you can do okay on the lower bands on AM but SSB and the
higher bands probably not.

It is true that the Collins receivers -- particularly the military sets --
did many bands and even general coverage with first-rate performance. It's
also true that they cost ten or more times what a ham set cost and used
techniques that are well beyond hams -- like precision gears and linear
permeability tuning.

As others have said the way to go for WARC bands is to wind coils for them.
Get your receiver built and make at least a couple of coil sets for the
standard bands. Then wind the coils for the additional bands as desired.
You'll end up with a first rate receiver for those bands and any time you
want another, you can wind those coils.

Walt
KJ4KV

______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sun Nov  9 19:41:07 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2014 16:41:07 -0800
Subject: [HBR] "HBR Receiver Data & More" CD
In-Reply-To: <545269CC.4030702@mindspring.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIogmXEwtNNGg0h5b+vSKrcBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<545269CC.4030702@mindspring.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAFmLniH+mKpAg9qrBM2n8SkBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Garey,

I received the CD with the HBR information on it and am enjoying it very
much! I'm printing out the .pdf's, and making a three ring binder of them
for easy reading. Thanks very much for sending it (:->)...

Cheers,

Brian Burns






---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From ianmwilson73 at gmail.com  Sun Nov  9 23:49:14 2014
From: ianmwilson73 at gmail.com (Ian Wilson)
Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2014 20:49:14 -0800
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
	<545D8797.7040108@comcast.net> <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAEz8jcTVCiDKFGsOyg=_2hQYWVBh2vQscY-uhZgyxA-OPqBjZA@mail.gmail.com>

I  think that one problem with the crystal-controlled converter
in front of a tunable IF is that you may decide to adopt that
architecture instead of the HBR! - worked pretty well for Collins,
after all.

73, ian K3IMW

On Sat, Nov 8, 2014 at 3:41 AM, Bill Cromwell <wrcromwell at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Another option is to use a converter ahead of the receiver. Winding the
> coils is a better choice but the converter can get you on those bands until
> the coil sets are working.
>
> 73,
>
> Bill  KU8H
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

From waltah at earthlink.net  Mon Nov 10 08:05:13 2014
From: waltah at earthlink.net (Walt Hutchens)
Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2014 08:05:13 -0500
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <CAEz8jcTVCiDKFGsOyg=_2hQYWVBh2vQscY-uhZgyxA-OPqBjZA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
	<545D8797.7040108@comcast.net> <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
	<CAEz8jcTVCiDKFGsOyg=_2hQYWVBh2vQscY-uhZgyxA-OPqBjZA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1483569228.20141110080513@earthlink.net>

Ian said:

> I  think that one problem with the crystal-controlled converter
> in front of a tunable IF is that you may decide to adopt that
> architecture instead of the HBR! - worked pretty well for Collins,
> after all.

It worked very well for Collins but no receiver using this
architecture could be called 'simple' or 'easily duplicated by a ham
with modest skills.'

The Collins receivers mostly used two or three two IFs, at least one
of them tunable. Often one IF was either shifted or omitted on some
bands. Multiple conversions (and sometimes a varying number of
conversions) make these sets very difficult to design for a strong
signal environment like the ham bands. Collins did it, all right, but
they went out of business because they could never recover the cost of
the engineering.

Never say 'never': There may be situations where a crystal controlled
converter ahead of an HBR is the way to go -- perhaps you're not the
builder of the HBR and you can't do that sort of coil winding: The
coils for a converter ARE simpler, since they usually aren't expected
to deliver any selectivity. And specific coil data will be included
with any description of such a converter.

Converter design is a thing unto itself and if one wants to learn
about it, this might be a good way to go. Equal performance (to just
winding the WARC coils) will be tricky but that could be part of the
fun.

Walt
KJ4KV


From wrcromwell at gmail.com  Mon Nov 10 08:10:44 2014
From: wrcromwell at gmail.com (Bill Cromwell)
Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2014 08:10:44 -0500
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <CAEz8jcTVCiDKFGsOyg=_2hQYWVBh2vQscY-uhZgyxA-OPqBjZA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>	<545D8797.7040108@comcast.net>
	<545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
	<CAEz8jcTVCiDKFGsOyg=_2hQYWVBh2vQscY-uhZgyxA-OPqBjZA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5460B954.3060605@gmail.com>

Hi Ian,

That adds yet another conversion stage to what is already a multi 
conversion lashup. We can avoid one whole set of birdies by making those 
coils so that additional oscillator/mixer is avoided. But the converters 
*are* one means to an end. Have I mentioned that I am now favoring 
single band and even single mode radios? That along with separate TX and 
RX. Whut burdies? Having plug-in coils like the HBR is a step closer to 
a single band receiver.

73,

Bill  KU8H



On 11/09/2014 11:49 PM, Ian Wilson wrote:
> I  think that one problem with the crystal-controlled converter
> in front of a tunable IF is that you may decide to adopt that
> architecture instead of the HBR! - worked pretty well for Collins,
> after all.
>
> 73, ian K3IMW
>
>


From ianmwilson73 at gmail.com  Mon Nov 10 13:59:38 2014
From: ianmwilson73 at gmail.com (Ian Wilson)
Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2014 10:59:38 -0800
Subject: [HBR] WARC bands?
In-Reply-To: <1483569228.20141110080513@earthlink.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD3D/7MAizJFun0r114W2hgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<42687F83-4530-4635-AA99-1B0393D11135@comcast.net>
	<545D8797.7040108@comcast.net> <545E0172.80207@gmail.com>
	<CAEz8jcTVCiDKFGsOyg=_2hQYWVBh2vQscY-uhZgyxA-OPqBjZA@mail.gmail.com>
	<1483569228.20141110080513@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <CAEz8jcTYXt7CbLaOS5+YikR7WYVqGWCpu-RK0=WgfMeR6hX4LA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Walt,

Good points. I have been working for a number of years on
something based on the 75S3 architecture (this project sprang
into existence when I acquired a PTO for $0 at a swap meet.
(It works flawlessly, of course).

Despite occasional successes, this is still far from a usable
receiver. If I had spent the time building an HBR I have no doubt
that I would have had a functional receiver long before now.

I am very glad that this group exists - I have derived much
useful information from it over the past few years.

73, ian K3IMW


On Mon, Nov 10, 2014 at 5:05 AM, Walt Hutchens <waltah at earthlink.net> wrote:

> Ian said:
>
> > I  think that one problem with the crystal-controlled converter
> > in front of a tunable IF is that you may decide to adopt that
> > architecture instead of the HBR! - worked pretty well for Collins,
> > after all.
>
> It worked very well for Collins but no receiver using this
> architecture could be called 'simple' or 'easily duplicated by a ham
> with modest skills.'
>
> The Collins receivers mostly used two or three two IFs, at least one
> of them tunable. Often one IF was either shifted or omitted on some
> bands. Multiple conversions (and sometimes a varying number of
> conversions) make these sets very difficult to design for a strong
> signal environment like the ham bands. Collins did it, all right, but
> they went out of business because they could never recover the cost of
> the engineering.
>
> Never say 'never': There may be situations where a crystal controlled
> converter ahead of an HBR is the way to go -- perhaps you're not the
> builder of the HBR and you can't do that sort of coil winding: The
> coils for a converter ARE simpler, since they usually aren't expected
> to deliver any selectivity. And specific coil data will be included
> with any description of such a converter.
>
> Converter design is a thing unto itself and if one wants to learn
> about it, this might be a good way to go. Equal performance (to just
> winding the WARC coils) will be tricky but that could be part of the
> fun.
>
> Walt
> KJ4KV
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

From ke9xq at charter.net  Thu Nov 13 23:18:34 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (William Wood)
Date: Thu, 13 Nov 2014 22:18:34 -0600
Subject: [HBR] 175 kc cans
Message-ID: <0A2A5B5B-8E44-4AA3-9460-459A72B96776@charter.net>

Just left eBay, and almost bid on three Ifs,
but did not do so, in case one of you were
the first bidder, I will bow out of the bidding
process.  Not to be too much of a gentleman,
I think I just scored 2 85 KC cans, and while
I am still looking for 1600 KC, I feel better 
now that My parts list is getting closer to
fruition.  

If I don?t hear from you guys before too long, 
I might have to break down and get those cans : )
lemme know

73
Bill


From ke9xq at charter.net  Thu Nov 13 23:21:17 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (William Wood)
Date: Thu, 13 Nov 2014 22:21:17 -0600
Subject: [HBR] Lost CD
Message-ID: <31A645DC-00F1-46EB-8A81-8673BC65DB47@charter.net>

Greetings once again
   Cannot find my CD of the HBR archives,
If I can talk one of you out of a copy, would
love to do so, otherwise, need to order a fresh
copy?
Looked for it, as I have a fresh convert here
In La Crosse, that is going to start looking 
for his own parts.
And, no Brian, I won?t give him your
capacitor : )
73 Guys
Bill  KE9XQ

From brian at lessonsinlutherie.com  Sun Nov 16 12:00:45 2014
From: brian at lessonsinlutherie.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 09:00:45 -0800
Subject: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>

Hello All,

 

In Richard McCartney's article on adding an A.M. detector ( QST April 1963 )
he refers to his schematic as having "Changes and additions in red". I don't
think that QST was being published with any of the interior text in color as
early as 1963. Has anybody got a copy of that schematic with the changes
indicated somehow?

 

Thanks,

 

Brian

 



---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

From mcinsand at gmail.com  Sun Nov 16 12:30:54 2014
From: mcinsand at gmail.com (Stan McIntosh)
Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 12:30:54 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <CAKVLtWN6rVhnr7L8vU4ZFEPwMgxEzSV=Jo14YcxQeka86A0_pA@mail.gmail.com>

I can make absolutely sure when I get home, but I remember being surprised
at the circuit portions being in red when looking through that QST issue
after a friend gave me a copy.

Regards,
Stan
Kd4bth

From mmarris at notecraft.com  Sun Nov 16 13:11:32 2014
From: mmarris at notecraft.com (Martin Marris)
Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 13:11:32 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition
In-Reply-To: <CAKVLtWN6rVhnr7L8vU4ZFEPwMgxEzSV=Jo14YcxQeka86A0_pA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<CAKVLtWN6rVhnr7L8vU4ZFEPwMgxEzSV=Jo14YcxQeka86A0_pA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <002001d001c8$c0798220$416c8660$@notecraft.com>

Hi,

QST had a two-color printing process fairly early on, allowing use of "spot"
red inside the book. This was common "back in the day" when the full-color
(four-color cmyk process) was very expensive, so publishers made judicious
use of a single extra color and even, shades of that color (so you could
have not just red, but shades such as pink).

Regards,

Martin

-----Original Message-----
From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Stan McIntosh
Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2014 12:31
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: Re: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition

I can make absolutely sure when I get home, but I remember being surprised
at the circuit portions being in red when looking through that QST issue
after a friend gave me a copy.

Regards,
Stan
Kd4bth
______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html



From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sun Nov 16 13:37:01 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 10:37:01 -0800
Subject: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition
In-Reply-To: <002001d001c8$c0798220$416c8660$@notecraft.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<CAKVLtWN6rVhnr7L8vU4ZFEPwMgxEzSV=Jo14YcxQeka86A0_pA@mail.gmail.com>
	<002001d001c8$c0798220$416c8660$@notecraft.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAPrRGQWrP5ZNk8FEBg1mDvYBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Stan and Martin,

Thanks for the quick response guys!

~ QST had a two-color printing process fairly early on, allowing use of
"spot"
red inside the book. This was common "back in the day" when the full-color
(four-color cmyk process) was very expensive, so publishers made judicious
use of a single extra color and even, shades of that color (so you could
have not just red, but shades such as pink).

~ Regards,

~ Martin

Well, dog my cats! I remember the cover ads having spot color, but I really
don't remember any color in the interior. Ya learn something every day
(:->)...

So is there a color copy of that schematic posted anywhere? I've been all
over the "Site" looking for it.

Cheers,

Brian

-----Original Message-----
From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Stan McIntosh
Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2014 12:31
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: Re: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition

I can make absolutely sure when I get home, but I remember being surprised
at the circuit portions being in red when looking through that QST issue
after a friend gave me a copy.

Regards,
Stan
Kd4bth
______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From johnmb at nc.rr.com  Sun Nov 16 17:12:04 2014
From: johnmb at nc.rr.com (john)
Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 17:12:04 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/
	7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20141116171021.025ee010@pop-server.nc.rr.com>

I just pulled the 1963 volume off the shelf and indeed page 38 and 39 have 
redlined sections of schematic.

Cheers,
John K5MO


At 12:00 PM 11/16/2014, Brian Burns wrote:
>Hello All,
>
>
>
>In Richard McCartney's article on adding an A.M. detector ( QST April 1963 )
>he refers to his schematic as having "Changes and additions in red". I don't
>think that QST was being published with any of the interior text in color as
>early as 1963. Has anybody got a copy of that schematic with the changes
>indicated somehow?
>
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>
>
>Brian
>
>
>
>
>
>---
>This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
>protection is active.
>http://www.avast.com
>______________________________________________________________
>HBR mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

III 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From johnmb at nc.rr.com  Sun Nov 16 17:12:04 2014
From: johnmb at nc.rr.com (john)
Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 17:12:04 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/
	7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20141116171021.025ee010@pop-server.nc.rr.com>

I just pulled the 1963 volume off the shelf and indeed page 38 and 39 have 
redlined sections of schematic.

Cheers,
John K5MO


At 12:00 PM 11/16/2014, Brian Burns wrote:
>Hello All,
>
>
>
>In Richard McCartney's article on adding an A.M. detector ( QST April 1963 )
>he refers to his schematic as having "Changes and additions in red". I don't
>think that QST was being published with any of the interior text in color as
>early as 1963. Has anybody got a copy of that schematic with the changes
>indicated somehow?
>
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>
>
>Brian
>
>
>
>
>
>---
>This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
>protection is active.
>http://www.avast.com
>______________________________________________________________
>HBR mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

III 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sun Nov 16 17:25:12 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 14:25:12 -0800
Subject: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.2.20141116171021.025ee010@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<6.2.1.2.2.20141116171021.025ee010@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAACfq58NYtc9MkQFVhs63D+YBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello John,

~ I just pulled the 1963 volume off the shelf and indeed page 38 and 39 have
redlined sections of schematic.

Thanks for checking that out (:->)...Do you have a way of scanning it for
distribution? I rather expected to see it on Kees' CD, and it might be on
Jay's CD, though my copy of that hasn't arrived yet.

Cheers,

Brian


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From mcinsand at gmail.com  Sun Nov 16 18:21:37 2014
From: mcinsand at gmail.com (Stan McIntosh)
Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 18:21:37 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition
In-Reply-To: <002001d001c8$c0798220$416c8660$@notecraft.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<CAKVLtWN6rVhnr7L8vU4ZFEPwMgxEzSV=Jo14YcxQeka86A0_pA@mail.gmail.com>
	<002001d001c8$c0798220$416c8660$@notecraft.com>
Message-ID: <CAKVLtWPRUAKo3UHyAseYyoPXK1ebmQ--4wmzVZKP3cqOMR4T2w@mail.gmail.com>

If one of y'all don't have ability to color scan, I do.  Might have to wait
until Tuesday, though.

From johnmb at nc.rr.com  Sun Nov 16 18:27:33 2014
From: johnmb at nc.rr.com (john)
Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 18:27:33 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR-8//11 AM Phone addition
In-Reply-To: <CAKVLtWPRUAKo3UHyAseYyoPXK1ebmQ--4wmzVZKP3cqOMR4T2w@mail.g
	mail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<CAKVLtWN6rVhnr7L8vU4ZFEPwMgxEzSV=Jo14YcxQeka86A0_pA@mail.gmail.com>
	<002001d001c8$c0798220$416c8660$@notecraft.com>
	<CAKVLtWPRUAKo3UHyAseYyoPXK1ebmQ--4wmzVZKP3cqOMR4T2w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20141116182649.0353dd90@pop-server.nc.rr.com>

I'll try and do it tomorrow. My volumes are bound so it might be tricky but 
I think the "red" parts are at the far end from the spine, which s/b fine.

73
John K5MO


At 06:21 PM 11/16/2014, you wrote:
>If one of y'all don't have ability to color scan, I do.  Might have to wait
>until Tuesday, though.
>______________________________________________________________
>HBR mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

III 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sun Nov 16 18:40:01 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2014 15:40:01 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Color scan
In-Reply-To: <CAKVLtWPRUAKo3UHyAseYyoPXK1ebmQ--4wmzVZKP3cqOMR4T2w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAP/7qBuWOWRLi+JBv5cnpdoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<CAKVLtWN6rVhnr7L8vU4ZFEPwMgxEzSV=Jo14YcxQeka86A0_pA@mail.gmail.com>
	<002001d001c8$c0798220$416c8660$@notecraft.com>
	<CAKVLtWPRUAKo3UHyAseYyoPXK1ebmQ--4wmzVZKP3cqOMR4T2w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAACqjxE6xjEFIlGm2Z3jDwFkBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Stan and John,

~ If one of y'all don't have ability to color scan, I do.  Might have to
wait
until Tuesday, though.

Thanks a bunch guys! I'm really interested in AM, and would like to add that
detector. There is no rush. I stopped hurrying when I turned 65, and that
was 9 years ago.

By the way, when I was first a ham as W5BRO in South Texas, we used to
pronounce code with a southern accent, as in:

Daw-di~ut-daw-di~ut  daw-daw-di~ut-daw  Notice that the dits had two
syllables.

Cheers,

Brian


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From brian at lessonsinlutherie.com  Mon Nov 17 11:36:30 2014
From: brian at lessonsinlutherie.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2014 08:36:30 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Product detector for CW?
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMh54N+UuJVEjA/tcxUHt+8BAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>

Hello All,

 

Having never used one, I'm wondering about the usefulness of a product
detector for CW. I'm set up for SSB with a Kenwood TS-530S, and don't expect
to ever use an HBR for that. 

 

Reaching back 60 years in memory, I seem to recall that the product detector
had some advantage in cancelling noise, and that would certainly be
worthwhile.

 

So, for just AM and CW use, I'm thinking that it might simplify things to
just go for the infinite impedance detector in the HBR-14. It's clear from
his writings that Ted wasn't interested in AM. If I remember rightly he
called it "ancient modulation".

 

Cheers,

 

Brian

 

 

 

 



---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

From radio at daileyservices.com  Mon Nov 17 20:10:26 2014
From: radio at daileyservices.com (radio at daileyservices.com)
Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2014 18:10:26 -0700
Subject: [HBR] Product detector for CW?
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMh54N+UuJVEjA/tcxUHt+8BAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <B08C1AB998E54342A3C734BCC848B930@w0eaj>

Brian,

Basically (distilling this down), the PD enables CW and SSB reception 
WITHOUT clamping down the AVC/AGC function, like usually occurs with turning 
the audio gain UP and using the RF gain as the volume control.  Best demo I 
ever saw was on the Drake 2B (that I love and have).. the difference between 
modes is VERY OBVIOUS.

TC 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Tue Nov 18 10:40:59 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2014 07:40:59 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Product detector for CW?
In-Reply-To: <B08C1AB998E54342A3C734BCC848B930@w0eaj>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMh54N+UuJVEjA/tcxUHt+8BAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<B08C1AB998E54342A3C734BCC848B930@w0eaj>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAC36XB53IbFGlDno6sL6cTEBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello TC,

~ Basically (distilling this down), the PD enables CW and SSB reception
WITHOUT clamping down the AVC/AGC function, like usually occurs with turning
the audio gain UP and using the RF gain as the volume control.  Best demo I
ever saw was on the Drake 2B (that I love and have).. the difference between
modes is VERY OBVIOUS.

~ TC

So, it sounds like the product detector is well worth building into an HBR
for CW. And I can imagine that there will be situations where I would like
to have good SSB reception as well.

Thanks a bunch for answering my question!

Cheers,

Brian


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From ke9xq at charter.net  Wed Nov 19 22:10:53 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (William Wood)
Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2014 21:10:53 -0600
Subject: [HBR] 85 KHz IFs
Message-ID: <A338ED14-D599-4BFC-B1A5-587DA4A21888@charter.net>

Greetings Folks
   Traveled a short distance today to pick up my new
85 KHz Ifs, and a 65 KHz IF if that thing is labeled right.
2 x 85 and 1 x 65  I wonder what the range will be on each?
36 miles away, 72 round trip, but the roads were in good 
winter driving conditions.  And well worth the little side trip : )
Can?t remember what the gent said that they came out of, I
think it was a BC 453???   Do not remember the facts, just
know I?m getting closer to the parts listed that is needed.

   Have a few shorter cans too, do not know what they are
as of yet, but they came out of the same receiver.

   Did you guys modify the base, these are female holes
that sit down over pins.  Can?t remember how they were
put into action, I guess I need to find that printout : )

   Now I have to find that schematic again and see
what I needed.  Had a thought today, I have a bunch of 
Octals, and was thinking of going the octal route, but I
think I shot that down right away for two reasons.  One is my 
lack of technical skills to do all the sub work, and the second is
probably the newer miniature tubes would have better all
around performance.  

   Now that I argued myself out of that idea folks, any ideas
pro or con on the subject???   I like the ?older? idea, but
newer idea is better performance?

   Kees or someone, I know I printed out the book materials
and have it around here ?somewhere? I still would like to get
a copy of the CD again, Happy to pay the ten spot.  I think
I wrote to the other gent that archived the history and offered
to buy his disk too, but still have not heard from him.

   Think I will go to the archiving sites tonight, and se if I can
at least download the schematic for the HBR 13C so I can
ruminate a bit more on the subject : )

73 Everyone
Bill  KE9XQ

PS  Keep digging, those parts are out there, some of which 
might take a couple of years to find, but they are there, 
I have faith in our hunting abilities : )  

PSS the tubes that came in the little box were:
12A6 GT, 12SK7 GT, 12SK7 GT, VT131 (ANOTHER 12SK7)
12SR7, AND A 12K8.  If that gives anyone a hint as to where
the parts came from.  Cheers

From tshoppa at wmata.com  Thu Nov 20 08:03:41 2014
From: tshoppa at wmata.com (Shoppa, Tim)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 13:03:41 +0000
Subject: [HBR] 85 KHz IFs
In-Reply-To: <A338ED14-D599-4BFC-B1A5-587DA4A21888@charter.net>
References: <A338ED14-D599-4BFC-B1A5-587DA4A21888@charter.net>
Message-ID: <303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73B86D6@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>

That tube lineup you mention sure sounds like a BC-453.

Tim N3QE

Sent from my Windows Phone
________________________________
From: William Wood<mailto:ke9xq at charter.net>
Sent: ?11/?19/?2014 10:11 PM
To: hbr at mailman.qth.net<mailto:hbr at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: [HBR] 85 KHz IFs

Greetings Folks
   Traveled a short distance today to pick up my new
85 KHz Ifs, and a 65 KHz IF if that thing is labeled right.
2 x 85 and 1 x 65  I wonder what the range will be on each?
36 miles away, 72 round trip, but the roads were in good
winter driving conditions.  And well worth the little side trip : )
Can?t remember what the gent said that they came out of, I
think it was a BC 453???   Do not remember the facts, just
know I?m getting closer to the parts listed that is needed.

   Have a few shorter cans too, do not know what they are
as of yet, but they came out of the same receiver.

   Did you guys modify the base, these are female holes
that sit down over pins.  Can?t remember how they were
put into action, I guess I need to find that printout : )

   Now I have to find that schematic again and see
what I needed.  Had a thought today, I have a bunch of
Octals, and was thinking of going the octal route, but I
think I shot that down right away for two reasons.  One is my
lack of technical skills to do all the sub work, and the second is
probably the newer miniature tubes would have better all
around performance.

   Now that I argued myself out of that idea folks, any ideas
pro or con on the subject???   I like the ?older? idea, but
newer idea is better performance?

   Kees or someone, I know I printed out the book materials
and have it around here ?somewhere? I still would like to get
a copy of the CD again, Happy to pay the ten spot.  I think
I wrote to the other gent that archived the history and offered
to buy his disk too, but still have not heard from him.

   Think I will go to the archiving sites tonight, and se if I can
at least download the schematic for the HBR 13C so I can
ruminate a bit more on the subject : )

73 Everyone
Bill  KE9XQ

PS  Keep digging, those parts are out there, some of which
might take a couple of years to find, but they are there,
I have faith in our hunting abilities : )

PSS the tubes that came in the little box were:
12A6 GT, 12SK7 GT, 12SK7 GT, VT131 (ANOTHER 12SK7)
12SR7, AND A 12K8.  If that gives anyone a hint as to where
the parts came from.  Cheers
______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From radioconnection at gmail.com  Thu Nov 20 10:08:39 2014
From: radioconnection at gmail.com (Peter Bertini)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 10:08:39 -0500
Subject: [HBR] 85 KHz IFs
In-Reply-To: <303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73B86D6@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>
References: <A338ED14-D599-4BFC-B1A5-587DA4A21888@charter.net>
	<303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73B86D6@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>
Message-ID: <CA+uDY2QA7YF5ZYSTtQXyeA3XxX94ooPOM-eEG5QpfVZCMC6pzg@mail.gmail.com>

Those IF cans had a very, very narrow tuning range, the trimmer caps were
too small value to have much authority over the IF frequency. You may want
to add some external fixed padders or trimmers to get them exactly on
frequency.  The neat feature of those cans is that you can remove that
little black cover, and adjust the coupling between the coils to set the
bandwidth.

Some guys have salvaged the mica sockets and male connectors from the old
BC-xxx chassis in order to use the existing mounting system.  You can
directly solder to the female terminals on the base of the transformers,
however.

Pete

On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 8:03 AM, Shoppa, Tim <tshoppa at wmata.com> wrote:

> That tube lineup you mention sure sounds like a BC-453.
>
> Tim N3QE
>
> Sent from my Windows Phone
> ________________________________
> From: William Wood<mailto:ke9xq at charter.net>
> Sent: 11/19/2014 10:11 PM
> To: hbr at mailman.qth.net<mailto:hbr at mailman.qth.net>
> Subject: [HBR] 85 KHz IFs
>
> Greetings Folks
>    Traveled a short distance today to pick up my new
> 85 KHz Ifs, and a 65 KHz IF if that thing is labeled right.
> 2 x 85 and 1 x 65  I wonder what the range will be on each?
> 36 miles away, 72 round trip, but the roads were in good
> winter driving conditions.  And well worth the little side trip : )
> Can't remember what the gent said that they came out of, I
> think it was a BC 453???   Do not remember the facts, just
> know I'm getting closer to the parts listed that is needed.
>
>    Have a few shorter cans too, do not know what they are
> as of yet, but they came out of the same receiver.
>
>    Did you guys modify the base, these are female holes
> that sit down over pins.  Can't remember how they were
> put into action, I guess I need to find that printout : )
>
>    Now I have to find that schematic again and see
> what I needed.  Had a thought today, I have a bunch of
> Octals, and was thinking of going the octal route, but I
> think I shot that down right away for two reasons.  One is my
> lack of technical skills to do all the sub work, and the second is
> probably the newer miniature tubes would have better all
> around performance.
>
>    Now that I argued myself out of that idea folks, any ideas
> pro or con on the subject???   I like the "older" idea, but
> newer idea is better performance...
>
>    Kees or someone, I know I printed out the book materials
> and have it around here 'somewhere' I still would like to get
> a copy of the CD again, Happy to pay the ten spot.  I think
> I wrote to the other gent that archived the history and offered
> to buy his disk too, but still have not heard from him.
>
>    Think I will go to the archiving sites tonight, and se if I can
> at least download the schematic for the HBR 13C so I can
> ruminate a bit more on the subject : )
>
> 73 Everyone
> Bill  KE9XQ
>
> PS  Keep digging, those parts are out there, some of which
> might take a couple of years to find, but they are there,
> I have faith in our hunting abilities : )
>
> PSS the tubes that came in the little box were:
> 12A6 GT, 12SK7 GT, 12SK7 GT, VT131 (ANOTHER 12SK7)
> 12SR7, AND A 12K8.  If that gives anyone a hint as to where
> the parts came from.  Cheers
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

From smithab11 at comcast.net  Thu Nov 20 10:36:46 2014
From: smithab11 at comcast.net (B. Smith)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 10:36:46 -0500
Subject: [HBR] 85 KHz IFs
In-Reply-To: <CA+uDY2QA7YF5ZYSTtQXyeA3XxX94ooPOM-eEG5QpfVZCMC6pzg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <A338ED14-D599-4BFC-B1A5-587DA4A21888@charter.net>	<303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73B86D6@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>
	<CA+uDY2QA7YF5ZYSTtQXyeA3XxX94ooPOM-eEG5QpfVZCMC6pzg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <546E0A8E.9010006@comcast.net>

Those coils work very well as is. See for info including mounting and 
alternate mounting schemes.
http://k4che.com/HBR/IF%20Coil%20Pages%20and%20Photos/IF%20Coil%20Selection.htm

breck k4che

On 11/20/2014 10:08 AM, Peter Bertini wrote:
> Those IF cans had a very, very narrow tuning range, the trimmer caps were
> too small value to have much authority over the IF frequency. You may want
> to add some external fixed padders or trimmers to get them exactly on
> frequency.  The neat feature of those cans is that you can remove that
> little black cover, and adjust the coupling between the coils to set the
> bandwidth.
>
> Some guys have salvaged the mica sockets and male connectors from the old
> BC-xxx chassis in order to use the existing mounting system.  You can
> directly solder to the female terminals on the base of the transformers,
> however.
>
> Pete
>
> On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 8:03 AM, Shoppa, Tim <tshoppa at wmata.com> wrote:
>
>> That tube lineup you mention sure sounds like a BC-453.
>>
>> Tim N3QE
>>
>> Sent from my Windows Phone
>> ________________________________
>> From: William Wood<mailto:ke9xq at charter.net>
>> Sent: 11/19/2014 10:11 PM
>> To: hbr at mailman.qth.net<mailto:hbr at mailman.qth.net>
>> Subject: [HBR] 85 KHz IFs
>>
>> Greetings Folks
>>     Traveled a short distance today to pick up my new
>> 85 KHz Ifs, and a 65 KHz IF if that thing is labeled right.
>> 2 x 85 and 1 x 65  I wonder what the range will be on each?
>> 36 miles away, 72 round trip, but the roads were in good
>> winter driving conditions.  And well worth the little side trip : )
>> Can't remember what the gent said that they came out of, I
>> think it was a BC 453???   Do not remember the facts, just
>> know I'm getting closer to the parts listed that is needed.
>>
>>     Have a few shorter cans too, do not know what they are
>> as of yet, but they came out of the same receiver.
>>
>>     Did you guys modify the base, these are female holes
>> that sit down over pins.  Can't remember how they were
>> put into action, I guess I need to find that printout : )
>>
>>     Now I have to find that schematic again and see
>> what I needed.  Had a thought today, I have a bunch of
>> Octals, and was thinking of going the octal route, but I
>> think I shot that down right away for two reasons.  One is my
>> lack of technical skills to do all the sub work, and the second is
>> probably the newer miniature tubes would have better all
>> around performance.
>>
>>     Now that I argued myself out of that idea folks, any ideas
>> pro or con on the subject???   I like the "older" idea, but
>> newer idea is better performance...
>>
>>     Kees or someone, I know I printed out the book materials
>> and have it around here 'somewhere' I still would like to get
>> a copy of the CD again, Happy to pay the ten spot.  I think
>> I wrote to the other gent that archived the history and offered
>> to buy his disk too, but still have not heard from him.
>>
>>     Think I will go to the archiving sites tonight, and se if I can
>> at least download the schematic for the HBR 13C so I can
>> ruminate a bit more on the subject : )
>>
>> 73 Everyone
>> Bill  KE9XQ
>>
>> PS  Keep digging, those parts are out there, some of which
>> might take a couple of years to find, but they are there,
>> I have faith in our hunting abilities : )
>>
>> PSS the tubes that came in the little box were:
>> 12A6 GT, 12SK7 GT, 12SK7 GT, VT131 (ANOTHER 12SK7)
>> 12SR7, AND A 12K8.  If that gives anyone a hint as to where
>> the parts came from.  Cheers
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> HBR mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> HBR mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Thu Nov 20 11:02:57 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 08:02:57 -0800
Subject: [HBR] 85 KHz IFs
In-Reply-To: <A338ED14-D599-4BFC-B1A5-587DA4A21888@charter.net>
References: <A338ED14-D599-4BFC-B1A5-587DA4A21888@charter.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAANo+ddAU2idPinUyURcjN2ABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Bill,

~ Traveled a short distance today to pick up my new
85 KHz Ifs, and a 65 KHz IF if that thing is labeled right.
2 x 85 and 1 x 65.  

I'll bet you a nickel that third I.F. can is in fact 85 kc too. The 6 could
be a damaged 8. The identification numbers for the three 85 kc cans from the
BC 453 are:

4698

7267

4677

They are all 85 kc.

I know all this stuff thanks to Ken Gordon's emailing attachments of
schematics and pictorial drawings to me---THANKS AGAIN KEN!

So Bill, I have forwarded Ken's attachments to your KE9 email address.

Cheers,

Brian


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From ke9xq at charter.net  Thu Nov 20 11:15:18 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 11:15:18 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] 85 KHz IFs
Message-ID: <54f22492.54c42.149cdfc8657.Webtop.46@charter.net>

Thanks for all the feed back and links : )
Helped me a LOT : )
I'm going to tear abart my little storage
area to hopefully find my 3 ring binder with
notes, and my CD : )
Thanks again guys
73
Bill  KE9XQ




On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 9:36 AM, B. Smith wrote:

> Those coils work very well as is. See for info including mounting and 
> alternate mounting schemes.
> 
> http://k4che.com/HBR/IF%20Coil%20Pages%20and%20Photos/IF%20Coil%20Selection.htm
>
> breck k4che
>
> On 11/20/2014 10:08 AM, Peter Bertini wrote:
>> Those IF cans had a very, very narrow tuning range, the trimmer caps 
>> were
>> too small value to have much authority over the IF frequency. You may 
>> want
>> to add some external fixed padders or trimmers to get them exactly on
>> frequency.  The neat feature of those cans is that you can remove 
>> that
>> little black cover, and adjust the coupling between the coils to set 
>> the
>> bandwidth.
>>
>> Some guys have salvaged the mica sockets and male connectors from the 
>> old
>> BC-xxx chassis in order to use the existing mounting system.  You can
>> directly solder to the female terminals on the base of the 
>> transformers,
>> however.
>>
>> Pete
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 8:03 AM, Shoppa, Tim <tshoppa at wmata.com> 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> That tube lineup you mention sure sounds like a BC-453.
>>>
>>> Tim N3QE
>>>
>>> Sent from my Windows Phone
>>> ________________________________
>>> From: William Wood<mailto:ke9xq at charter.net>
>>> Sent: 11/19/2014 10:11 PM
>>> To: hbr at mailman.qth.net<mailto:hbr at mailman.qth.net>
>>> Subject: [HBR] 85 KHz IFs
>>>
>>> Greetings Folks
>>>     Traveled a short distance today to pick up my new
>>> 85 KHz Ifs, and a 65 KHz IF if that thing is labeled right.
>>> 2 x 85 and 1 x 65  I wonder what the range will be on each?
>>> 36 miles away, 72 round trip, but the roads were in good
>>> winter driving conditions.  And well worth the little side trip : )
>>> Can't remember what the gent said that they came out of, I
>>> think it was a BC 453???   Do not remember the facts, just
>>> know I'm getting closer to the parts listed that is needed.
>>>
>>>     Have a few shorter cans too, do not know what they are
>>> as of yet, but they came out of the same receiver.
>>>
>>>     Did you guys modify the base, these are female holes
>>> that sit down over pins.  Can't remember how they were
>>> put into action, I guess I need to find that printout : )
>>>
>>>     Now I have to find that schematic again and see
>>> what I needed.  Had a thought today, I have a bunch of
>>> Octals, and was thinking of going the octal route, but I
>>> think I shot that down right away for two reasons.  One is my
>>> lack of technical skills to do all the sub work, and the second is
>>> probably the newer miniature tubes would have better all
>>> around performance.
>>>
>>>     Now that I argued myself out of that idea folks, any ideas
>>> pro or con on the subject???   I like the "older" idea, but
>>> newer idea is better performance...
>>>
>>>     Kees or someone, I know I printed out the book materials
>>> and have it around here 'somewhere' I still would like to get
>>> a copy of the CD again, Happy to pay the ten spot.  I think
>>> I wrote to the other gent that archived the history and offered
>>> to buy his disk too, but still have not heard from him.
>>>
>>>     Think I will go to the archiving sites tonight, and se if I can
>>> at least download the schematic for the HBR 13C so I can
>>> ruminate a bit more on the subject : )
>>>
>>> 73 Everyone
>>> Bill  KE9XQ
>>>
>>> PS  Keep digging, those parts are out there, some of which
>>> might take a couple of years to find, but they are there,
>>> I have faith in our hunting abilities : )
>>>
>>> PSS the tubes that came in the little box were:
>>> 12A6 GT, 12SK7 GT, 12SK7 GT, VT131 (ANOTHER 12SK7)
>>> 12SR7, AND A 12K8.  If that gives anyone a hint as to where
>>> the parts came from.  Cheers
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> HBR mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> HBR mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> HBR mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From luv.myipad3 at me.com  Thu Nov 20 13:33:17 2014
From: luv.myipad3 at me.com (Michael Zolno)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 13:33:17 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
Message-ID: <4280ECD6-A540-4237-83D6-6E8FB024A85A@me.com>

GM, GA, es GE all,

Forgive the retransmission of old news...

I'm willing to pay expenses for a copy of Kees CD as he just replied to my request to say ask the group here as his is no longer usable. I believed I had a viable source, but that has dried up so I present my request to the group at large to obtain a copy. 

All my very best,

Tnx es vy 73

Mike WH6YH

Sent from my iPad

From hbr at mailman.qth.net  Thu Nov 20 13:43:53 2014
From: hbr at mailman.qth.net (Lee Craner via HBR)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 13:43:53 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
Message-ID: <8b35.29d6de3b.419f9067@aol.com>

Mike:
 
Since Kees has given permission to supply copies, I'd be glad to burn you a 
 copy.  Give me your address.
 
73
Lee WB6SSW
 
 
In a message dated 11/20/2014 10:38:56 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,  
luv.myipad3 at me.com writes:

GM, GA,  es GE all,

Forgive the retransmission of old news...

I'm willing  to pay expenses for a copy of Kees CD as he just replied to my 
request to say  ask the group here as his is no longer usable. I believed I 
had a viable  source, but that has dried up so I present my request to the 
group at large to  obtain a copy. 

All my very best,

Tnx es vy 73

Mike  WH6YH

Sent from my  iPad
______________________________________________________________
HBR  mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help:  http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


From mcinsand at gmail.com  Thu Nov 20 13:52:14 2014
From: mcinsand at gmail.com (Stan McIntosh)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 13:52:14 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
Message-ID: <CAKVLtWMuMSDj-sGMd_mOx_P3=Mhc1++Mb1i56J4dtSGFUQh18Q@mail.gmail.com>

Just a thought, given the amount of free upload/share space on Google
Drive, would uploading an ISO image be an option?  Then, as long as those
of us that are interested are added to the list, we could download without
a need for someone to burn and mail a CD.

Regards,
Stan
kd4bth

From rwfish at comcast.net  Thu Nov 20 14:04:59 2014
From: rwfish at comcast.net (Robert Fish)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 11:04:59 -0800
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
In-Reply-To: <CAKVLtWMuMSDj-sGMd_mOx_P3=Mhc1++Mb1i56J4dtSGFUQh18Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKVLtWMuMSDj-sGMd_mOx_P3=Mhc1++Mb1i56J4dtSGFUQh18Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <546E3B5B.2080800@comcast.net>


I am interested in Kees CD also. I bought Jay's book and love it. I 
don't have the one from Kees.
I would be willing to pay for it if necessary.

73,

Bob  K6GGO

> Just a thought, given the amount of free upload/share space on Google
> Drive, would uploading an ISO image be an option?  Then, as long as those
> of us that are interested are added to the list, we could download without
> a need for someone to burn and mail a CD.
>
> Regards,
> Stan
> kd4bth
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>


From ke9xq at charter.net  Thu Nov 20 14:17:58 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 14:17:58 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
Message-ID: <7443360f.579a3.149cea3bf02.Webtop.49@charter.net>

How much was Jay's Book, I asked, but got no response
or I asked the wrong question : )  Anyways, if I can get a
copy, I have a duplicator machine that I would be willing to
replace Kee's copy, and mail on a copy to anyone on our list
that needs a copy.  Mailnly because of the subject matter I
would like to keep it alive for another generation or two : )

I would also put it up for download purposes for those on
our list that would rather go that route.  If I can help with
this in any way possible, just let me know.

73
Bill  KE9XQ
PS That is of course if I don't overstep Kee's ideals.
He definately needs a good copy again.  I've had several
other subjects go south on me, one was some OTR programs,
I dug out the disk, and it was cracked, and it was stored
pretty well, so something happened between put up time
and take down time... (maybe disk aging???)
Cheers


On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 1:04 PM, Robert Fish wrote:

> I am interested in Kees CD also. I bought Jay's book and love it. I 
> don't have the one from Kees.
> I would be willing to pay for it if necessary.
>
> 73,
>
> Bob  K6GGO
>
>> Just a thought, given the amount of free upload/share space on Google
>> Drive, would uploading an ISO image be an option?  Then, as long as 
>> those
>> of us that are interested are added to the list, we could download 
>> without
>> a need for someone to burn and mail a CD.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Stan
>> kd4bth
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> HBR mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From hbr at mailman.qth.net  Thu Nov 20 16:00:10 2014
From: hbr at mailman.qth.net (Lee Craner via HBR)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 16:00:10 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
Message-ID: <c95a.1dcd372.419fb05a@aol.com>

Bill,
 
Jay asks $10 for his eBook.  He's had some medical issues so was out  of 
touch for awhile.  He's now back home.  Drop him a line at 
_cerrogordo at iscweb.com_ (mailto:cerrogordo at iscweb.com)  and try  again.  
 
As to making Kees work available for download, that's his decision so I  
won't go there.
 
73
Lee WB6SSW
 
 
In a message dated 11/20/2014 11:19:35 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,  
ke9xq at charter.net writes:

How much  was Jay's Book, I asked, but got no response
or I asked the wrong question  : )  Anyways, if I can get a
copy, I have a duplicator machine that I  would be willing to
replace Kee's copy, and mail on a copy to anyone on our  list
that needs a copy.  Mailnly because of the subject matter  I
would like to keep it alive for another generation or two : )

I  would also put it up for download purposes for those on
our list that would  rather go that route.  If I can help with
this in any way possible,  just let me know.

73
Bill  KE9XQ
PS That is of course if I  don't overstep Kee's ideals.
He definately needs a good copy again.   I've had several
other subjects go south on me, one was some OTR  programs,
I dug out the disk, and it was cracked, and it was  stored
pretty well, so something happened between put up time
and take  down time... (maybe disk aging???)
Cheers


On Thu, Nov 20, 2014  at 1:04 PM, Robert Fish wrote:

> I am interested in Kees CD also. I  bought Jay's book and love it. I 
> don't have the one from  Kees.
> I would be willing to pay for it if necessary.
>
>  73,
>
> Bob  K6GGO
>
>> Just a thought, given  the amount of free upload/share space on Google
>> Drive, would  uploading an ISO image be an option?  Then, as long as 
>>  those
>> of us that are interested are added to the list, we could  download 
>> without
>> a need for someone to burn and mail  a CD.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Stan
>>  kd4bth
>>  ______________________________________________________________
>> HBR  mailing list
>> Home:  http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>> Help:  http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
>  ______________________________________________________________
> HBR  mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>  Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
______________________________________________________________
HBR  mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help:  http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Thu Nov 20 17:11:34 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 14:11:34 -0800
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
In-Reply-To: <c95a.1dcd372.419fb05a@aol.com>
References: <c95a.1dcd372.419fb05a@aol.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAJWRheeaWmNKh2uoJVcmh2sBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Lee,
 
~ Jay asks $10 for his eBook.  He's had some medical issues so was out  of
touch for awhile.  He's now back home.  Drop him a line at
_cerrogordo at iscweb.com_ (mailto:cerrogordo at iscweb.com)  and try  again.  

Do you happen to know if Jay got his computer working again?

Cheers,

Brian
 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From luv.myipad3 at me.com  Thu Nov 20 18:11:02 2014
From: luv.myipad3 at me.com (Michael Zolno)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 18:11:02 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
Message-ID: <09AFEADF-FE15-4900-9DC5-38E85BFC65DD@me.com>

Hi Lee,

That sounds fantastic; my address on QRZ is correct and Thank you Sir. If you are on PayPal I can send a couple green stamps as a friend to avoid any fees, or in the mail, whichever you prefer. Thank you agn for the kind offer. I'd send directly but my internet is out and I'm on my Verizon MiFi composing this (I had an uneasy feeling driving away from my qth to take my bride to lunch as a pre anniversary event and when we returned the Comcast van parked there earlier was gone and my internet was disconnected). :^(

Stan has a great idea reference making the data available as an ISO; it would certainly provide quicker access, though I feel we would need Kees go ahead before we go that route.

All my very best,

tnx es vy 73

Mike WH6YH 

Sent from my iPad

Mike:

Since Kees has given permission to supply copies, I'd be glad to burn you a 
copy.  Give me your address.

73
Lee WB6SSW

From Gcromer at usit.net  Thu Nov 20 21:34:46 2014
From: Gcromer at usit.net (Gerald Cromer)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 21:34:46 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
In-Reply-To: <546E3B5B.2080800@comcast.net>
References: <CAKVLtWMuMSDj-sGMd_mOx_P3=Mhc1++Mb1i56J4dtSGFUQh18Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<546E3B5B.2080800@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <003858856CEA4406A5CACB866628AA04@gerald2369b375>

Me too
Gerald K4NHN

-----Original Message-----
From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Robert Fish
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:05 PM
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: Re: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD


I am interested in Kees CD also. I bought Jay's book and love it. I 
don't have the one from Kees.
I would be willing to pay for it if necessary.

73,

Bob  K6GGO

> Just a thought, given the amount of free upload/share space on Google
> Drive, would uploading an ISO image be an option?  Then, as long as those
> of us that are interested are added to the list, we could download without
> a need for someone to burn and mail a CD.
>
> Regards,
> Stan
> kd4bth
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


From hbr at mailman.qth.net  Thu Nov 20 21:42:48 2014
From: hbr at mailman.qth.net (Lee Craner via HBR)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 21:42:48 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
Message-ID: <148e3.1de805ee.41a000a8@aol.com>

Gerald,
 
Send me your shipping address.
 
73
Lee WB6SSW
 
 
In a message dated 11/20/2014 6:35:23 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,  
Gcromer at usit.net writes:

Me  too
Gerald K4NHN

-----Original Message-----
From: HBR  [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Robert Fish
Sent:  Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:05 PM
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: Re:  [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD


I am interested in Kees CD  also. I bought Jay's book and love it. I 
don't have the one from  Kees.
I would be willing to pay for it if  necessary.

73,

Bob  K6GGO

> Just a thought, given  the amount of free upload/share space on Google
> Drive, would uploading  an ISO image be an option?  Then, as long as those
> of us that are  interested are added to the list, we could download 
without
> a need for  someone to burn and mail a CD.
>
> Regards,
> Stan
>  kd4bth
>  ______________________________________________________________
> HBR  mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>  Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

______________________________________________________________
HBR  mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help:  http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

______________________________________________________________
HBR  mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help:  http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


From Gcromer at usit.net  Thu Nov 20 22:50:02 2014
From: Gcromer at usit.net (Gerald Cromer)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 22:50:02 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
In-Reply-To: <148e3.1de805ee.41a000a8@aol.com>
References: <148e3.1de805ee.41a000a8@aol.com>
Message-ID: <57BA95A8F84D44CCAA008BE00B670591@gerald2369b375>

73's & thanks

Gerald Cromer
1014 Summerland Dr.
Cayce, SC 29033


-----Original Message-----
From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Lee Craner via
HBR
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 9:43 PM
To: hbr at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD

Gerald,
 
Send me your shipping address.
 
73
Lee WB6SSW
 
 
In a message dated 11/20/2014 6:35:23 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,  
Gcromer at usit.net writes:

Me  too
Gerald K4NHN

-----Original Message-----
From: HBR  [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Robert Fish
Sent:  Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:05 PM
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: Re:  [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD


I am interested in Kees CD  also. I bought Jay's book and love it. I 
don't have the one from  Kees.
I would be willing to pay for it if  necessary.

73,

Bob  K6GGO

> Just a thought, given  the amount of free upload/share space on Google
> Drive, would uploading  an ISO image be an option?  Then, as long as those
> of us that are  interested are added to the list, we could download 
without
> a need for  someone to burn and mail a CD.
>
> Regards,
> Stan
>  kd4bth
>  ______________________________________________________________
> HBR  mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>  Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

______________________________________________________________
HBR  mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help:  http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

______________________________________________________________
HBR  mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help:  http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


From ke9xq at charter.net  Thu Nov 20 23:25:06 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (William Wood)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 22:25:06 -0600
Subject: [HBR] That CD
Message-ID: <73397B15-454B-4C2C-BF97-A5EC5104B3AA@charter.net>

OK Guys
   I did just download that order form
and wrote Jay for a fresh copy : )  Thanks 
to all with the info and such.  Now is there
another source???   I think rather slowly 
sometimes, and thought I heard there was 
another source of the HBR history and info???   
Jay W6HHT is one, I just sent for it, now who 
what when where why How do I get this other 
info, if there is any : )  
   Back to Jay?s material, I did tear apart my little 
corner of goodies to try to find the disk and print 
out, but they are not there, hopefully did not store
them in the basement, it might take me all winter 
to find it there : )
Thanks Again
73
Bill  KE9XQ

From rwfish at comcast.net  Thu Nov 20 23:44:53 2014
From: rwfish at comcast.net (Robert Fish)
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 20:44:53 -0800
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
In-Reply-To: <148e3.1de805ee.41a000a8@aol.com>
References: <148e3.1de805ee.41a000a8@aol.com>
Message-ID: <546EC345.8030204@comcast.net>

I guess I don't qualify. I think I will just move on.

Thanks & 73,

Bob  K6GGO

> Gerald,
>   
> Send me your shipping address.
>   
> 73
> Lee WB6SSW
>   
>   
> In a message dated 11/20/2014 6:35:23 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,
> Gcromer at usit.net writes:
>
> Me  too
> Gerald K4NHN
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: HBR  [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Robert Fish
> Sent:  Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:05 PM
> To: HBR Receiver List
> Subject: Re:  [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
>
>
> I am interested in Kees CD  also. I bought Jay's book and love it. I
> don't have the one from  Kees.
> I would be willing to pay for it if  necessary.
>
> 73,
>
> Bob  K6GGO
>
>> Just a thought, given  the amount of free upload/share space on Google
>> Drive, would uploading  an ISO image be an option?  Then, as long as those
>> of us that are  interested are added to the list, we could download
> without
>> a need for  someone to burn and mail a CD.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Stan
>>   kd4bth
>>   ______________________________________________________________
>> HBR  mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>>   Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR  mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help:  http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR  mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help:  http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post:  mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by:  http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list:  http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>


From radioconnection at gmail.com  Fri Nov 21 10:29:18 2014
From: radioconnection at gmail.com (Peter Bertini)
Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2014 10:29:18 -0500
Subject: [HBR] HBR Receiver Data & More CD
In-Reply-To: <4280ECD6-A540-4237-83D6-6E8FB024A85A@me.com>
References: <4280ECD6-A540-4237-83D6-6E8FB024A85A@me.com>
Message-ID: <CA+uDY2QQZr+7vcrcOdYCZaf2qRCBkqQHBbUqixqyD8WyrpedTQ@mail.gmail.com>

Kee's ad is still running in CQ Magazine...  I'd also like to buy a copy of
the HBR CD. If someone can provide one, I will gladly pay the costs, and
also ensure that Kee's receives his ten dollar share for his efforts in
compiling the information.

Has anyone considered sending Kee's a good copy of the disc for his own use
and records?

Peter   k1zjh

On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 1:33 PM, Michael Zolno <luv.myipad3 at me.com> wrote:

> GM, GA, es GE all,
>
> Forgive the retransmission of old news...
>
> I'm willing to pay expenses for a copy of Kees CD as he just replied to my
> request to say ask the group here as his is no longer usable. I believed I
> had a viable source, but that has dried up so I present my request to the
> group at large to obtain a copy.
>
> All my very best,
>
> Tnx es vy 73
>
> Mike WH6YH
>
> Sent from my iPad
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

From ke9xq at charter.net  Fri Nov 21 13:25:59 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (William Wood)
Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2014 12:25:59 -0600
Subject: [HBR] Opps apologies to our moderator I sent this VIA an alternate
	mailing address
Message-ID: <086E82B0-CCA1-4C76-8B70-132265CB66DC@charter.net>

Anyone do any substitution analyzing of that
idea of using Octals instead of the miniatures
called for???

Think like I said, will stay with the ones called 
for, but it might be fun to see which ones would
be subbed out with which Octals???

Juss thinkin

73
Bill  KE9XQ

From ke9xq at charter.net  Fri Nov 21 16:25:51 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (William Wood)
Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2014 15:25:51 -0600
Subject: [HBR] That CD again One more try with this email : ) I can't seem
	to mail easily with the old address : )
Message-ID: <D454803A-CBA1-4E08-B376-2EF50FC2516C@charter.net>

I?m using a different mailing program
with an alternate mailing address, and
forget to use the proper address I signed
up with for the HBR group : )  Sorry OM

Here?s the post I made earlier, and could
not figure out why id did not reappear to
the list.  Like I said in a previous post,
I can be slow sometimes : )

Cheer
Bill

Hey Greetings Everyone
   Just a quick heads up, I know no one here is trying to jip
anyone out of a buck or two, and for the most part HAMS are
like that : )  Honest that is : ) Anyways, I do know the site says 
things like he wants us to have regards as to copyright laws, 
so while I was willing to share, I learned by looking it up again, 
that I should maybe not do so, without his permissions.  So, I 
thought I?d send on this little information on how to get your 
own disk.
   I had a copy awhile back, and it seemed to slip into one of 
my black holes around here : )  So, that led me to the asking, 
and several told me how to get it, and did not think it would 
hurt to add that information one more time to our little group 
here.
    Is Jay on the list here???
   Jay is not fixed up for Paypal so would appreciate a check, 
cash or money order of $10.00 to cover all the costs of you 
getting your new CD.  Then go to this site, download the order 
form and print it out, send it to him VIA snail mail with your 
information on it, and he will e-mail you back when he gets 
the order and confirm the shipping of the CD,  IF you do not 
have a copy of this disk, and are interested in building the 
receiver, or interested in the history of this fine rig, then I 
highly recommend getting your copy as it is a good read 
one way or the other : )
   Probably should get one ASAP, as none of us are getting 
any younger : )

http://www.w6hht.com

   Skim down the page just a bit, to the order info?
Sorry for the band width, but thought it would be useful
to post the info one more time : )  Thanks to those sending
me the info too : )

73 Guys
Bill  KE9XQ
PS  Any YLs or XYLs on our list here???
Maybe they are smarter then we are, not tormenting
themselves with burnt fingers and smelly solder fumes : )

From waltah at earthlink.net  Fri Nov 21 23:13:19 2014
From: waltah at earthlink.net (Walt Hutchens)
Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2014 23:13:19 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Opps apologies to our moderator I sent this VIA an
	alternate mailing address
In-Reply-To: <086E82B0-CCA1-4C76-8B70-132265CB66DC@charter.net>
References: <086E82B0-CCA1-4C76-8B70-132265CB66DC@charter.net>
Message-ID: <434851164.20141121231319@earthlink.net>

William said:

> Anyone do any substitution analyzing of that
> idea of using Octals instead of the miniatures
> called for???

> Think like I said, will stay with the ones called 
> for, but it might be fun to see which ones would
> be subbed out with which Octals?

Obviously this can be done.  The issues are:

1. That's a design change. Most miniature tubes don't have exact octal
replacements so that's not trivial.

Octal tubes were developed and marketed through the mid-1930s with a
few later on. The first miniatures appeared about 1939-40, with a few
more during the war. The war was fought with octals for applications
not requiring compact design and miniatures for the rest.

By about 1950, though the 30's-40's tubes were nearly all obsolescent.
The 6J6 has a niche all to itself, the 1R5-1U4-1S5-3Q4 lineup for the
battery miniature radio (developed for the BC-611 handy-talky) still
owns that department, but the rest are of historic interest only. The
9-pin miniatures started showing up in the 50's (12AU7 may have been
earlier). In the 60's combination miniatures -- triode-pentodes and so
on -- became common.

Furthermore, the individual devices got better, with gains and upper
frequency limits going up steadily.

Taking a 60's design using combination miniatures and turning it into
one based on octal tubes would require both two octal sockets
replacing one 9-pin miniature in those jobs AND perhaps one more IF
stage because the best octal pentodes -- the 6SG7 I think? -- aren't
equal to the 60's miniature pentodes. (I can't remember the exact
gains ... 6SG7 might replace a 6BA6 well enough.) Larger older local
oscillator tubes won't be equally stable because of lower gain and
higher power consumption.

The larger tubes (and having to use a few more of them) will mean a
larger chassis and layout changes.

Doable, probably interesting. Certainly complex receivers WERE built
using octal tubes -- the Collins aircraft transceivers of the end of
the war (ARC-2 transceiver, ARR-15 receiver) were impressive
performers. But I think building one W6TC design pretty much as is
would offer an easier start.

Walt
KJ4KV


From ke9xq at charter.net  Sat Nov 22 11:50:43 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2014 11:50:43 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
Message-ID: <5b9353f8.5f5f8.149d869a9b5.Webtop.44@charter.net>

Thanks Walt
  : )
You're right on OM after thinking of this
for a few days, I can see the falicies of
my daydreaming.  I have a bunch of
octals and loctals and such, but do not
think I will, build anything with them, unless
I play with a regen or two down the road.
right now, tho, am too busy procrastinating : )
73
Bill  KE9XQ



From wrcromwell at gmail.com  Sat Nov 22 16:24:29 2014
From: wrcromwell at gmail.com (Bill Cromwell)
Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2014 16:24:29 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
In-Reply-To: <5b9353f8.5f5f8.149d869a9b5.Webtop.44@charter.net>
References: <5b9353f8.5f5f8.149d869a9b5.Webtop.44@charter.net>
Message-ID: <5470FF0D.2030101@gmail.com>

Hi Bill,

At least you are thinking and then thinking it through. I thought about 
building some of the projects, including HBR with subminiature tubes. We 
get an even greater space saving and a considerable saving in power 
consumption and heat, too. But.. there really aren't "equivalent" tubes 
at least not for all of the functions. Immediately we are faced with a 
series of cludges and if we are going to do "this" why not do "that", 
too. Gosh if we are going to do "that" why not do the "other thing", 
too. Real quick we are not building the radio we started with and we 
won't likely get the results we wanted - the reason we chose the project 
at the beginning.

Those other tubes *CAN* be used to build radio projects but the projects 
should be designed around those other tubes. It might be possible to 
adapt them into an HBR. If I was doing that it would be for space and 
power saving. If I really want those things why not adapt HBR to solid 
state? <evil grin>

73,

Bill  KU8H


On 11/22/2014 11:50 AM, ke9xq at charter.net wrote:
> Thanks Walt
>  : )
> You're right on OM after thinking of this
> for a few days, I can see the falicies of
> my daydreaming.  I have a bunch of
> octals and loctals and such, but do not
> think I will, build anything with them, unless
> I play with a regen or two down the road.
> right now, tho, am too busy procrastinating : )
> 73
> Bill  KE9XQ


From ke9xq at charter.net  Sat Nov 22 17:40:45 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2014 17:40:45 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
Message-ID: <511e3fca.6077e.149d9aa1fb1.Webtop.47@charter.net>

Agreed Bill
    The reason I chose the 13 C is symetry secondarily,
ane performance primarily.  Hard to imagine a home
built rig comparing SO WELL with top of the line rigs
of it's day.  WELL worth the efforts needed to face in
order to have a receiver that performs so well.  And, to
top it all off, we have the experience of dozens of HAMs
that have gone on and built this before we (I) did, and
I can learn from their efforts.  Don't want to go through
this work and get a medeoker (SP) receiver, I plan on
pulling a lot of weak CW signals out of the either with it : )
A friend of mine, now a silent key taught me his ways,
and his main thrill in CW work was to  pull a weak signal
out of the noise and hold a QSO with a Novice or one of
those bare bones rigs, even with the hums and chirps : )
Gotta love it : )  He did not use the noise blankers and
seldom the filters, just turn down the audio and adjust
the gain untill your ears do their little computer like
magic.  Hope to be a good CW Opp one of these days,
just gotta get busy.
73 fer now
Bill  KE9XQ

On Sat, Nov 22, 2014 at 3:24 PM, Bill Cromwell wrote:

> Hi Bill,
>
> At least you are thinking and then thinking it through. I thought 
> about building some of the projects, including HBR with subminiature 
> tubes. We get an even greater space saving and a considerable saving 
> in power consumption and heat, too. But.. there really aren't 
> "equivalent" tubes at least not for all of the functions. Immediately 
> we are faced with a series of cludges and if we are going to do "this" 
> why not do "that", too. Gosh if we are going to do "that" why not do 
> the "other thing", too. Real quick we are not building the radio we 
> started with and we won't likely get the results we wanted - the 
> reason we chose the project at the beginning.
>
> Those other tubes *CAN* be used to build radio projects but the 
> projects should be designed around those other tubes. It might be 
> possible to adapt them into an HBR. If I was doing that it would be 
> for space and power saving. If I really want those things why not 
> adapt HBR to solid state? <evil grin>
>
> 73,
>
> Bill  KU8H
>
>
> On 11/22/2014 11:50 AM, ke9xq at charter.net wrote:
>> Thanks Walt
>>  : )
>> You're right on OM after thinking of this
>> for a few days, I can see the falicies of
>> my daydreaming.  I have a bunch of
>> octals and loctals and such, but do not
>> think I will, build anything with them, unless
>> I play with a regen or two down the road.
>> right now, tho, am too busy procrastinating : )
>> 73
>> Bill  KE9XQ
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From mcinsand at gmail.com  Sat Nov 22 22:13:38 2014
From: mcinsand at gmail.com (Stan McIntosh)
Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2014 22:13:38 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
In-Reply-To: <CAKVLtWMLLMFPg5BH-qgwUYxDtHKQHS3X0-9ObuP_zFSYW9gwfw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKVLtWMLLMFPg5BH-qgwUYxDtHKQHS3X0-9ObuP_zFSYW9gwfw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKVLtWPwBNe25soRds8tdpxw+Tnn0HeCmdY41--Q-Vj=EZqjyg@mail.gmail.com>

The discussion on timing for octals and minis has me wondering about a
recent puzzle.  I recently acquired a Hammarlund HQ-140x and a pair of
Hallicrafters SX-99's.  Both are mid-50s vintage, but the former is mini
(except for the power supply) while the latter is all octal.  Did some
companies just have different philosophies?  Also, what about the loctals?

Regards,
Stan
KD4BTH

From ke9xq at charter.net  Sat Nov 22 22:57:22 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2014 22:57:22 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
Message-ID: <710f782a.61116.149dacbffc8.Webtop.48@charter.net>

Hey Stan
    I believe most Loctals were in auto radios.
It could be some portables too, but I don't remember
any right now.  If I understood your question correctly,
they snapped into place, and the giggling and jerking
did not cause the tubes to work their way out of the
sockets. The snapping caused them to stay seated
properly, yet with a slight tug you could pull them our
to test or swap out tubes. The socked I think had a
little snap ring that fit snuggly around the center pin,
and the tubes male pin had a little indentation ring so
when placed in the socket, the snap ring would help
hold the tube in place...
    I bet your radios were bought new or made sometime
in the transisioning (SP) period from Octals to Mini or
something like that.
73
Bill  KE9XQ

On Sat, Nov 22, 2014 at 9:13 PM, Stan McIntosh wrote:

> The discussion on timing for octals and minis has me wondering about a
> recent puzzle.  I recently acquired a Hammarlund HQ-140x and a pair of
> Hallicrafters SX-99's.  Both are mid-50s vintage, but the former is 
> mini
> (except for the power supply) while the latter is all octal.  Did some
> companies just have different philosophies?  Also, what about the 
> loctals?
>
> Regards,
> Stan
> KD4BTH
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From waltah at earthlink.net  Sat Nov 22 23:10:16 2014
From: waltah at earthlink.net (Walt Hutchens)
Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2014 23:10:16 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
In-Reply-To: <5470FF0D.2030101@gmail.com>
References: <5b9353f8.5f5f8.149d869a9b5.Webtop.44@charter.net>
	<5470FF0D.2030101@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1981987535.20141122231016@earthlink.net>

Bill said:

> I thought about building some of the projects, including HBR with
> subminiature tubes. We get an even greater space saving and a
> considerable saving in power consumption and heat, too.

First, I don't want to discourage anyone from striking out. The HBRs
are basic designs, not terribly critical, and if you are ready to do
the stage-by-stage (mostly) minor redesign you can get a
well-performing receiver from octals, miniatures or subminiatures.

I wouldn't recommend doing it for a first full function receiver
construction project though: There's stuff to figure out just because
it is your first. Get one working, THEN do something different!

As to subminiature tubes, I've looked at that and decided against it
for most kinds of projects. It is true that in military sets with 15
tubes and up you can get a considerable space saving but when you look
closely at these sets ALL the parts are subminiature, right down
to the IF cans. The PRC-6 handy-talky of Korea and the next decade or
so puts the entire transceiver in a package that's (ballpark) the size
of a square 6 volt lantern battery: The rest of the case is the
battery, switches, mic and earphone/speaker, and so on.

Also subminiaturized is the wiring. The tubes are socketed and the
wiring is conventional point-to-point, but it is TINY. You're not
going to do much experimenting when wiring at that scale!

In a design with fewer tubes, tiny tubes don't give the payoff you'd
expect and it shrinks even more when you realize that the only
mult-section tubes you get in subminiature sizes are dual triodes. The
triode-pentodes that are so handy in later HBR designs are ONLY found
as miniatures -- not subminiatures. So as with octals you need two
sockets to do the job of one 9-pin miniature. Meaning twice the
filament wiring, etc.

And I was not willing to tackle finding or making the necessary
subminiature other parts. 1/2" IF cans are out there for 455kcs and
262kcs (I think) but 85 or 100kcs, I doubt it. Tuning cap -- small
enough ones are not hard to find but the dial's a problem. And so on.

By adapting the design a bit -- half lattice crystal filter instead of
the double conversion of the the 'real' HBR you could eliminate the
low frequency IFs. Then there's the question of plug in coils. And
when you get done will the thing sit still on your desk when you try
to tune it?

The one ham subminiature design I think might be interesting would be
a variation on the 20M SSB transmitter featured in 15th edition of the
Bill Orr Radio Handbooks in the early 60's. 6" x 9" x 5" and 40W PEP
output. THAT could be tweaked a bit -- most people would want to
simplify the metalwork dramatically and eliminate the unique power
transformer -- and turned into a buildable project. It's crystal
controlled so no dial. A receiver, though, I think you'd want to do
from scratch.

I would, however, start by looking at using 9 pin miniatures in place
of pairs of subminiatures. That handbook is dated 1962 so the best of
the high performance dual section 9-pin tubes were not available when
it was put together. There are also some three-tube SSB transmitters
that might still be usable if you can tame various spurious emissions
-- there's one in the 1962 ARRL SSB for the Radio Amateur handbooks.

Lots of reasons to want to live forever!

Walt
KJ4KV


From radio at daileyservices.com  Sun Nov 23 10:20:32 2014
From: radio at daileyservices.com (radio at daileyservices.com)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 08:20:32 -0700
Subject: [HBR] Loctals & Octals
References: <710f782a.61116.149dacbffc8.Webtop.48@charter.net>
Message-ID: <0392409A227844FD8A29F30E00A9CCAD@w0eaj>

Bill, Loctals were developed for the military, and due to the CARLOADS of 
them, available after the war, lots of manufacturers (Philco, especially) 
used them in countless radios of every ilk.

Tom 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From mmarris at notecraft.com  Sun Nov 23 10:29:27 2014
From: mmarris at notecraft.com (Martin Marris)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 10:29:27 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Loctals & Octals
In-Reply-To: <0392409A227844FD8A29F30E00A9CCAD@w0eaj>
References: <710f782a.61116.149dacbffc8.Webtop.48@charter.net>
	<0392409A227844FD8A29F30E00A9CCAD@w0eaj>
Message-ID: <001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>

Off-topic, but I've often wondered: Why is it that WWII, in particular,
ended with such a huge surplus of war mat?riel?

I know that by mid-1945 the U.S. economy was really roaring with production
of war goods, but still, why such an extraordinary surplus?

Did policy-makers think the war was going to last a lot longer than it did?
Perhaps the very few people who knew about the atom bomb didn't want to give
any indication that they had anything "special" available that could shorten
the war?

(We don't hear much about a huge "World War One" war-surplus bulge, for
instance. Maybe there was one....)

Maybe my query is a dumb question....

Martin, KB1WSY



From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sun Nov 23 10:51:17 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 07:51:17 -0800
Subject: [HBR] OT--WW I surplus
In-Reply-To: <001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
References: <710f782a.61116.149dacbffc8.Webtop.48@charter.net>
	<0392409A227844FD8A29F30E00A9CCAD@w0eaj>
	<001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIUF9M2yAyRIlHVr/2KiRAoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Martin,

~ (We don't hear much about a huge "World War One" war-surplus bulge, for
instance. Maybe there was one....)

The lore in woodworking is that there was a big surplus of gun cotton at the
end of WW I. Chemists set to work seeing what could be made from almost pure
cellulose, and came up with nitro-cellulose lacquer (wood finish), and the
various other products with "cell" in the name---celluloid, cellophane etc.
Movies were shipped in metal cans because celluloid film is highly
flammable.

~ Maybe my query is a dumb question....

No such thing---only dumb answers (;->)...

Cheers,

Brian



---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From tshoppa at wmata.com  Sun Nov 23 11:01:57 2014
From: tshoppa at wmata.com (Shoppa, Tim)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 16:01:57 +0000
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
In-Reply-To: <CAKVLtWPwBNe25soRds8tdpxw+Tnn0HeCmdY41--Q-Vj=EZqjyg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKVLtWMLLMFPg5BH-qgwUYxDtHKQHS3X0-9ObuP_zFSYW9gwfw@mail.gmail.com>,
	<CAKVLtWPwBNe25soRds8tdpxw+Tnn0HeCmdY41--Q-Vj=EZqjyg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73CDC4D@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>

A real oddball is the Hallicrafters SX-110, 1959 and later, that uses only octals (several of them metal envelope octals) when everyone else had gone all-miniature for receiver tubes by then.

My best guess is that they had a warehouse full of octals that they had to get rid of!

Several of the HBR-series mods shown in the 60's QST's use octal tubes for the mod, presumably because that's what the author had on hand.

Tim N3QE
________________________________________
From: HBR [hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] on behalf of Stan McIntosh [mcinsand at gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2014 10:13 PM
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such

The discussion on timing for octals and minis has me wondering about a
recent puzzle.  I recently acquired a Hammarlund HQ-140x and a pair of
Hallicrafters SX-99's.  Both are mid-50s vintage, but the former is mini
(except for the power supply) while the latter is all octal.  Did some
companies just have different philosophies?  Also, what about the loctals?

Regards,
Stan
KD4BTH
______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From hbr at mailman.qth.net  Sun Nov 23 11:03:26 2014
From: hbr at mailman.qth.net (Brian ford via HBR)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 10:03:26 -0600
Subject: [HBR] Loctals & Octals
In-Reply-To: <001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
References: <710f782a.61116.149dacbffc8.Webtop.48@charter.net>
	<0392409A227844FD8A29F30E00A9CCAD@w0eaj>
	<001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
Message-ID: <0B59EDC0-25BC-4559-B4A0-4822B56F593D@yahoo.com>

I would think that geography was part of the reason, why there was a huge surplus of parts in the U.S., the country was fairly well isolated and supplying the rest of the allied with material and equipment.  Also to over come the UBoat threaght the convoys were oversized.  So mountains of equipment built up here and in Europe. 

Keith kf4tap 

Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 23, 2014, at 09:29, Martin Marris <mmarris at notecraft.com> wrote:
> 
> Off-topic, but I've often wondered: Why is it that WWII, in particular,
> ended with such a huge surplus of war mat?riel?
> 
> I know that by mid-1945 the U.S. economy was really roaring with production
> of war goods, but still, why such an extraordinary surplus?
> 
> Did policy-makers think the war was going to last a lot longer than it did?
> Perhaps the very few people who knew about the atom bomb didn't want to give
> any indication that they had anything "special" available that could shorten
> the war?
> 
> (We don't hear much about a huge "World War One" war-surplus bulge, for
> instance. Maybe there was one....)
> 
> Maybe my query is a dumb question....
> 
> Martin, KB1WSY
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From radio at daileyservices.com  Sun Nov 23 11:06:40 2014
From: radio at daileyservices.com (radio at daileyservices.com)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 09:06:40 -0700
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
References: <CAKVLtWMLLMFPg5BH-qgwUYxDtHKQHS3X0-9ObuP_zFSYW9gwfw@mail.gmail.com>,
	<CAKVLtWPwBNe25soRds8tdpxw+Tnn0HeCmdY41--Q-Vj=EZqjyg@mail.gmail.com>
	<303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73CDC4D@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>
Message-ID: <2405AD7658DF4C928DC976A943BAAB10@w0eaj>

The SX-62 uses a loctal RF amp, too.

---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From ianmwilson73 at gmail.com  Sun Nov 23 12:22:55 2014
From: ianmwilson73 at gmail.com (Ian Wilson)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 09:22:55 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
In-Reply-To: <1981987535.20141122231016@earthlink.net>
References: <5b9353f8.5f5f8.149d869a9b5.Webtop.44@charter.net>
	<5470FF0D.2030101@gmail.com>
	<1981987535.20141122231016@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <CAEz8jcS78Jufr9EUc0iMzjA_wViDbC-6qoMOG597qCEM5xG7-A@mail.gmail.com>

Interesting. Thought I had read all the useful projects in the 15th
Edition but had never looked this one. I wonder why he used a
6BK7A in cascode mode rather than a small pentode?

I have pondered making (a) receiver and/or transmitter using
only 6AC7's. For some reason I have lots of these, most seemingly
NOS. As a late era octal I would guess it would have pretty good
stability; the gm is much higher than the classic tubes used in octal
receiver IF stages; and you can bias it into a remote cutoff mode
of operation. The real estate for doing an HBR-type receiver would
be pretty large, though (and buying a fixer-upper HRO is probably
a better idea anyway).

Yep - that list of interesting things to do never gets any shorter!

73, ian K3IMW


On Sat, Nov 22, 2014 at 8:10 PM, Walt Hutchens <waltah at earthlink.net> wrote:

> Bill said:
>
> > I thought about building some of the projects, including HBR with
> > subminiature tubes. We get an even greater space saving and a
> > considerable saving in power consumption and heat, too.
>
> First, I don't want to discourage anyone from striking out. The HBRs
> are basic designs, not terribly critical, and if you are ready to do
> the stage-by-stage (mostly) minor redesign you can get a
> well-performing receiver from octals, miniatures or subminiatures.
>
> I wouldn't recommend doing it for a first full function receiver
> construction project though: There's stuff to figure out just because
> it is your first. Get one working, THEN do something different!
>
> As to subminiature tubes, I've looked at that and decided against it
> for most kinds of projects. It is true that in military sets with 15
> tubes and up you can get a considerable space saving but when you look
> closely at these sets ALL the parts are subminiature, right down
> to the IF cans. The PRC-6 handy-talky of Korea and the next decade or
> so puts the entire transceiver in a package that's (ballpark) the size
> of a square 6 volt lantern battery: The rest of the case is the
> battery, switches, mic and earphone/speaker, and so on.
>
> Also subminiaturized is the wiring. The tubes are socketed and the
> wiring is conventional point-to-point, but it is TINY. You're not
> going to do much experimenting when wiring at that scale!
>
> In a design with fewer tubes, tiny tubes don't give the payoff you'd
> expect and it shrinks even more when you realize that the only
> mult-section tubes you get in subminiature sizes are dual triodes. The
> triode-pentodes that are so handy in later HBR designs are ONLY found
> as miniatures -- not subminiatures. So as with octals you need two
> sockets to do the job of one 9-pin miniature. Meaning twice the
> filament wiring, etc.
>
> And I was not willing to tackle finding or making the necessary
> subminiature other parts. 1/2" IF cans are out there for 455kcs and
> 262kcs (I think) but 85 or 100kcs, I doubt it. Tuning cap -- small
> enough ones are not hard to find but the dial's a problem. And so on.
>
> By adapting the design a bit -- half lattice crystal filter instead of
> the double conversion of the the 'real' HBR you could eliminate the
> low frequency IFs. Then there's the question of plug in coils. And
> when you get done will the thing sit still on your desk when you try
> to tune it?
>
> The one ham subminiature design I think might be interesting would be
> a variation on the 20M SSB transmitter featured in 15th edition of the
> Bill Orr Radio Handbooks in the early 60's. 6" x 9" x 5" and 40W PEP
> output. THAT could be tweaked a bit -- most people would want to
> simplify the metalwork dramatically and eliminate the unique power
> transformer -- and turned into a buildable project. It's crystal
> controlled so no dial. A receiver, though, I think you'd want to do
> from scratch.
>
> I would, however, start by looking at using 9 pin miniatures in place
> of pairs of subminiatures. That handbook is dated 1962 so the best of
> the high performance dual section 9-pin tubes were not available when
> it was put together. There are also some three-tube SSB transmitters
> that might still be usable if you can tame various spurious emissions
> -- there's one in the 1962 ARRL SSB for the Radio Amateur handbooks.
>
> Lots of reasons to want to live forever!
>
> Walt
> KJ4KV
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

From mcinsand at gmail.com  Sun Nov 23 12:26:03 2014
From: mcinsand at gmail.com (Stan McIntosh)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 12:26:03 -0500
Subject: [HBR] OT--WW I surplus
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIUF9M2yAyRIlHVr/2KiRAoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <710f782a.61116.149dacbffc8.Webtop.48@charter.net>
	<0392409A227844FD8A29F30E00A9CCAD@w0eaj>
	<001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIUF9M2yAyRIlHVr/2KiRAoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKVLtWOn2FF2QZdtyg7V3KN51YpNSdxCP8TjrUxPtXmp_-5Jqw@mail.gmail.com>

In pretty sure that lacquers require a lower degree of nitration than
explosive/propellant grade.  Guncotton is not nearly so easy to dissolve
for a lacquer as mono- or dinitrate.
On Nov 23, 2014 10:51 AM, "Brian Burns" <brianburns1066 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello Martin,
>
> ~ (We don't hear much about a huge "World War One" war-surplus bulge, for
> instance. Maybe there was one....)
>
> The lore in woodworking is that there was a big surplus of gun cotton at
> the
> end of WW I. Chemists set to work seeing what could be made from almost
> pure
> cellulose, and came up with nitro-cellulose lacquer (wood finish), and the
> various other products with "cell" in the name---celluloid, cellophane etc.
> Movies were shipped in metal cans because celluloid film is highly
> flammable.
>
> ~ Maybe my query is a dumb question....
>
> No such thing---only dumb answers (;->)...
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>
>
> ---
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus
> protection is active.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

From waltah at earthlink.net  Sun Nov 23 12:59:13 2014
From: waltah at earthlink.net (Walt Hutchens)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 12:59:13 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Loctals & Octals
In-Reply-To: <001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
References: <710f782a.61116.149dacbffc8.Webtop.48@charter.net>
	<0392409A227844FD8A29F30E00A9CCAD@w0eaj>
	<001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
Message-ID: <142095377.20141123125913@earthlink.net>

Martin said:

> Why is it that WWII, in particular,
> ended with such a huge surplus of war mat?riel?

> I know that by mid-1945 the U.S. economy was really roaring with production
> of war goods, but still, why such an extraordinary surplus?

> Did policy-makers think the war was going to last a lot longer than it did?
> Perhaps the very few people who knew about the atom bomb didn't want to give
> any indication that they had anything "special" available that could shorten
> the war?

WW II ended by surprise. Soldiers in Europe, packing up to return to
the states for 30 days or more of leave and then bound for training
camps and troop transports for movement to the Pacific fell down and
wept when the surrender was announced. They were going to LIVE!

By the summer of 1945 planning was in full swing for the invasion of
Japan, expected to take place in December. It was expected that the
allies would suffer about a quarter million casualties during the
landings and that total allied deaths during the campaign would be in
the quarter million range. The great majority of these would have been
Americans -- the Brits had already paid at home and nobody else had
the numbers.

Translate that to consumption of war materiel of all sorts -- combat
life of a portable radio set in Europe <90 days -- and you can
see the need for a huge surplus as the date approached.

But total production actually peaked in 1944, I believe. I suppose for
ammunition, batteries, rations, and a few other high volume
consumables the peak came later but on average it was already
declining in '45.

Walt
KJ4KV


From waltah at earthlink.net  Sun Nov 23 13:03:06 2014
From: waltah at earthlink.net (Walt Hutchens)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 13:03:06 -0500
Subject: [HBR] OT--WW I surplus
In-Reply-To: <CAKVLtWOn2FF2QZdtyg7V3KN51YpNSdxCP8TjrUxPtXmp_-5Jqw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <710f782a.61116.149dacbffc8.Webtop.48@charter.net>
	<0392409A227844FD8A29F30E00A9CCAD@w0eaj>
	<001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIUF9M2yAyRIlHVr/2KiRAoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<CAKVLtWOn2FF2QZdtyg7V3KN51YpNSdxCP8TjrUxPtXmp_-5Jqw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <67297311.20141123130306@earthlink.net>

Stan said:

> In pretty sure that lacquers require a lower degree of nitration than
> explosive/propellant grade.  Guncotton is not nearly so easy to dissolve
> for a lacquer as mono- or dinitrate.

And nitrate lacquers were already well known before the war. The less
expensive civilian radios and furniture were finished with them
(shellac on the better stuff) and of course the film stock of those
days was nitrocellulose.

Walt Hutchens


From wrcromwell at gmail.com  Sun Nov 23 13:59:17 2014
From: wrcromwell at gmail.com (Bill Cromwell)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 13:59:17 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Loctals & Octals
In-Reply-To: <001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
References: <710f782a.61116.149dacbffc8.Webtop.48@charter.net>	<0392409A227844FD8A29F30E00A9CCAD@w0eaj>
	<001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
Message-ID: <54722E85.80501@gmail.com>

Hi,

The Pacific war was expected to last much longer and with horrendous 
losses. All of a sudden it ended with a couple of atomic bombs. Those 
bombs may have taken a huge toll in life where they were used but saved 
several millions of lives on both sides of the conflict.

73,

Bill  KU8H


On 11/23/2014 10:29 AM, Martin Marris wrote:
> Off-topic, but I've often wondered: Why is it that WWII, in particular,
> ended with such a huge surplus of war mat?riel?
>
> I know that by mid-1945 the U.S. economy was really roaring with production
> of war goods, but still, why such an extraordinary surplus?
>
> Did policy-makers think the war was going to last a lot longer than it did?
> Perhaps the very few people who knew about the atom bomb didn't want to give
> any indication that they had anything "special" available that could shorten
> the war?
>
> (We don't hear much about a huge "World War One" war-surplus bulge, for
> instance. Maybe there was one....)
>
> Maybe my query is a dumb question....
>
> Martin, KB1WSY
>
>


From hbr at mailman.qth.net  Sun Nov 23 19:28:24 2014
From: hbr at mailman.qth.net (Ron Barlow via HBR)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 16:28:24 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
Message-ID: <1416788904.22624.YahooMailBasic@web160106.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>

 Here is $.02 on the octal vs miniature tube discussion, FWIW.
 When I was a young guy (looooooong ago), I shunned octal type tubes (and to even a greater degree, their 4, 5, 6 & 7 pin predecessors), like the plague! Newer was better, in my "brainwashed" mind!
 So, most of my homebrew projects used (salvaged) miniatures.
 My interest in electronics led to my employment as a radio/tv service guy, for a number of years. After a while, I began to notice that the miniatures with their unplated base pins (with a few exceptions, such as the Realistic brand) seemed to be much more susceptible to base contact issues, and internal shorts (due to closer element spacing, I suspected), compared to the older bottles.
 In addition, I realized that some of those old bottles had some rather impressive performance numbers. The 6SG7 has a slightly higher gm than the 6BA6 (4700 vs 4300), & the 6AC7 has a gm of 9000.
 Yes, the octals that I mentioned are semi remote, and sharp cutoff, respectfully. No issue for me, as I do not use AGC.
 Long and short, I developed some new found respect for some of the older tube types. YMMV!
                73 de Ron

From wrcromwell at gmail.com  Sun Nov 23 20:02:18 2014
From: wrcromwell at gmail.com (Bill Cromwell)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 20:02:18 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Octals and such
In-Reply-To: <1416788904.22624.YahooMailBasic@web160106.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
References: <1416788904.22624.YahooMailBasic@web160106.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <5472839A.6030404@gmail.com>

Hi,

There are a lot of things that factor into this. I just happen to have a 
lot of octal and loctal tubes here. I'm a "forty meter ham" so a little 
less horsepower isn't going to make much difference. I worked the 
microwaves at ten meters once in the past 15 years and that was to fill 
a sked with a Swedish ham who wanted my card for the county hunters. The 
TX has a double barrel 6146 final and cranked it up all the way to make 
the QSO. That tube is an octal. Those old tubes still work their magic. 
And they look kewl.

73,

Bill  KU8H


On 11/23/2014 07:28 PM, Ron Barlow via HBR wrote:
>   Here is $.02 on the octal vs miniature tube discussion, FWIW.
>   When I was a young guy (looooooong ago), I shunned octal type tubes (and to even a greater degree, their 4, 5, 6 & 7 pin predecessors), like the plague! Newer was better, in my "brainwashed" mind!
>   So, most of my homebrew projects used (salvaged) miniatures.
>   My interest in electronics led to my employment as a radio/tv service guy, for a number of years. After a while, I began to notice that the miniatures with their unplated base pins (with a few exceptions, such as the Realistic brand) seemed to be much more susceptible to base contact issues, and internal shorts (due to closer element spacing, I suspected), compared to the older bottles.
>   In addition, I realized that some of those old bottles had some rather impressive performance numbers. The 6SG7 has a slightly higher gm than the 6BA6 (4700 vs 4300), & the 6AC7 has a gm of 9000.
>   Yes, the octals that I mentioned are semi remote, and sharp cutoff, respectfully. No issue for me, as I do not use AGC.
>   Long and short, I developed some new found respect for some of the older tube types. YMMV!
>                  73 de Ron
>


From brian at lessonsinlutherie.com  Sun Nov 23 20:25:03 2014
From: brian at lessonsinlutherie.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 17:25:03 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAJ79BD6k90RCuNuX3Zv5LBgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>

Hello All,

 

On K4CHE's site, he recommends chassis kits by Charles Byers, K3IWK, who is
unfortunately now SK. 

 

The convenience of being able to partially disassemble the chassis for
easier wiring access is very attractive indeed. Has anyone taken up
supplying chassis kits since Mr. Byers passed away?

 

If chassis kits aren't available, what's "received wisdom" on what to get,
and where to get it?

 

Cheers,

 

Brian

 

 



---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

From mmarris at notecraft.com  Sun Nov 23 20:53:40 2014
From: mmarris at notecraft.com (Martin Marris)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 20:53:40 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAJ79BD6k90RCuNuX3Zv5LBgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAJ79BD6k90RCuNuX3Zv5LBgBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <000b01d00789$78c11c60$6a435520$@notecraft.com>

>>The convenience of being able to partially disassemble the chassis for
easier wiring access is very attractive indeed. Has anyone taken up
supplying chassis kits since Mr. Byers passed away?<<

Not to my knowledge.

The nearest thing I have found are the LMB Heeger "Omni" chassis kits
(http://www.lmbheeger.com/products.asp?catid=10). They are in some ways
similar to the Byers kits.

I have used them in some of my construction (see for instance
http://tinyurl.com/khckgdu).

A definite drawback, especially for receivers, is the relatively thin
aluminum.

If you want to go the whole hog you buy the raw aluminum and bend it
yourself. See for instance http://www.bignick.net/HBR_11/chassis_punched.jpg
-- but I assume you've all seen that already.

Cheers,

Martin KB1WSY



From garypewitt at centurytel.net  Sun Nov 23 22:35:18 2014
From: garypewitt at centurytel.net (Gary Pewitt)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 21:35:18 -0600
Subject: [HBR] OT--WW I surplus
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIUF9M2yAyRIlHVr/2KiRAoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <710f782a.61116.149dacbffc8.Webtop.48@charter.net>	<0392409A227844FD8A29F30E00A9CCAD@w0eaj>	<001c01d00732$44b24f40$ce16edc0$@notecraft.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIUF9M2yAyRIlHVr/2KiRAoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5472A776.5090201@centurytel.net>

According to a lot of 1930's Popular Mechanics magazines I was given as 
a child there was quite a lot of WWI surplus available.  Not so much 
radio related though.

On 11/23/2014 09:51 AM, Brian Burns wrote:
> Hello Martin,
>
> ~ (We don't hear much about a huge "World War One" war-surplus bulge, for
> instance. Maybe there was one....)

From ke9xq at charter.net  Sun Nov 23 23:18:25 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 23:18:25 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
Message-ID: <543e3fbe.64147.149e005a058.Webtop.46@charter.net>

I just checked that pricing out
and I guess that is more then at least
I am wiling to pay, 36/37 bucks???
I did have an amateur chassis bender
bend up mine, and traded a philmore
crystal set for it.  But if I need to get
another I am thinking of sheet alunimum
from cookie sheets and such and purchase
some aluminum angle iron to mount the
sides to the top and such.  Been saving
used and abused cookie sheets and cake
pans now for several years, the dump site
shows up with some of these goodies every
once in awhile, and well worth keeping an
eye pealed for goodies like these...

Even saved some metals from the sides of
old microwave ovens and toaster ovens.  NOT
the best for sure, but gold for a cheap skate : )
A little scraping, brushing and polish or paint
will cover a lot of blemishes...

73 Guys
Bill  KE9XQ



From ke9xq at charter.net  Sun Nov 23 23:31:43 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 23:31:43 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
Message-ID: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>

One more thought on bending your
own chassis for a couple of bucks,
rather then 35 on up.  Dig out an
old vice grip pliers and have two maybe
4 inch peaces ofsteel angle iron welded
to the tip or end of the pliers perpendicular
to make it "T" shaped, maybe one of the
angle iron pieces could be pre-bent just
a little more, so it had an acute angle to
it, as you'd like to bend your sided just
a tad more then needed so when releaced
it will spring back to the final shape you
desire.

If you take the pliers and angle iron to
a stock car racer or builder, or a fixerupper
shop like a motorcycle shop (use your imagination)
and ask them to weld this for you, it could
hopefully end up costing you an extra 5
dollars or so and you have much of wht you
will need to bend the material you will need
for a project such as this.  Guess what I'm
thinking is where there is a will there is a way.

73
Bill  KE9XQ


From james at plateautel.net  Mon Nov 24 00:06:39 2014
From: james at plateautel.net (James Fuller)
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 22:06:39 -0700
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>
Message-ID: <80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net>

Or you could just buy a set of Vise Grip metal bending pliers and no welding necessary.  There are several brands of forming pliers out there.

JamesF


Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 23, 2014, at 9:31 PM, ke9xq at charter.net wrote:
> 
> One more thought on bending your
> own chassis for a couple of bucks,
> rather then 35 on up.  Dig out an
> old vice grip pliers and have two maybe
> 4 inch peaces ofsteel angle iron welded
> to the tip or end of the pliers perpendicular
> to make it "T" shaped, maybe one of the
> angle iron pieces could be pre-bent just
> a little more, so it had an acute angle to
> it, as you'd like to bend your sided just
> a tad more then needed so when releaced
> it will spring back to the final shape you
> desire.
> 
> If you take the pliers and angle iron to
> a stock car racer or builder, or a fixerupper
> shop like a motorcycle shop (use your imagination)
> and ask them to weld this for you, it could
> hopefully end up costing you an extra 5
> dollars or so and you have much of wht you
> will need to bend the material you will need
> for a project such as this.  Guess what I'm
> thinking is where there is a will there is a way.
> 
> 73
> Bill  KE9XQ
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From ke9xq at charter.net  Mon Nov 24 00:27:20 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2014 00:27:20 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
Message-ID: <4faf1c5c.642fc.149e044b862.Webtop.46@charter.net>

I wonder if Harber Freight
has oneof these ???
There is a new one in La Crosse : )
May have to go and check this
one out : )
Thanks for the hint  James
73
Bill


On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 11:06 PM, James Fuller wrote:

> Or you could just buy a set of Vise Grip metal bending pliers and no 
> welding necessary.  There are several brands of forming pliers out 
> there.
>
> JamesF
>
>

From johnmb at nc.rr.com  Mon Nov 24 07:34:39 2014
From: johnmb at nc.rr.com (john)
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2014 07:34:39 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>
	<80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com>

Aluminum sheet is available on Ebay with relatively affordable prices. 
(Speedy Metals, etc)

John K5MO



At 12:06 AM 11/24/2014, James Fuller wrote:
>Or you could just buy a set of Vise Grip metal bending pliers and no 
>welding necessary.  There are several brands of forming pliers out there.
>
>JamesF
>
>
>Sent from my iPad
>
> > On Nov 23, 2014, at 9:31 PM, ke9xq at charter.net wrote:
> >
> > One more thought on bending your
> > own chassis for a couple of bucks,
> > rather then 35 on up.  Dig out an
> > old vice grip pliers and have two maybe
> > 4 inch peaces ofsteel angle iron welded
> > to the tip or end of the pliers perpendicular
> > to make it "T" shaped, maybe one of the
> > angle iron pieces could be pre-bent just
> > a little more, so it had an acute angle to
> > it, as you'd like to bend your sided just
> > a tad more then needed so when releaced
> > it will spring back to the final shape you
> > desire.
> >
> > If you take the pliers and angle iron to
> > a stock car racer or builder, or a fixerupper
> > shop like a motorcycle shop (use your imagination)
> > and ask them to weld this for you, it could
> > hopefully end up costing you an extra 5
> > dollars or so and you have much of wht you
> > will need to bend the material you will need
> > for a project such as this.  Guess what I'm
> > thinking is where there is a will there is a way.
> >
> > 73
> > Bill  KE9XQ
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > HBR mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
> >
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>______________________________________________________________
>HBR mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

III 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From mmarris at notecraft.com  Mon Nov 24 08:02:53 2014
From: mmarris at notecraft.com (Martin Marris)
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2014 08:02:53 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>	<80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net>
	<6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <000f01d007e6$f58745a0$e095d0e0$@notecraft.com>

I buy aluminum sheet from Online Metals. They will cut it to size for you.

I have also bought perforated steel (for speaker grilles) from McMaster
Carr.

Harbor Freight sells metal brakes for bending, starting with an 18" model
for $40. I don't have one and haven't yet tried bending my own metal but if
you want relatively heavy-gauge chassis that is one way to go. The other
method of course is to join the sheets together with angle brackets -- I
have done this, but so far only for cabinets, not chassis. I've never
learned how to weld, so I join them together with screws and bolts, and
countersink the screws. It's a lot of work but fun, and extremely rigid.

Another trick is just to use a conventional Bud or Hammond chassis, and
strengthen it by bolting a flat aluminum sheet to the top, in effect
doubling the thickness. You can also bolt one chassis on top of the other,
upside-down, so that the two "top sheets" are clamped together. That trick
is used in one of the ARRL VFO projects from the 1960s -- I think they used
a steel chassis on the bottom and an aluminum one on top.

Coming back to the subject of chassis kits, like the ones available from LMB
Heeger. I agree that they are rather pricey. They do however have the
advantage that it you mess up, or if you later change your mind and alter
the design, you can usually just alter one part of the chassis (if necessary
replacing that part altogether with a new one: Heeger sells them "by the
piece," you don't have to buy a whole kit) without having to redo
everything.

Martin, KB1WSY



From mcinsand at gmail.com  Mon Nov 24 08:32:07 2014
From: mcinsand at gmail.com (Stan McIntosh)
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2014 08:32:07 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <4faf1c5c.642fc.149e044b862.Webtop.46@charter.net>
References: <4faf1c5c.642fc.149e044b862.Webtop.46@charter.net>
Message-ID: <CAKVLtWOAi2ASCtxgLMbn39zKGJn-whn=ick58-CRrinBuEFB3w@mail.gmail.com>

>>I wonder if Harber Freight has oneof these ???

Bill,

You've now triggered my Harbor Freight story.  Take it for what you will,
but my view is that the experience was to Harbor Freight's credit.
Granted, this is from the early 1990's, and no doubt things may have
changed.  However, they had one of these aluminum manual sheet metal brakes
and if my memory serves (a definite 'if'), the price was something like
$14.95.  I made a space on my workbench and bolted the brake in place when
it came in.  I took a thin piece of aluminum to start... somthing like
0.025" thick.  The brake immediately snapped.  Stuff happens, though, so I
called HF back.  They were cheerful and professional, and they took care of
shipping and returns (back then, this was mail order).  New brake comes in,
but history repeats.  That's still okay.  Mistakes can happen, and
sometimes they happen in pairs.  They were nice again, and cheerfully
replaced the brake.  Third brake does the same thing.  I called to ask for
a refund, and they did not hesitate, the person on the other line
apologized for my experience, and they sent a check.  So, I went to
Northern Hydraulics and ordered their version for thirty-something
dollars.  One of the brakes was definitely a copy of the other, which was
great since the bolt holes lined up perfectly.  However, the HF brake was
spot-welded while the NH brake was welded all the way across the joints.

It's hard to believe that 2 decades have passed, but I have made a lot of
small boxes and braces with that brake.  It's been awesome.  Given the time
that's passed, however, I would be that Harbor Freight has either fixed the
problem with the brakes from the '90s or dropped them from the line.

Regards,
Stan
kd4bth

From mcinsand at gmail.com  Mon Nov 24 16:54:34 2014
From: mcinsand at gmail.com (Stan McIntosh)
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2014 16:54:34 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>
	<80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net>
	<6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com>

>>Aluminum sheet is available on Ebay with relatively affordable prices.
(Speedy Metals, etc)

John,

You have truly made my day!  Until reading your message (which I sadly
almost overlooked), this has definitely been a Monday.  A lack of sheet
aluminum has cramped my playing for some time, now.  In the '90s, the
machine shop where I worked let me have more scrap sheet than I could keep
up with on my manual brake.  The big box stores charge an arm and a leg.
After a quick poke through eBay, though, I think I'll be set for a Q-meter
housing!

Regards,
Stan
KD4BTh

From johnmb at nc.rr.com  Mon Nov 24 17:38:41 2014
From: johnmb at nc.rr.com (john)
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2014 17:38:41 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.g
	mail.com>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>
	<80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net>
	<6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
	<CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com>

At 04:54 PM 11/24/2014, Stan McIntosh wrote:

I'm always happy to help spend someone else's money :-)

Best 73
John K5MO




>John,
>
>You have truly made my day!  Until reading your message (which I sadly
>almost overlooked), this has definitely been a Monday.  A lack of sheet
>aluminum has cramped my playing for some time, now.  In the '90s, the
>machine shop where I worked let me have more scrap sheet than I could keep
>up with on my manual brake.  The big box stores charge an arm and a leg.
>After a quick poke through eBay, though, I think I'll be set for a Q-meter
>housing!
>
>Regards,
>Stan
>KD4BTh
>______________________________________________________________
>HBR mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

III 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From sswhite at mchsi.com  Mon Nov 24 20:40:29 2014
From: sswhite at mchsi.com (Steve)
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2014 19:40:29 -0600
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net><80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net><6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com><CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com>
	<6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz>

All 

I have found that I can buy very cheap sheet metal from small material
suppliers here in town for extremly good prices.  I was amazed how
inexpensive it can be at least 25% of the Big Box stores and you can get all
kinds of thincknesses and quality...I get mine from a place called Marion
Iron works which is basically a scrap yard here in town and they will cut it
for me as well....I have had them make "U" shaped channels for me so I can
make my own chassis up...

Steve   NU0P 

-----Original Message-----
From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of john
Sent: Monday, November 24, 2014 4:39 PM
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits

At 04:54 PM 11/24/2014, Stan McIntosh wrote:

I'm always happy to help spend someone else's money :-)

Best 73
John K5MO




>John,
>
>You have truly made my day!  Until reading your message (which I sadly 
>almost overlooked), this has definitely been a Monday.  A lack of sheet 
>aluminum has cramped my playing for some time, now.  In the '90s, the 
>machine shop where I worked let me have more scrap sheet than I could 
>keep up with on my manual brake.  The big box stores charge an arm and a
leg.
>After a quick poke through eBay, though, I think I'll be set for a 
>Q-meter housing!
>
>Regards,
>Stan
>KD4BTh
>______________________________________________________________
>HBR mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
>list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

III 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus
protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


From garypewitt at centurytel.net  Mon Nov 24 20:50:57 2014
From: garypewitt at centurytel.net (Gary Pewitt)
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2014 19:50:57 -0600
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <4faf1c5c.642fc.149e044b862.Webtop.46@charter.net>
References: <4faf1c5c.642fc.149e044b862.Webtop.46@charter.net>
Message-ID: <5473E081.3080400@centurytel.net>

I bought several from them to use as welding clamps for sheet metal. 
They work perfectly and were at a very good price.  Go for it.  73  Gary 
N9ZSV

On 11/23/2014 11:27 PM, ke9xq at charter.net wrote:
> I wonder if Harber Freight
> has oneof these ???
> There is a new one in La Crosse : )
> May have to go and check this
> one out : )
> Thanks for the hint  James
> 73
> Bill
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 11:06 PM, James Fuller wrote:
>
>> Or you could just buy a set of Vise Grip metal bending pliers and no
>> welding necessary.  There are several brands of forming pliers out there.
>>
>> JamesF
>>
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>

From w2dgb at ptd.net  Tue Nov 25 09:04:30 2014
From: w2dgb at ptd.net (Bill Fizette)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 09:04:30 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>
Message-ID: <E91A6416A6584777B159AED8079D786D@BillPC>

Don't even have to go through all that.  I simply use my large bench vice 
and use two sharp cornered angles cut to the right length...two or three 
lengths should suffice.  Then with the Al cut to size, I score the inside 
bend lines and then into the vice with the two angles, and bend the Al 
chassis long dimensions with a heavy piece of wood.  Ends can also be bent 
if you have the clearances.

Another approach, and perhaps somewhat easier and also used here, is to 
obtain or make some angles or U's and use them for the sides, with a flat 
sheet of Al for the top.

I have also used discarded pre-used chassis with the top cut out, and a new 
piece of Al for the top, held on with countersunk small bolts.  I think at 
least two of these approaches have already been presented, but thought I 
would jump in with my experiences.

The end results here are certainly not comparable with the big bux purchased 
chassis, but are acceptable here as long as I am careful.

73,  Bill   w2dgb


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <ke9xq at charter.net>
To: "HBR Receiver List" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2014 11:31 PM
Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits


> One more thought on bending your
> own chassis for a couple of bucks,
> rather then 35 on up.  Dig out an
> old vice grip pliers and have two maybe
> 4 inch peaces ofsteel angle iron welded
> to the tip or end of the pliers perpendicular
> to make it "T" shaped, maybe one of the
> angle iron pieces could be pre-bent just
> a little more, so it had an acute angle to
> it, as you'd like to bend your sided just
> a tad more then needed so when releaced
> it will spring back to the final shape you
> desire.
>
> If you take the pliers and angle iron to
> a stock car racer or builder, or a fixerupper
> shop like a motorcycle shop (use your imagination)
> and ask them to weld this for you, it could
> hopefully end up costing you an extra 5
> dollars or so and you have much of wht you
> will need to bend the material you will need
> for a project such as this.  Guess what I'm
> thinking is where there is a will there is a way.
>
> 73
> Bill  KE9XQ
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> 



From johnmb at nc.rr.com  Tue Nov 25 09:30:30 2014
From: johnmb at nc.rr.com (john)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 09:30:30 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <E91A6416A6584777B159AED8079D786D@BillPC>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>
	<E91A6416A6584777B159AED8079D786D@BillPC>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20141125092945.0446d9a0@pop-server.nc.rr.com>

Or China Freight (Harbor) has a cheap manual brake. When I got mine it was ~17$

John K5MO


At 09:04 AM 11/25/2014, you wrote:
>Don't even have to go through all that.  I simply use my large bench vice 
>and use two sharp cornered angles cut to the right length...two or three 
>lengths should suffice.  Then with the Al cut to size, I score the inside 
>bend lines and then into the vice with the two angles, and bend the Al 
>chassis long dimensions with a heavy piece of wood.  Ends can also be bent 
>if you have the clearances.
>
>Another approach, and perhaps somewhat easier and also used here, is to 
>obtain or make some angles or U's and use them for the sides, with a flat 
>sheet of Al for the top.
>
>I have also used discarded pre-used chassis with the top cut out, and a 
>new piece of Al for the top, held on with countersunk small bolts.  I 
>think at least two of these approaches have already been presented, but 
>thought I would jump in with my experiences.
>
>The end results here are certainly not comparable with the big bux 
>purchased chassis, but are acceptable here as long as I am careful.
>
>73,  Bill   w2dgb
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: <ke9xq at charter.net>
>To: "HBR Receiver List" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
>Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2014 11:31 PM
>Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>
>
>>One more thought on bending your
>>own chassis for a couple of bucks,
>>rather then 35 on up.  Dig out an
>>old vice grip pliers and have two maybe
>>4 inch peaces ofsteel angle iron welded
>>to the tip or end of the pliers perpendicular
>>to make it "T" shaped, maybe one of the
>>angle iron pieces could be pre-bent just
>>a little more, so it had an acute angle to
>>it, as you'd like to bend your sided just
>>a tad more then needed so when releaced
>>it will spring back to the final shape you
>>desire.
>>
>>If you take the pliers and angle iron to
>>a stock car racer or builder, or a fixerupper
>>shop like a motorcycle shop (use your imagination)
>>and ask them to weld this for you, it could
>>hopefully end up costing you an extra 5
>>dollars or so and you have much of wht you
>>will need to bend the material you will need
>>for a project such as this.  Guess what I'm
>>thinking is where there is a will there is a way.
>>
>>73
>>Bill  KE9XQ
>>
>>______________________________________________________________
>>HBR mailing list
>>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>
>______________________________________________________________
>HBR mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

III 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Tue Nov 25 11:07:40 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 08:07:40 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net><80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net><6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com><CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com>
	<6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
	<3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMJMz0xVfVBJjAPZRCQcfhoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello All,

One method that hasn't been mentioned is what I call "Cabinetmaker's
Delight" construction. Remember the "Plumber's Delight" construction method
for beam antennas that was so popular back in the day?

This is just a thought experiment for me at this point. What about plywood
framing with heavy aluminum foil as a conductive covering? This would allow
connecting the parts with wood screws so that they could be disassembled for
convenience. 

Basic mounting of components could be done on a heavy aluminum plate, and
smaller aluminum plates could be added in. Mix and match as necessary.
Plywood is mechanically stiff, a good thermal insulator, cheap, and easy to
work. Has anyone tried this type of construction?

Cheers,

Brian








 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From ke9xq at charter.net  Tue Nov 25 11:23:23 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 11:23:23 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
Message-ID: <5ffdbbf5.6b7b7.149e7c3b816.Webtop.48@charter.net>

Brian and group
    Do you have the Impoverished Radio Experimenters books???
Love them, and at least one article that I remember at the moment,
is IF cans built with aluminum foil draped over the cardboard forms.
I think there was more, but can't think of them at the moment.  While
I know that will work OM, I do not plan on using the idea at least with
the HBR set, as I want to avoid tears tares teirs terring tearing of the
foil et cetera : )  For a mock up that would be great but for a long 
haul
project, foil is too fragile.  The wood would stand up to most of the
abuses, but it just might end up looking terrable after I get my mits
on it a few times : )  Now that I'm thinking of this, that alunimum
foil does come in different thickness' but at least I'm going to avoid 
it.
Looks like everyone is thinking here : )
73
Bill


On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 10:07 AM, Brian Burns wrote:

> Hello All,
>
> One method that hasn't been mentioned is what I call "Cabinetmaker's
> Delight" construction. Remember the "Plumber's Delight" construction 
> method
> for beam antennas that was so popular back in the day?
>
> This is just a thought experiment for me at this point. What about 
> plywood
> framing with heavy aluminum foil as a conductive covering? This would 
> allow
> connecting the parts with wood screws so that they could be 
> disassembled for
> convenience.
> Basic mounting of components could be done on a heavy aluminum plate, 
> and
> smaller aluminum plates could be added in. Mix and match as necessary.
> Plywood is mechanically stiff, a good thermal insulator, cheap, and 
> easy to
> work. Has anyone tried this type of construction?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
> protection is active.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Tue Nov 25 11:43:44 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 08:43:44 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <5ffdbbf5.6b7b7.149e7c3b816.Webtop.48@charter.net>
References: <5ffdbbf5.6b7b7.149e7c3b816.Webtop.48@charter.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAPlbjs5aQdhFpTcddP6kvfABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Bill,

Yes, there are heavy aluminum foils available--I found a couple by googling.
And there is always aluminum roof flashing readily available, and easily cut
to size with tin snips. 

By the way, a very superior type of tin-snip has been available for years
called "Lever Snips". Compound leverage, and you can cut in straight lines
with them.

Cheers,

Brian


-----Original Message-----
From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of
ke9xq at charter.net
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 8:23 AM
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits

Brian and group
    Do you have the Impoverished Radio Experimenters books???
Love them, and at least one article that I remember at the moment, is IF
cans built with aluminum foil draped over the cardboard forms.
I think there was more, but can't think of them at the moment.  While I know
that will work OM, I do not plan on using the idea at least with the HBR
set, as I want to avoid tears tares teirs terring tearing of the foil et
cetera : )  For a mock up that would be great but for a long haul project,
foil is too fragile.  The wood would stand up to most of the abuses, but it
just might end up looking terrable after I get my mits on it a few times : )
Now that I'm thinking of this, that alunimum foil does come in different
thickness' but at least I'm going to avoid it.
Looks like everyone is thinking here : )
73
Bill


On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 10:07 AM, Brian Burns wrote:

> Hello All,
>
> One method that hasn't been mentioned is what I call "Cabinetmaker's 
> Delight" construction. Remember the "Plumber's Delight" construction 
> method for beam antennas that was so popular back in the day?
>
> This is just a thought experiment for me at this point. What about 
> plywood framing with heavy aluminum foil as a conductive covering? 
> This would allow connecting the parts with wood screws so that they 
> could be disassembled for convenience.
> Basic mounting of components could be done on a heavy aluminum plate, 
> and smaller aluminum plates could be added in. Mix and match as 
> necessary.
> Plywood is mechanically stiff, a good thermal insulator, cheap, and 
> easy to work. Has anyone tried this type of construction?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
> protection is active.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From rwbetts at sbcglobal.net  Tue Nov 25 11:55:34 2014
From: rwbetts at sbcglobal.net (Bob Betts)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 08:55:34 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAPlbjs5aQdhFpTcddP6kvfABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <5ffdbbf5.6b7b7.149e7c3b816.Webtop.48@charter.net>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAPlbjs5aQdhFpTcddP6kvfABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1416934534.52365.YahooMailNeo@web185306.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

Hi Guys:
Just wanted to jump in.
I have been making shielded cans for years with brass shim stock. Generally I buy the .004" thick brass on a 6" wide roll, but there's other thicknesses and widths (ebay is a good source). I cut it with scissors and it bends very nicely. You can score it with a scribe and it folds nicely along the scribe line. For a 4-sided can, I make 5 sides so that the last side overlaps the first. Then it can be easily soldered into a square tube. They make very nice looking finished product, especially if you paint the finished can. I have not done this for IFs, but have made dozens of cans for RF Preamps, converters, mixers, oscillators, etc.

Anyhow, just a suggestion.

Bob, N1KPR

 
http://www.bobsamerica.com  http://www.youtube.com/n1kpr

Engineering: Where Enigma meets Paradox


________________________________
 From: Brian Burns <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
To: 'HBR Receiver List' <hbr at mailman.qth.net> 
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
 

Hello Bill,

Yes, there are heavy aluminum foils available--I found a couple by googling.
And there is always aluminum roof flashing readily available, and easily cut
to size with tin snips. 

By the way, a very superior type of tin-snip has been available for years
called "Lever Snips". Compound leverage, and you can cut in straight lines
with them.

Cheers,

Brian


-----Original Message-----
From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of
ke9xq at charter.net
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 8:23 AM
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits

Brian and group
    Do you have the Impoverished Radio Experimenters books???
Love them, and at least one article that I remember at the moment, is IF
cans built with aluminum foil draped over the cardboard forms.
I think there was more, but can't think of them at the moment.  While I know
that will work OM, I do not plan on using the idea at least with the HBR
set, as I want to avoid tears tares teirs terring tearing of the foil et
cetera : )  For a mock up that would be great but for a long haul project,
foil is too fragile.  The wood would stand up to most of the abuses, but it
just might end up looking terrable after I get my mits on it a few times : )
Now that I'm thinking of this, that alunimum foil does come in different
thickness' but at least I'm going to avoid it.
Looks like everyone is thinking here : )
73
Bill


On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 10:07 AM, Brian Burns wrote:

> Hello All,
>
> One method that hasn't been mentioned is what I call "Cabinetmaker's 
> Delight" construction. Remember the "Plumber's Delight" construction 
> method for beam antennas that was so popular back in the day?
>
> This is just a thought experiment for me at this point. What about 
> plywood framing with heavy aluminum foil as a conductive covering? 
> This would allow connecting the parts with wood screws so that they 
> could be disassembled for convenience.
> Basic mounting of components could be done on a heavy aluminum plate, 
> and smaller aluminum plates could be added in. Mix and match as 
> necessary.
> Plywood is mechanically stiff, a good thermal insulator, cheap, and 
> easy to work. Has anyone tried this type of construction?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
> protection is active.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html





---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From ke9xq at charter.net  Tue Nov 25 12:10:23 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 12:10:23 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Chassis glitch
Message-ID: <56ba2e26.6bca5.149e7eebfcd.Webtop.48@charter.net>

Never thought of the roof alunininimun : )
good idea!!!

Have an interesting cabinet problem to deal with.
Last summer I took my cabinet outside and cleaned
it up 'real good' and after things looked great, I did some
experimenting with the hammer tone type paint and
never finnished it up, so I went out to the trailer last night
to bring the project down into the basement to work on it,
and after inspection, feel the whole thing needs reworking,
not just sprucing up.  I see rust here and there, and to
top it off, the hammer tone (black) has little spots in/on
it like little mold spots.  Looks bad, so am going to remove
all the paint too.  Looked good last summer, but terrible
today : (  Wonder what I did wrong???  possibbly the cabinet
was not as dry as I thought it to be or improper preperations???

Wonder what it would cost to take it to an auto body shop
and have them chemically strip it???   Probabbly a lot more
then I want to spring for.

Any ideas what I did wrong?  Glad I caught this early, not
a year or two down the road.

73 Guys
Bill




On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 10:43 AM, Brian Burns wrote:

> Hello Bill,
>
> Yes, there are heavy aluminum foils available--I found a couple by 
> googling.
> And there is always aluminum roof flashing readily available, and 
> easily cut
> to size with tin snips.
> By the way, a very superior type of tin-snip has been available for 
> years
> called "Lever Snips". Compound leverage, and you can cut in straight 
> lines
> with them.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>

From w2dgb at ptd.net  Tue Nov 25 13:24:33 2014
From: w2dgb at ptd.net (Bill Fizette)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 13:24:33 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMJMz0xVfVBJjAPZRCQcfhoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net><80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net><6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com><CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com><6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com><3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMJMz0xVfVBJjAPZRCQcfhoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0F2D46A2CCFE486D889EB381D72BDA16@BillPC>

Here we are again. My apologies, but the bells are ringing!   And again, 
nothing new about using plywood covered with a grounding metal.  A 1920s REL 
receiver on my project list used a plywood plate covered with a sheet of Cu. 
A commercial item, it worked originally so I fully expect it to work again.

73 to all,  and Happy Thanksgiving, in spite of the big snow heading our 
way.

 Bill    w2dgb

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Brian Burns" <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 11:07 AM
Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits


> Hello All,
>
> One method that hasn't been mentioned is what I call "Cabinetmaker's
> Delight" construction. Remember the "Plumber's Delight" construction 
> method
> for beam antennas that was so popular back in the day?
>
> This is just a thought experiment for me at this point. What about plywood
> framing with heavy aluminum foil as a conductive covering? This would 
> allow
> connecting the parts with wood screws so that they could be disassembled 
> for
> convenience.
>
> Basic mounting of components could be done on a heavy aluminum plate, and
> smaller aluminum plates could be added in. Mix and match as necessary.
> Plywood is mechanically stiff, a good thermal insulator, cheap, and easy 
> to
> work. Has anyone tried this type of construction?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
> protection is active.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> 



From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Tue Nov 25 13:44:14 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 10:44:14 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <0F2D46A2CCFE486D889EB381D72BDA16@BillPC>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net><80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net><6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com><CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com><6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com><3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMJMz0xVfVBJjAPZRCQcfhoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<0F2D46A2CCFE486D889EB381D72BDA16@BillPC>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAKRBhwnMy5lDtfa9NVipjUsBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Bill,

Copper foil as a cover for plywood occurred to me, and has the advantage of
being solder-able. Copper prices have risen dramatically recently, but I'll
check to see what copper foil costs currently. 

Thanks for the suggestion (:->)...

Cheers,

Brian

-----Original Message-----
From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bill Fizette
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 10:25 AM
To: HBR Receiver List
Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits

Here we are again. My apologies, but the bells are ringing!   And again, 
nothing new about using plywood covered with a grounding metal.  A 1920s REL
receiver on my project list used a plywood plate covered with a sheet of Cu.

A commercial item, it worked originally so I fully expect it to work again.

73 to all,  and Happy Thanksgiving, in spite of the big snow heading our
way.

 Bill    w2dgb

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Burns" <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 11:07 AM
Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits


> Hello All,
>
> One method that hasn't been mentioned is what I call "Cabinetmaker's
> Delight" construction. Remember the "Plumber's Delight" construction 
> method
> for beam antennas that was so popular back in the day?
>
> This is just a thought experiment for me at this point. What about plywood
> framing with heavy aluminum foil as a conductive covering? This would 
> allow
> connecting the parts with wood screws so that they could be disassembled 
> for
> convenience.
>
> Basic mounting of components could be done on a heavy aluminum plate, and
> smaller aluminum plates could be added in. Mix and match as necessary.
> Plywood is mechanically stiff, a good thermal insulator, cheap, and easy 
> to
> work. Has anyone tried this type of construction?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
> protection is active.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> 


______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From smithab11 at comcast.net  Tue Nov 25 14:34:07 2014
From: smithab11 at comcast.net (B. Smith)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 14:34:07 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAKRBhwnMy5lDtfa9NVipjUsBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net><80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net><6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com><CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com><6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com><3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz>	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMJMz0xVfVBJjAPZRCQcfhoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>	<0F2D46A2CCFE486D889EB381D72BDA16@BillPC>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAKRBhwnMy5lDtfa9NVipjUsBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5474D9AF.2080308@comcast.net>

       It was mentioned earlier but just another reminder that aluminum 
flashing which comes in various widths starting with 6 inches.  The  
flashing is easy to cut and bend  and makes an excellent cover for 
plywood. Your home supply store has tons of it.  You can even purchase a 
roll  that has a self sticking back.

breck k4che

On 11/25/2014 1:44 PM, Brian Burns wrote:
> Hello Bill,
>
> Copper foil as a cover for plywood occurred to me, and has the advantage of
> being solder-able. Copper prices have risen dramatically recently, but I'll
> check to see what copper foil costs currently.
>
> Thanks for the suggestion (:->)...
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bill Fizette
> Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 10:25 AM
> To: HBR Receiver List
> Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>
> Here we are again. My apologies, but the bells are ringing!   And again,
> nothing new about using plywood covered with a grounding metal.  A 1920s REL
> receiver on my project list used a plywood plate covered with a sheet of Cu.
>
> A commercial item, it worked originally so I fully expect it to work again.
>
> 73 to all,  and Happy Thanksgiving, in spite of the big snow heading our
> way.
>
>   Bill    w2dgb
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brian Burns" <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
> To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 11:07 AM
> Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>
>
>> Hello All,
>>
>> One method that hasn't been mentioned is what I call "Cabinetmaker's
>> Delight" construction. Remember the "Plumber's Delight" construction
>> method
>> for beam antennas that was so popular back in the day?
>>
>> This is just a thought experiment for me at this point. What about plywood
>> framing with heavy aluminum foil as a conductive covering? This would
>> allow
>> connecting the parts with wood screws so that they could be disassembled
>> for
>> convenience.
>>
>> Basic mounting of components could be done on a heavy aluminum plate, and
>> smaller aluminum plates could be added in. Mix and match as necessary.
>> Plywood is mechanically stiff, a good thermal insulator, cheap, and easy
>> to
>> work. Has anyone tried this type of construction?
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Brian
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus
>> protection is active.
>> http://www.avast.com
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> HBR mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>
> ---
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Tue Nov 25 15:02:20 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 12:02:20 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <5474D9AF.2080308@comcast.net>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net><80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net><6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com><CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com><6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com><3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz>	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMJMz0xVfVBJjAPZRCQcfhoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>	<0F2D46A2CCFE486D889EB381D72BDA16@BillPC>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAKRBhwnMy5lDtfa9NVipjUsBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<5474D9AF.2080308@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAC8Y/wgcmelDpfA3S6Scn80BAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Breck,

~ It was mentioned earlier but just another reminder that aluminum flashing
which comes in various widths starting with 6 inches.  The flashing is easy
to cut and bend  and makes an excellent cover for plywood. Your home supply
store has tons of it.  You can even purchase a roll  that has a self
sticking back.

breck k4che


Self sticking back---that really sounds interesting! I'll bet that if it's
applied with a clothes iron, to dust free plywood, it could be bonded quite
securely---excellent suggestion.

By the way, if you didn't happen to see my post on the HBR list a few weeks
back, thanks very much for doing all that work on your website documenting
your experience with your HBR-14. You have put lots of useful and practical
information there, and I have been learning a bunch from it (:->)...

Cheers,

Brian 



---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Tue Nov 25 16:18:57 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 13:18:57 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <5474D9AF.2080308@comcast.net>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net><80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net><6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com><CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com><6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com><3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz>	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMJMz0xVfVBJjAPZRCQcfhoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>	<0F2D46A2CCFE486D889EB381D72BDA16@BillPC>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAKRBhwnMy5lDtfa9NVipjUsBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<5474D9AF.2080308@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMLsJQ2ZLChBljAlvBMehMgBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello All,

Just a note on cutting an aluminum flashing and plywood sandwich. A
woodworking table saw will cut aluminum just fine. The trick is the type and
quality of the blade. I use a Forrest High A-T blade for virtually
everything I saw, even though it's intended for cutting plywood cleanly. Not
cheap, but will make a cheap table saw cut like an expensive one, saves
cleanup work, and leaves nice crisp professional edges.  

High A-T means high alternate top bevel, and its intended purpose is to cut
plywood and fiberboard without tearing out the bottom edge of the cut. Most
any carbide blade will make a clean cut where the teeth enter the work, but
the bottom edges will be left quite ragged, especially when cutting across
the grain---cross-cutting. 

The High A-T design scores the bottom surface of the work before removing
the stock in the center of the cut. Very clever! I would be sure to have the
aluminum side facing up so that the saw is pulling it down, and isn't trying
to delaminate it from the plywood.

Cheers,

Brian

 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From ke9xq at charter.net  Tue Nov 25 17:20:59 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 17:20:59 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
Message-ID: <6aa2444f.6de13.149e90b1b14.Webtop.47@charter.net>

Good hint Brian
    I have cut a lot of Copper Clad circuit board
VIA just turning the blade around so the cuting
is done a lot smoother, this is with just a regular
old wood cutting blade.  Have not tried alunimum
but is it is not too heavey,  Will try it one of these
days but will archive this note for reminding me
about your A-T blade...
Thanks
Bill


On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 3:18 PM, Brian Burns wrote:

> Hello All,
>
> Just a note on cutting an aluminum flashing and plywood sandwich. A
> woodworking table saw will cut aluminum just fine. The trick is the 
> type and
> quality of the blade. I use a Forrest High A-T blade for virtually
> everything I saw, even though it's intended for cutting plywood 
> cleanly. Not
> cheap, but will make a cheap table saw cut like an expensive one, 
> saves
> cleanup work, and leaves nice crisp professional edges.
> High A-T means high alternate top bevel, and its intended purpose is 
> to cut
> plywood and fiberboard without tearing out the bottom edge of the cut. 
> Most
> any carbide blade will make a clean cut where the teeth enter the 
> work, but
> the bottom edges will be left quite ragged, especially when cutting 
> across
> the grain---cross-cutting.
> The High A-T design scores the bottom surface of the work before 
> removing
> the stock in the center of the cut. Very clever! I would be sure to 
> have the
> aluminum side facing up so that the saw is pulling it down, and isn't 
> trying
> to delaminate it from the plywood.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>
>
> ---
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
> protection is active.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From w2dgb at ptd.net  Tue Nov 25 17:23:25 2014
From: w2dgb at ptd.net (Bill Fizette)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 17:23:25 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAKRBhwnMy5lDtfa9NVipjUsBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net><80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net><6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com><CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com><6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com><3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz><!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMJMz0xVfVBJjAPZRCQcfhoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com><0F2D46A2CCFE486D889EB381D72BDA16@BillPC>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAKRBhwnMy5lDtfa9NVipjUsBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E691B792F02F442DABB4F94054DB4FEF@BillPC>

Brian,

Roofing supplies or even roofers usually carry sheet Cu for gutter use on 
expensive houses.  Or some sheet metal supply place can either cut you a 
piece or steer you to one.  Don't recommend foil, as it won' t take the heat 
so easily.  Considering the overall cost of the project, it shouldn't add 
all that much to get some metal.

73,  Bill  w2dgb


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Brian Burns" <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 1:44 PM
Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits


> Hello Bill,
>
> Copper foil as a cover for plywood occurred to me, and has the advantage 
> of
> being solder-able. Copper prices have risen dramatically recently, but 
> I'll
> check to see what copper foil costs currently.
>
> Thanks for the suggestion (:->)...
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bill Fizette
> Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 10:25 AM
> To: HBR Receiver List
> Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>
> Here we are again. My apologies, but the bells are ringing!   And again,
> nothing new about using plywood covered with a grounding metal.  A 1920s 
> REL
> receiver on my project list used a plywood plate covered with a sheet of 
> Cu.
>
> A commercial item, it worked originally so I fully expect it to work 
> again.
>
> 73 to all,  and Happy Thanksgiving, in spite of the big snow heading our
> way.
>
> Bill    w2dgb
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brian Burns" <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
> To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 11:07 AM
> Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>
>
>> Hello All,
>>
>> One method that hasn't been mentioned is what I call "Cabinetmaker's
>> Delight" construction. Remember the "Plumber's Delight" construction
>> method
>> for beam antennas that was so popular back in the day?
>>
>> This is just a thought experiment for me at this point. What about 
>> plywood
>> framing with heavy aluminum foil as a conductive covering? This would
>> allow
>> connecting the parts with wood screws so that they could be disassembled
>> for
>> convenience.
>>
>> Basic mounting of components could be done on a heavy aluminum plate, and
>> smaller aluminum plates could be added in. Mix and match as necessary.
>> Plywood is mechanically stiff, a good thermal insulator, cheap, and easy
>> to
>> work. Has anyone tried this type of construction?
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Brian
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus
>> protection is active.
>> http://www.avast.com
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> HBR mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>
> ---
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
> protection is active.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> 



From johnmb at nc.rr.com  Tue Nov 25 18:09:50 2014
From: johnmb at nc.rr.com (john)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 18:09:50 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <E691B792F02F442DABB4F94054DB4FEF@BillPC>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>
	<80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net>
	<6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
	<CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com>
	<6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
	<3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMJMz0xVfVBJjAPZRCQcfhoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<0F2D46A2CCFE486D889EB381D72BDA16@BillPC>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAKRBhwnMy5lDtfa9NVipjUsBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<E691B792F02F442DABB4F94054DB4FEF@BillPC>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20141125180820.044ea7d0@pop-server.nc.rr.com>

One can buy thin copper PCB material....I mean copper foil on a thin 
fiberglass PCB material VERY inexpensively on Ebay. You can cut this stuff 
with scissors but because of the 'glass backing it's quite strong.

It could be very easily glued down to a base material

John K5MO


At 05:23 PM 11/25/2014, Bill Fizette wrote:
>Brian,
>
>Roofing supplies or even roofers usually carry sheet Cu for gutter use on 
>expensive houses.  Or some sheet metal supply place can either cut you a 
>piece or steer you to one.  Don't recommend foil, as it won' t take the 
>heat so easily.  Considering the overall cost of the project, it shouldn't 
>add all that much to get some metal.
>
>73,  Bill  w2dgb
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Burns" <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
>To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
>Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 1:44 PM
>Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>
>
>>Hello Bill,
>>
>>Copper foil as a cover for plywood occurred to me, and has the advantage of
>>being solder-able. Copper prices have risen dramatically recently, but I'll
>>check to see what copper foil costs currently.
>>
>>Thanks for the suggestion (:->)...
>>
>>Cheers,
>>
>>Brian
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bill Fizette
>>Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 10:25 AM
>>To: HBR Receiver List
>>Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>>
>>Here we are again. My apologies, but the bells are ringing!   And again,
>>nothing new about using plywood covered with a grounding metal.  A 1920s REL
>>receiver on my project list used a plywood plate covered with a sheet of Cu.
>>
>>A commercial item, it worked originally so I fully expect it to work again.
>>
>>73 to all,  and Happy Thanksgiving, in spite of the big snow heading our
>>way.
>>
>>Bill    w2dgb
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Brian Burns" <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
>>To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
>>Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 11:07 AM
>>Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>>
>>
>>>Hello All,
>>>
>>>One method that hasn't been mentioned is what I call "Cabinetmaker's
>>>Delight" construction. Remember the "Plumber's Delight" construction
>>>method
>>>for beam antennas that was so popular back in the day?
>>>
>>>This is just a thought experiment for me at this point. What about plywood
>>>framing with heavy aluminum foil as a conductive covering? This would
>>>allow
>>>connecting the parts with wood screws so that they could be disassembled
>>>for
>>>convenience.
>>>
>>>Basic mounting of components could be done on a heavy aluminum plate, and
>>>smaller aluminum plates could be added in. Mix and match as necessary.
>>>Plywood is mechanically stiff, a good thermal insulator, cheap, and easy
>>>to
>>>work. Has anyone tried this type of construction?
>>>
>>>Cheers,
>>>
>>>Brian
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>---
>>>This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus
>>>protection is active.
>>>http://www.avast.com
>>>
>>>______________________________________________________________
>>>HBR mailing list
>>>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>>>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>>
>>______________________________________________________________
>>HBR mailing list
>>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>>
>>---
>>This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
>>protection is active.
>>http://www.avast.com
>>
>>______________________________________________________________
>>HBR mailing list
>>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>
>______________________________________________________________
>HBR mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

III 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From johnmb at nc.rr.com  Tue Nov 25 18:09:50 2014
From: johnmb at nc.rr.com (john)
Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2014 18:09:50 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Chassis kits
In-Reply-To: <E691B792F02F442DABB4F94054DB4FEF@BillPC>
References: <4f44f5e2.641ad.149e011cdd3.Webtop.46@charter.net>
	<80B51589-D14D-4FD6-9DFF-E2E3AA775770@plateautel.net>
	<6.2.1.2.2.20141124073338.03387070@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
	<CAKVLtWNvCQVaPGFt5J_1txJAD71kb9gqEAMb=AAs-SzRRh1zog@mail.gmail.com>
	<6.2.1.2.2.20141124173750.03388e50@pop-server.nc.rr.com>
	<3EA65DBA14504F5692A9AB1E31D95E4C@Ghz>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMJMz0xVfVBJjAPZRCQcfhoBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<0F2D46A2CCFE486D889EB381D72BDA16@BillPC>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAKRBhwnMy5lDtfa9NVipjUsBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<E691B792F02F442DABB4F94054DB4FEF@BillPC>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20141125180820.044ea7d0@pop-server.nc.rr.com>

One can buy thin copper PCB material....I mean copper foil on a thin 
fiberglass PCB material VERY inexpensively on Ebay. You can cut this stuff 
with scissors but because of the 'glass backing it's quite strong.

It could be very easily glued down to a base material

John K5MO


At 05:23 PM 11/25/2014, Bill Fizette wrote:
>Brian,
>
>Roofing supplies or even roofers usually carry sheet Cu for gutter use on 
>expensive houses.  Or some sheet metal supply place can either cut you a 
>piece or steer you to one.  Don't recommend foil, as it won' t take the 
>heat so easily.  Considering the overall cost of the project, it shouldn't 
>add all that much to get some metal.
>
>73,  Bill  w2dgb
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Burns" <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
>To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
>Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 1:44 PM
>Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>
>
>>Hello Bill,
>>
>>Copper foil as a cover for plywood occurred to me, and has the advantage of
>>being solder-able. Copper prices have risen dramatically recently, but I'll
>>check to see what copper foil costs currently.
>>
>>Thanks for the suggestion (:->)...
>>
>>Cheers,
>>
>>Brian
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: HBR [mailto:hbr-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bill Fizette
>>Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 10:25 AM
>>To: HBR Receiver List
>>Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>>
>>Here we are again. My apologies, but the bells are ringing!   And again,
>>nothing new about using plywood covered with a grounding metal.  A 1920s REL
>>receiver on my project list used a plywood plate covered with a sheet of Cu.
>>
>>A commercial item, it worked originally so I fully expect it to work again.
>>
>>73 to all,  and Happy Thanksgiving, in spite of the big snow heading our
>>way.
>>
>>Bill    w2dgb
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Brian Burns" <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
>>To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
>>Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2014 11:07 AM
>>Subject: Re: [HBR] Chassis kits
>>
>>
>>>Hello All,
>>>
>>>One method that hasn't been mentioned is what I call "Cabinetmaker's
>>>Delight" construction. Remember the "Plumber's Delight" construction
>>>method
>>>for beam antennas that was so popular back in the day?
>>>
>>>This is just a thought experiment for me at this point. What about plywood
>>>framing with heavy aluminum foil as a conductive covering? This would
>>>allow
>>>connecting the parts with wood screws so that they could be disassembled
>>>for
>>>convenience.
>>>
>>>Basic mounting of components could be done on a heavy aluminum plate, and
>>>smaller aluminum plates could be added in. Mix and match as necessary.
>>>Plywood is mechanically stiff, a good thermal insulator, cheap, and easy
>>>to
>>>work. Has anyone tried this type of construction?
>>>
>>>Cheers,
>>>
>>>Brian
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>---
>>>This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus
>>>protection is active.
>>>http://www.avast.com
>>>
>>>______________________________________________________________
>>>HBR mailing list
>>>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>>>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>>
>>______________________________________________________________
>>HBR mailing list
>>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>>
>>---
>>This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus 
>>protection is active.
>>http://www.avast.com
>>
>>______________________________________________________________
>>HBR mailing list
>>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>
>______________________________________________________________
>HBR mailing list
>Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
>Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
>This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

III 


---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com


From ke9xq at charter.net  Wed Nov 26 23:39:08 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2014 23:39:08 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Chassis Tools
Message-ID: <63da8776.73a66.149ef8bacd8.Webtop.47@charter.net>


OK Guys
    I went to that Harbor freight place today
and found a couple of possibilities for bending
alunimum chassis, The one that I bought was 9.99
and is called a 3.5 inch Hand Seamer and it lookes like
it could be modified for various lengths and deapths with
a little imagination.  Two screws holding each plate
that looks like a little less then the half of a door
threashold alunuimum trim and then tapped for two
screws.  But this should be good for most little jobs
I might be wanting it for at the moment anyways.
Without additional plates to make the bend deaper
into the metal, I only have a 2 inch deep grab, but
I would think a couple of nice flat peaces of steel
could make another inch or so without taxing it too
much.  Thanks for the ideas gents.
73
Bill  KE9XQ

From brian at lessonsinlutherie.com  Fri Nov 28 14:00:50 2014
From: brian at lessonsinlutherie.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 11:00:50 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Riddle me this!
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>

Hello All,

 

My thoughts have turned to plug-in coils, for no particular reason except
that I'm likely to need a bunch of them if I want to cover all the bands.
Being an inveterate "do-it-myselfer", I'm looking into making my own---you
can see that it's going to be a while before I'm able to listen to 40 meter
CW (;->).

 

So I'm curious about the dielectric properties of the various materials that
I might use for making the forms. I go to good-ol google, and search on
dielectric properties of polypropylene, a likely suspect, and up comes the
following link:

 

http://www.rfcafe.com/references/electrical/dielectric-constants-strengths.h
tm

 

For best selectivity and highest gain we would like our RF amplifier and
mixer plug-ins to be high Q (right?). Air is the best core material to get
the highest Q, but it's a bit deficient in mechanical properties. We need a
form to wind our coils on, and wouldn't it be grand to be able to just order
up some ceramic (probably steatite) coil forms like the old-timers used. So
if Air is the best, and higher numbers are worse:

 

Air............1.000

 

Steatite..........5.3-6.5

 

Bakelite..........3.7

 


Polypropylene.........2.2

 

Douglas Fir...........1.9

 

Wood............1-2

 

Wood!?? You gotta be kidding! Much as I love to work wood, I'll stick to
polypropylene as a more practical material. But, never more will I lust
after ceramic coil forms---or am I missing something here?

 

Cheers,

 

Brian

 

	

 

 



---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com

From brian at lessonsinlutherie.com  Fri Nov 28 14:08:05 2014
From: brian at lessonsinlutherie.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 11:08:05 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Damaged link
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAACIr8/ZZXf9NitZ4mLd0IcoBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>

Hello All,

 

The link to RF caf? in my post of a moment ago came through to me with the
last two letters black and inactive. You will need to copy and paste it into
your command line, if it came to you the same way.

 

Cheers,

 

Brian

 



---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com

From hbr at mailman.qth.net  Fri Nov 28 14:36:57 2014
From: hbr at mailman.qth.net (Ron Barlow via HBR)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 11:36:57 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Riddle me this!
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <1417203417.27979.YahooMailBasic@web160105.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>

The link that you provided didn't function for me.
 The numbers that you listed appear to refer to the dielectric constants of the materials, not for dielectric losses. For the latter, you should look at "dissipation factor". Use a search engine for further info.
                    GL & 73 de Ron
--------------------------------------------
On Fri, 11/28/14, Brian Burns <brian at lessonsinlutherie.com> wrote:

 Subject: [HBR] Riddle me this!
 To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
 Date: Friday, November 28, 2014, 2:00 PM
 
 Hello All,
 
  
 
 My thoughts have turned to plug-in coils, for no particular
 reason except
 that I'm likely to need a bunch of them if I want to cover
 all the bands.
 Being an inveterate "do-it-myselfer", I'm looking into
 making my own---you
 can see that it's going to be a while before I'm able to
 listen to 40 meter
 CW (;->).
 
  
 
 So I'm curious about the dielectric properties of the
 various materials that
 I might use for making the forms. I go to good-ol google,
 and search on
 dielectric properties of polypropylene, a likely suspect,
 and up comes the
 following link:
 
  
 
 http://www.rfcafe.com/references/electrical/dielectric-constants-strengths.h
 tm
 
  
 
 For best selectivity and highest gain we would like our RF
 amplifier and
 mixer plug-ins to be high Q (right?). Air is the best core
 material to get
 the highest Q, but it's a bit deficient in mechanical
 properties. We need a
 form to wind our coils on, and wouldn't it be grand to be
 able to just order
 up some ceramic (probably steatite) coil forms like the
 old-timers used. So
 if Air is the best, and higher numbers are worse:
 
  
 
 Air............1.000
 
  
 
 Steatite..........5.3-6.5
 
  
 
 Bakelite..........3.7
 
  
 
 
 Polypropylene.........2.2
 
  
 
 Douglas Fir...........1.9
 
  
 
 Wood............1-2
 
  
 
 Wood!?? You gotta be kidding! Much as I love to work wood,
 I'll stick to
 polypropylene as a more practical material. But, never more
 will I lust
 after ceramic coil forms---or am I missing something here?
 
  
 
 Cheers,
 
  
 
 Brian
 
  
 
 ??? 
 
  
 
  
 
 
 
 ---
 This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus
 software.
 http://www.avast.com
 ______________________________________________________________
 HBR mailing list
 Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
 Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
 Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
 
 This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
 Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
 

From brian at lessonsinlutherie.com  Fri Nov 28 14:49:11 2014
From: brian at lessonsinlutherie.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 11:49:11 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Coil forms P.S.
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAJDAUiT47K9JsyaKRJiXi7gBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>

Of the "readily glue-ables", one of which polypropylene is not.

 


Polystyrene..................2.5-2.6

	

 

 


Polyvinylchloride (PVC)..............3  (readily available and cheap)

 

Cheers,

 

Brian

	

 



---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com

From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Fri Nov 28 14:53:13 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 11:53:13 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Riddle me this!
In-Reply-To: <1417203417.27979.YahooMailBasic@web160105.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<1417203417.27979.YahooMailBasic@web160105.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAI+BSCwfxiVHunlbTX+oolkBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Ron,

~ The numbers that you listed appear to refer to the dielectric constants of
the materials, not for dielectric losses. For the latter, you should look at
"dissipation factor". Use a search engine for further info.

Aha! I thought that I might be looking at the wrong part of the elephant.
I'll report back.

Cheers,

Brian


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com


From ke9xq at charter.net  Fri Nov 28 15:39:05 2014
From: ke9xq at charter.net (ke9xq at charter.net)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 15:39:05 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [HBR] Riddle me this!
Message-ID: <2b6ad2c3.796b7.149f820e5f7.Webtop.49@charter.net>

Greetings Guys
Just a thought, and probably shared by someone else
before, but not to much spam here, so here goes.
Place a glass of water in your microwave and a peice
of the material you want to use for the coil form.
Boil the water and see if your material got hot or deformend
you probably don't have to boil the water, and a lot of
stuff gets warm in the microwave oven, but if it passed the
test, I think you are at least in the ball part as to dielectric
losses go.  Not sure of myself, but that's one of the tests
I plan on running, when I get to that spot in my project.
I've saved a lot of material, inculding music roll : ) tubes, and
have varnised some of them.  I've saved little glass glasses, a
couple of plastic glasses, some golf handle protector tubes,
some old vacuum cleaner tubes, medicine bottles, and of
course octal tube dud bases, so I have a lot of experimenting
waiting for me down the road a bit : )  Adding machine paper
spools (when the paper is done) Sewing spools of all sorts and
made of different materials.  PVC piping of variuos qualities...

Had a thought for tubes too.  Find or make a form the exact size
you want, or just a tad smaller, but not much.  rap a peice of
paper over it, just a tad of tape, and shelac it.  When dry pull
it off the form and maybe shelac the inside if it did not penetrate
very well.  You could use wax paper over the form to help remove
the form when it is dried.  If this is to fragile, use two sheets of
paper or whatever product you choose to make the coil form out of.

Probably needs to be fairly rigid if you plan on swapping out your
coils very much : )

73 Everyone
Bill  KE9XQ


On Fri, Nov 28, 2014 at 1:53 PM, Brian Burns wrote:

> Hello Ron,
>
> ~ The numbers that you listed appear to refer to the dielectric 
> constants of
> the materials, not for dielectric losses. For the latter, you should 
> look at
> "dissipation factor". Use a search engine for further info.
>

From tshoppa at wmata.com  Fri Nov 28 16:05:09 2014
From: tshoppa at wmata.com (Shoppa, Tim)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 21:05:09 +0000
Subject: [HBR] Riddle me this!
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73D0F98@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>

I hate hate hate the original polysterene forms. They start melting before I ever get a soldering iron near.

I have been having excellent success using 5 pin tube bases from bad 807's and using hollow phenolic tubes slipped inside or over the 5 pin base. I think most PVC (see "microwave test" in case UV resistant additives might cause RF issues) is fine too.

Sent from my Windows Phone
________________________________
From: Brian Burns<mailto:brian at lessonsinlutherie.com>
Sent: ?11/?28/?2014 2:01 PM
To: 'HBR Receiver List'<mailto:hbr at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: [HBR] Riddle me this!

Hello All,



My thoughts have turned to plug-in coils, for no particular reason except
that I'm likely to need a bunch of them if I want to cover all the bands.
Being an inveterate "do-it-myselfer", I'm looking into making my own---you
can see that it's going to be a while before I'm able to listen to 40 meter
CW (;->).



So I'm curious about the dielectric properties of the various materials that
I might use for making the forms. I go to good-ol google, and search on
dielectric properties of polypropylene, a likely suspect, and up comes the
following link:



http://www.rfcafe.com/references/electrical/dielectric-constants-strengths.h
tm



For best selectivity and highest gain we would like our RF amplifier and
mixer plug-ins to be high Q (right?). Air is the best core material to get
the highest Q, but it's a bit deficient in mechanical properties. We need a
form to wind our coils on, and wouldn't it be grand to be able to just order
up some ceramic (probably steatite) coil forms like the old-timers used. So
if Air is the best, and higher numbers are worse:



Air............1.000



Steatite..........5.3-6.5



Bakelite..........3.7




Polypropylene.........2.2



Douglas Fir...........1.9



Wood............1-2



Wood!?? You gotta be kidding! Much as I love to work wood, I'll stick to
polypropylene as a more practical material. But, never more will I lust
after ceramic coil forms---or am I missing something here?



Cheers,



Brian











---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com
______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From waltah at earthlink.net  Fri Nov 28 16:23:45 2014
From: waltah at earthlink.net (Walt Hutchens)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 16:23:45 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Riddle me this!
In-Reply-To: <303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73D0F98@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73D0F98@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>
Message-ID: <693019485.20141128162345@earthlink.net>

I've had very good results -- a couple of perfectly adequate HBRs --
using PVC water pipe from Lowes.  I think the 1" Schedule 20 (thin
wall) stuff is what I used; it fits snugly on an octal bakelite base
from a dead metal vacuum tube and can be secured with epoxy when
you're ready to do so -- best after doing the experimenting to get the
stuff inside the form just right.

I've never done a microwave oven test on this stuff but if you don't
have the front end peaked to perfection the receiver goes dead, so the
Q is certainly high enough.

The 1" is a nominal inside diameter: The O.D. is around 1-1/4" as I
recall.

I cut off all unneeded pins to make the coil easier to insert/remove.
A Dremel tool can be used to increase the clearance inside the top to
mount APC trimmers.

You can make a flange for the top from a slice of a PVC pipe slip
coupling.   When these turn out well they're just about
indistinguishable from commercial.

Walt
KJ4KV


From brian at lessonsinlutherie.com  Fri Nov 28 16:42:23 2014
From: brian at lessonsinlutherie.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 13:42:23 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Dissipation factor of materials
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMOih0PmgdRDpu1HHBcml4gBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>

Hello All,

 

Here are some numbers I found for dissipation factor:

 

Polystyrene-------------------------------------------.0002 to .00007

 

PVC------------------------------------------------------.016

 

Steatite--------------------------------------------------.0035 to .0008

 

It would appear from these that polystyrene is quite a bit better than even
steatite ceramic, probably what was used in old-timey coil forms. No wonder
it was so well liked for UHF stuff at Hansen Labs, where I used to work back
in the day. Not only does it melt easily, it crazes over time. The base that
I have in mind is available from National, and shouldn't have the melting
problem, as it's ceramic.

 

Next question: Does using the lowest loss coil form "make enough difference
to make a difference"? Walt's experience, as well as other builders', using
PVC seems to say "no it doesn't".

 

Cheers,

 

Brian 

 

 

 

 

 



---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com

From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Fri Nov 28 16:53:37 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 13:53:37 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Tracking
In-Reply-To: <693019485.20141128162345@earthlink.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73D0F98@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>
	<693019485.20141128162345@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAOI/9Eedyj5LuJVTbl/3LCwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Walt,

"....but if you don't have the front end peaked to perfection the receiver
goes dead, so the Q is certainly high enough."

Please keep in mind that I don't know squat about building an HBR, and am
just trying to learn about the process.

>From reading the various materials that I've collected there seems to be
quite a bit of time and energy spent fiddling with each band's set of coils
to get a three bay variable capacitor to track properly, especially over a
wide band. 

Has anyone tried doing an end run around the tracking problem by having
separate capacitors for RF, LO, and Mixer, and putting up with a lot of knob
twisting in exchange?

Cheers,

Brian


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com


From wrcromwell at gmail.com  Fri Nov 28 18:10:25 2014
From: wrcromwell at gmail.com (Bill Cromwell)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 18:10:25 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Tracking
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAOI/9Eedyj5LuJVTbl/3LCwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>	<303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73D0F98@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>	<693019485.20141128162345@earthlink.net>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAOI/9Eedyj5LuJVTbl/3LCwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <547900E1.2010001@gmail.com>

Hi Brian,

In your superhet the *real* tracking is between the VFO and the 
"rest-of-the-front-end". The inductors and capacitors in the 
rest-of-the-front-end will all be on the same frequncy and could/should 
be about identical. So even of the frequency change 'bunches up' at one 
end they should all 'bunch up' the same. The VFO is on a different 
frequency and THAT is where the 'tracking' issues really arise. I have 
used radios that use the tuning knob for only the VFO and separate 
"peaking" knob that tunes the rest-of-the-front-end. Those will also 
accommodate tuning in the image and on some receivers gives coverage of 
WWV when the radio otherwise does not tune anywhere near WWV. Those tune 
the image "backward".

Instead of two or three more controls you have one more control. Image 
tuning might be considered a *feature*. Tracking the stages in the 
rest-of-the-front-end might still be required during alignment but is a 
much more trival exercise than tracking the VFO with the 
rest-of-the-front-end. Tuning the rest-of-the-front-end and VFO 
separately will relieve you of needing that three section variable cap. 
The rest-of-the-front-end will use a dual section cap with two identical 
sections and they might be different from the single section VFO cap.

I recommend staying as close to the design as possible if you hope to 
benefit from any of the troubleshooting info available. When things 
don't work as expected you will have to wonder if it's your own 
modifications or another error that might be covered in the existing 
books, web pages, mail lists, and CDs you might have.

Build the next one with the rest-of-the-front-end separate from the VFO 
and with everything else the same. Etc. Make changes one step at a time.

I have started using the amber plastic pill bottles for coil forms.  My 
XYL gets them in various sizes. She needs a lot of medication to stay 
alive so I have bought her a personal snow shovel for handling all her 
meds in trade for the empty bottles.

73,

Bill  KU8H


On 11/28/2014 04:53 PM, Brian Burns wrote:
> Hello Walt,
>
> "....but if you don't have the front end peaked to perfection the receiver
> goes dead, so the Q is certainly high enough."
>
> Please keep in mind that I don't know squat about building an HBR, and am
> just trying to learn about the process.
>
> >From reading the various materials that I've collected there seems to be
> quite a bit of time and energy spent fiddling with each band's set of coils
> to get a three bay variable capacitor to track properly, especially over a
> wide band.
>
> Has anyone tried doing an end run around the tracking problem by having
> separate capacitors for RF, LO, and Mixer, and putting up with a lot of knob
> twisting in exchange?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>


From waltah at earthlink.net  Fri Nov 28 20:30:43 2014
From: waltah at earthlink.net (Walt Hutchens)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 20:30:43 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Tracking
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAOI/9Eedyj5LuJVTbl/3LCwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<303A17BD5F8FA34DA45EEC245271AC0BB73D0F98@JGEX2K10MBX2.wmata.local>
	<693019485.20141128162345@earthlink.net>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAOI/9Eedyj5LuJVTbl/3LCwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1328740538.20141128203043@earthlink.net>

Brian said:

> Has anyone tried doing an end run around the tracking problem by having
> separate capacitors for RF, LO, and Mixer, and putting up with a lot of knob
> twisting in exchange?

It can be done that way, but why?  Tracking a three-tuned circuit
receiver has been done by literally millions of people and anyone on
this list is certainly able to learn how.

It takes a bit of patience and two or three rules of thumb but that's
about it.

1. Built an established design first -- or at least use the front end
from an established design.  That way the tuned circuits will be very
close to right without anything more than following directions.

BE FANATICAL about following the directions for making the coils. That
is the easiest and most common place to go wrong. Even if you don't
have the right forms (almost nobody does these days!) you can still
get close to the diameter and wire size and with the right number of
turns and connections you will be within the range of adjustment.

If the design you're following give directions for adjustment then
follow those. If it doesn't then do this.

2. Get the oscillator calibrated or tracked using a counter or
continuous coverage receiver. This is done as follows:

a. Set the tuning cap to the high end of the band and use the
(parallel) trimmer to get the frequency right.

b. Set the tuning cap to the low end of the band and adjust the coil
to get the frequency right. If this requires the tuning cap to be
fully meshed, increase the inductance a bit (push the coil turns
together slightly) so less tuning cap mesh will be needed while if the
cap is too far open, reduce the inductance.

Repeat 'a' and 'b' until you're satisfied. After a couple of cycles
you may find that overshooting the adjustments somewhat, saves time.

3. Now feed in a signal and adjust the antenna and RF coils in the
same way for the strongest signal at each of those two points.

If something doesn't seem to work, then figuring out why becomes your
next step.  This list will help -- nearly everyone here has been down
all the blind alleys!

Walt
KJ4KV


From james at plateautel.net  Fri Nov 28 21:54:09 2014
From: james at plateautel.net (James Fuller)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 19:54:09 -0700
Subject: [HBR] Dissipation factor of materials
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMOih0PmgdRDpu1HHBcml4gBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMOih0PmgdRDpu1HHBcml4gBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <EAD76C37-967F-424E-B806-C7A5F1E0C3B7@plateautel.net>

Hi,
I'm sure that most of you know this but if not, lowe's and other big box stores sell 1-1/2" od polystyrene extension pieces that are 16" long and have small flanges on both ends.  They are also available in 1-1/4" OD but not as commonly.  They also sell 3" polystyrene couplings that fit over 3" nominal sewer pipe. The couplings are about 3-5/8" OD from memory and make great forms if you need a large coil.
JamesF



> On Nov 28, 2014, at 2:42 PM, "Brian Burns" <brian at lessonsinlutherie.com> wrote:
> 
> Hello All,
> 
> 
> 
> Here are some numbers I found for dissipation factor:
> 
> 
> 
> Polystyrene-------------------------------------------.0002 to .00007
> 
> 
> 
> PVC------------------------------------------------------.016
> 
> 
> 
> Steatite--------------------------------------------------.0035 to .0008
> 
> 
> 
> It would appear from these that polystyrene is quite a bit better than even
> steatite ceramic, probably what was used in old-timey coil forms. No wonder
> it was so well liked for UHF stuff at Hansen Labs, where I used to work back
> in the day. Not only does it melt easily, it crazes over time. The base that
> I have in mind is available from National, and shouldn't have the melting
> problem, as it's ceramic.
> 
> 
> 
> Next question: Does using the lowest loss coil form "make enough difference
> to make a difference"? Walt's experience, as well as other builders', using
> PVC seems to say "no it doesn't".
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> 
> 
> Brian 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> http://www.avast.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From garypewitt at centurytel.net  Sat Nov 29 00:58:55 2014
From: garypewitt at centurytel.net (Gary Pewitt)
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 23:58:55 -0600
Subject: [HBR] Riddle me this!
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAALhFZ8OnGN5HuMsVGSIP8QsBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
Message-ID: <5479609F.1000702@centurytel.net>

I've found that the brownish plastic bottles that prescription medicines 
come in work fine.  They come in many sizes and you can request the 
pharmacist to put your pills or capsules into the bigger size bottles 
even if they would fit the little ones.  I've accumulated many of them 
and doubt I'll ever run out.  It's not difficult to fit them to an old 
tube base for plug in coils.  73  Gary  N9ZSV


On 11/28/2014 01:00 PM, Brian Burns wrote:
> Hello All,
>
>
>
> My thoughts have turned to plug-in coils, for no particular reason except
> that I'm likely to need a bunch of them if I want to cover all the bands.
> Being an inveterate "do-it-myselfer", I'm looking into making my own---you
> can see that it's going to be a while before I'm able to listen to 40 meter
> CW (;->).
>
>
>
> So I'm curious about the dielectric properties of the various materials that
> I might use for making the forms. I go to good-ol google, and search on
> dielectric properties of polypropylene, a likely suspect, and up comes the
> following link:
>
>
>
> http://www.rfcafe.com/references/electrical/dielectric-constants-strengths.h
> tm
>
>
>
> For best selectivity and highest gain we would like our RF amplifier and
> mixer plug-ins to be high Q (right?). Air is the best core material to get
> the highest Q, but it's a bit deficient in mechanical properties. We need a
> form to wind our coils on, and wouldn't it be grand to be able to just order
> up some ceramic (probably steatite) coil forms like the old-timers used. So
> if Air is the best, and higher numbers are worse:
>
>
>
> Air............1.000
>
>
>
> Steatite..........5.3-6.5
>
>
>
> Bakelite..........3.7
>
>
>
>
> Polypropylene.........2.2
>
>
>
> Douglas Fir...........1.9
>
>
>
> Wood............1-2
>
>
>
> Wood!?? You gotta be kidding! Much as I love to work wood, I'll stick to
> polypropylene as a more practical material. But, never more will I lust
> after ceramic coil forms---or am I missing something here?
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
>
>
> Brian
>
>
>
> 	
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> http://www.avast.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>

From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sat Nov 29 11:35:13 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2014 08:35:13 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Dissipation factor of materials
In-Reply-To: <EAD76C37-967F-424E-B806-C7A5F1E0C3B7@plateautel.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMOih0PmgdRDpu1HHBcml4gBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<EAD76C37-967F-424E-B806-C7A5F1E0C3B7@plateautel.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAC40k6+A6TRDp4qtksrULn8BAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello James,

~ I'm sure that most of you know this but if not, lowe's and other big box
stores sell 1-1/2" od polystyrene extension pieces that are 16" long and
have small flanges on both ends.  They are also available in 1-1/4" OD but
not as commonly.  They also sell 3" polystyrene couplings that fit over 3"
nominal sewer pipe. The couplings are about 3-5/8" OD from memory and make
great forms if you need a large coil.
JamesF

If these are plumbing parts they are probably PVC, polyvinylchloride.
Polystyrene has great RF properties, but its thermal and mechanical
properties are not very good.

Cheers,

Brian 







> On Nov 28, 2014, at 2:42 PM, "Brian Burns" <brian at lessonsinlutherie.com>
wrote:
> 
> Hello All,
> 
> 
> 
> Here are some numbers I found for dissipation factor:
> 
> 
> 
> Polystyrene-------------------------------------------.0002 to .00007
> 
> 
> 
> PVC------------------------------------------------------.016
> 
> 
> 
> Steatite--------------------------------------------------.0035 to 
> .0008
> 
> 
> 
> It would appear from these that polystyrene is quite a bit better than 
> even steatite ceramic, probably what was used in old-timey coil forms. 
> No wonder it was so well liked for UHF stuff at Hansen Labs, where I 
> used to work back in the day. Not only does it melt easily, it crazes 
> over time. The base that I have in mind is available from National, 
> and shouldn't have the melting problem, as it's ceramic.
> 
> 
> 
> Next question: Does using the lowest loss coil form "make enough 
> difference to make a difference"? Walt's experience, as well as other 
> builders', using PVC seems to say "no it doesn't".
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> 
> 
> Brian
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> http://www.avast.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com


From james at plateautel.net  Sat Nov 29 12:25:34 2014
From: james at plateautel.net (James Fuller)
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2014 10:25:34 -0700
Subject: [HBR] Dissipation factor of materials
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAC40k6+A6TRDp4qtksrULn8BAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMOih0PmgdRDpu1HHBcml4gBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<EAD76C37-967F-424E-B806-C7A5F1E0C3B7@plateautel.net>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAC40k6+A6TRDp4qtksrULn8BAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4997BC1F-5112-4F28-959D-B2D38A98A747@plateautel.net>

Hi Brian,

Most of the tubular items, extension pieces, tail pieces, p traps, etc are made from polystyrene.  They are all no pressure items and are not used for pressure.  PVC drainage on the other hand is made of PVC and is not as suitable for coil forms.  

JamesF



On Nov 29, 2014, at 9:35 AM, Brian Burns <brianburns1066 at gmail.com> wrote:

Hello James,

~ I'm sure that most of you know this but if not, lowe's and other big box
stores sell 1-1/2" od polystyrene extension pieces that are 16" long and
have small flanges on both ends.  They are also available in 1-1/4" OD but
not as commonly.  They also sell 3" polystyrene couplings that fit over 3"
nominal sewer pipe. The couplings are about 3-5/8" OD from memory and make
great forms if you need a large coil.
JamesF

If these are plumbing parts they are probably PVC, polyvinylchloride.
Polystyrene has great RF properties, but its thermal and mechanical
properties are not very good.

Cheers,

Brian 







>> On Nov 28, 2014, at 2:42 PM, "Brian Burns" <brian at lessonsinlutherie.com>
> wrote:
> 
> Hello All,
> 
> 
> 
> Here are some numbers I found for dissipation factor:
> 
> 
> 
> Polystyrene-------------------------------------------.0002 to .00007
> 
> 
> 
> PVC------------------------------------------------------.016
> 
> 
> 
> Steatite--------------------------------------------------.0035 to 
> .0008
> 
> 
> 
> It would appear from these that polystyrene is quite a bit better than 
> even steatite ceramic, probably what was used in old-timey coil forms. 
> No wonder it was so well liked for UHF stuff at Hansen Labs, where I 
> used to work back in the day. Not only does it melt easily, it crazes 
> over time. The base that I have in mind is available from National, 
> and shouldn't have the melting problem, as it's ceramic.
> 
> 
> 
> Next question: Does using the lowest loss coil form "make enough 
> difference to make a difference"? Walt's experience, as well as other 
> builders', using PVC seems to say "no it doesn't".
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> 
> 
> Brian
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> http://www.avast.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com

______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sat Nov 29 13:25:20 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2014 10:25:20 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Dissipation factor of materials
In-Reply-To: <4997BC1F-5112-4F28-959D-B2D38A98A747@plateautel.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAMOih0PmgdRDpu1HHBcml4gBAAAAAA==@lessonsinlutherie.com>
	<EAD76C37-967F-424E-B806-C7A5F1E0C3B7@plateautel.net>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAC40k6+A6TRDp4qtksrULn8BAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<4997BC1F-5112-4F28-959D-B2D38A98A747@plateautel.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAO4YU4U7CBxGtGwNdrfISJwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hi Brian,

Most of the tubular items, extension pieces, tail pieces, p traps, etc are
made from polystyrene.  They are all no pressure items and are not used for
pressure.  PVC drainage on the other hand is made of PVC and is not as
suitable for coil forms.  

JamesF


Hello James,

Well dog my cats! Not only did I not know that, I never would have suspected
it! I've always thought of polystyrene as being good for packing-peanuts,
carry-out food containers, and coffee cups---of course there was the
occasional piece of lab equipment.... (;->).

On mature consideration, I think increased Q of the RF and mixer coils is
not going to make much difference in adjacent channel selectivity. It seems
that it would take something a good deal more radical than changing to a
lower loss coil form, to make any significant improvement in that. 

My obsession with selectivity comes from using a couple of receivers that
were as broad as a barn door, back in the day. At age 74 I'm looking for
"arm-chair copy", even with a strong signal right along side. In reading the
first part of Jay Helm's e-book he says that Ted never did come up with a
solution to the problem of a strong signal in an adjacent channel. 

Cheers,

Brian







---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com


From hbr at mailman.qth.net  Sat Nov 29 23:10:13 2014
From: hbr at mailman.qth.net (Ron Barlow via HBR)
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2014 20:10:13 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Dissipation factor of materials
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAO4YU4U7CBxGtGwNdrfISJwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1417320613.21259.YahooMailBasic@web160101.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>

True, the "Q" of the RF and mixer tuned circuits won't impact adjacent channel selectivity, but it will affect the signal/image ratio, front end gain, and in the case of the RF stage, the receiver noise figure.
                          73 de Ron                        

--------------------------------------------
On Sat, 11/29/14, Brian Burns <brianburns1066 at gmail.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [HBR] Dissipation factor of materials
 To: "'HBR Receiver List'" <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
 Date: Saturday, November 29, 2014, 1:25 PM
 
 Hi Brian,
 
 Most of the tubular items,
 extension pieces, tail pieces, p traps, etc are
 made from polystyrene.? They are all no
 pressure items and are not used for
 pressure.? PVC drainage on the other hand is
 made of PVC and is not as
 suitable for coil
 forms.? 
 
 JamesF
 
 
 Hello
 James,
 
 Well dog my cats!
 Not only did I not know that, I never would have
 suspected

From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sun Nov 30 11:06:39 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 08:06:39 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Dissipation factor of materials
In-Reply-To: <1417320613.21259.YahooMailBasic@web160101.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAO4YU4U7CBxGtGwNdrfISJwBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<1417320613.21259.YahooMailBasic@web160101.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAD+SMW90BDtOr+ARl2wyt4EBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Ron,

~ True, the "Q" of the RF and mixer tuned circuits won't impact adjacent
channel selectivity, but it will affect the signal/image ratio, front end
gain, and in the case of the RF stage, the receiver noise figure.
                          73 de Ron                        

I'm all for using the coil form material that will make the highest Q coils.
The thing that concerns me about the HBR front end design is what happens
with a regenerative system in the presence of strong adjacent signals. 

If I understand what the guys over on the regenrx list are saying,
regenerative systems overload easily, and the high degree of selectivity
that you get on weak signals, goes away when the QRO boys come out to play.

I've often wondered what is the design idea behind having two RF stages. The
top of the line receivers from the tube era often had two, as did the famous
RAL regenerative receiver used by the Navy. It doesn't seem likely that the
HRO-60 needed that extra RF stage for sensitivity. 

I know that Ted lived by the KISS rule, and I certainly appreciate that. It
seems to me that all design is a matter of figuring out what compromises you
can live with---until there is a breakthrough. Somebody comes up with
something altogether new, and all at once the possibilities change.

Cheers,

Brian




---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com


From hbr at mailman.qth.net  Sun Nov 30 12:11:07 2014
From: hbr at mailman.qth.net (Hopperdhh--- via HBR)
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 12:11:07 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Dissipation factor of materials
Message-ID: <c9766.31790d43.41aca9aa@aol.com>

 
I made a plate coil for a Johnson  Messenger conversion to 75 meters that 
was wound on 3/4 inch PVC pipe (1  1/16 inch OD).  The winding was 31  turns 
No. 24 enameled wire space wound using No. 28 wire as a temporary  spacer.  
This gave 17.9 uH with an unloaded Q of about 225.  Not bad  for a small 
coil!  This was measured on a Boonton 260 Q-Meter.
 
A good experiment would be to compare a similar  coil wound on polystyrene.
 
My guess is that the small dissipation  factor of PVC will not affect the Q 
enough to measure.
 
This conversion was posted on AMfone.net several  years ago, but for some 
silly reason I can't register anymore with my aol.com  email address!
 
Dan K9WEK

From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sun Nov 30 12:54:52 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 09:54:52 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Coil Q and the Boonton 260
In-Reply-To: <c9766.31790d43.41aca9aa@aol.com>
References: <c9766.31790d43.41aca9aa@aol.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAGWw+qlW7BtOvjUQS2MdIaUBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Dan,

I have a small budget for buying myself a Christmas present---ham related,
of course! The Boonton 260 has looked keen, and Kees even has some
instructions posted on refurbishing one. Would you say it's worth having on
the test bench of a receiver building enthusiast? I recall on the glowbugs
list there being some discussion about the difficulty of finding/repairing
the thermocouple.

~ My guess is that the small dissipation factor of PVC will not affect the Q
enough to measure.

I'll bet that it can be measured, but that it's small enough that only a
perfectionistic nut case like myself would care about it.

My article of faith about making things is that the difference between good
and excellent is about 5 percent. If you run around picking up 1 percents
here and there, you can come up with an end product that is a real thrill to
use, instead of being just pleasing. At least that makes a good excuse for
the ridiculous lengths that I'm willing go to (;->)... 

Cheers,

Brian
 



---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com


From radioconnection at gmail.com  Sun Nov 30 13:19:12 2014
From: radioconnection at gmail.com (Peter Bertini)
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 13:19:12 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Coil Q and the Boonton 260
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAGWw+qlW7BtOvjUQS2MdIaUBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <c9766.31790d43.41aca9aa@aol.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAGWw+qlW7BtOvjUQS2MdIaUBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+uDY2TAjZa1Y9Rq8jVroeZBO4_e+3TdZt6Y6tbRa7WGGwUT-Q@mail.gmail.com>

I would not recommend buying any vintage Q Meter that uses a thermocouple.
And many earlier models used a 45 type tube in the oscillator, which is
expensive
to replace.

The Heath QM-1 Q Meters are fairly cheap,  but they are limited to
measuring Q's
of 250 on the 1X scale.  For comparative tests, they are probably quite
usable for
the coil forms used in the HBR series.

Peter  K1ZJH

On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 12:54 PM, Brian Burns <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hello Dan,
>
> I have a small budget for buying myself a Christmas present---ham related,
> of course! The Boonton 260 has looked keen, and Kees even has some
> instructions posted on refurbishing one. Would you say it's worth having on
> the test bench of a receiver building enthusiast? I recall on the glowbugs
> list there being some discussion about the difficulty of finding/repairing
> the thermocouple.
>
> ~ My guess is that the small dissipation factor of PVC will not affect the
> Q
> enough to measure.
>
> I'll bet that it can be measured, but that it's small enough that only a
> perfectionistic nut case like myself would care about it.
>
> My article of faith about making things is that the difference between good
> and excellent is about 5 percent. If you run around picking up 1 percents
> here and there, you can come up with an end product that is a real thrill
> to
> use, instead of being just pleasing. At least that makes a good excuse for
> the ridiculous lengths that I'm willing go to (;->)...
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

From waltah at earthlink.net  Sun Nov 30 13:33:01 2014
From: waltah at earthlink.net (Walt Hutchens)
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 13:33:01 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Dissipation factor of materials
In-Reply-To: <c9766.31790d43.41aca9aa@aol.com>
References: <c9766.31790d43.41aca9aa@aol.com>
Message-ID: <226931760.20141130133301@earthlink.net>

Dan K9WEK said:

> My guess is that the small dissipation  factor of PVC will not affect the Q
> enough to measure.

Yep. The amount of PVC (or polystyrene) in the RF field of the coil is
too small to matter. There's resistance in the wire, energy is
radiated, the metalwork near the coil isn't perfectly conducting, the
tuning capacitor and other capacitors have losses: These dominate in
normal situations.

The antenna coil's effective Q will be controlled by the radiation
resistance of the antenna; this is doubtless one reason that receiver
performance in extreme strong signal conditions can be improved by
using a short (NON-resonant) antenna.

As a general design principle the less coupling you can use to the
antenna, the better. Make that HBR work properly with the
W6TC-specified antenna coil rather than coupling more tightly to
overcome poor sensitivity!

Offhand I'd guess that with a well-made HBR and its coils the dominant
factor for the MIXER coil Q is the resistance of the coil winding. Got
any solid silver enamel wire in #20 size?

However this coil probably could have too HIGH a Q: At a Q of 200 on
80M you have a half-power bandwidth of 20kcs or less which will
greatly weaken most of the 500kcs of unwanted signals and the higher Q
you have the more trouble there will be with both tracking and
instability in the RF and/or mixer stage. It's not uncommon to find
this coil loaded with a resistor in commercial designs.

The oscillator coil Q is important for stability. While osc. stability
against actual tuning changes -- the tube elements move, the chassis
expands, wiring moves, vibrates, etc. -- can't be improved by high Q,
transit time and resistance effects in the tube structure ALSO change
the frequency of oscillation and high Q will minimize this problem.

Transit time and resistance effects (the latter might be leakage
between the heater and cathode) change the frequency by changing the
phase shift within the tube. Such phase shift changes force the
oscillator to change to the frequency at which the tuned circuit
provides the (new) necessary amount of phase shift to meet the
requirement of EXACTLY 360 degree loop phase shift. The higher the Q,
the less frequency change is needed to cause a given amount of phase
shift change.

Transit time changes with applied voltage; you can regulate the HV but
the filament temperature also (effectively) changes it, and that's
harder to regulate.

Although the whole superhet idea is to move the main part of the
selectivity to a fixed frequency at which selectivity is easy, a
selective front end is ALSO important in a high performance superhet.
Why? Because the usual triode and pentode mixer circuits are
non-linear on the signal path -- that's HOW they do the mixing between
the desired signal and the local oscillator. However they will also
mix undesired SIGNALS with each other and this mixing can create
products at the desired signal frequency.

Thought experiment: By 100% perfect international agreement a given 20
kcs of the 80M band is totally vacant one evening -- all the usual
signals there have moved to other parts of the band. Is the center of
that 20 kcs dead silence? NO -- it will have a high noise level, due
to signals at other frequencies mixing in your front end so they
produce new sigs in the quiet zone.

In fact, thunderstorms -- an average of 3600 worldwide at any given
time -- create extremely powerful broadband noise which not only
includes the frequency of a desired signal but mixes to cause even
more garbage on that frequency. It's not just a crowded band that
makes a good front end helpful.

Since the garbage products appear at the desired signal frequency, it
is impossible to get rid of them with a selective IF. The only help is
to minimize them by weakening the undesired signals BEFORE they reach
the mixer. That's what high-Q front end coils -- especially the mixer
coil -- do for you.

Multiple RF stages help by giving you another high Q coil to cut down
off channel signals. However there's substantial complication of the
design and in HBR-type receivers I don't think that would be
justified.

Note also that the more the gain in the RF stage the more mixing of
unwanted strong signals will occur in the mixer and subsequent stages.
RF stage tubes should be chosen for strong signal handling ability and
NOT run at higher-than-necessary gain. Either go with W6TC's
recommendation or use a 6EH7 and keep the RF gain control no higher
than necessary.

Walt
KJ4KV


From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sun Nov 30 14:14:15 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 11:14:15 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Coil Q and the Boonton 260
In-Reply-To: <CA+uDY2TAjZa1Y9Rq8jVroeZBO4_e+3TdZt6Y6tbRa7WGGwUT-Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c9766.31790d43.41aca9aa@aol.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAGWw+qlW7BtOvjUQS2MdIaUBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<CA+uDY2TAjZa1Y9Rq8jVroeZBO4_e+3TdZt6Y6tbRa7WGGwUT-Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIqSiFedW95KtmSd8pWNxXABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Peter,

~ I would not recommend buying any vintage Q Meter that uses a
thermocouple....

~ The Heath QM-1 Q Meters are fairly cheap,  but they are limited to
measuring Q's of 250 on the 1X scale.  For comparative tests, they are
probably quite usable for the coil forms used in the HBR series.

~ Peter  K1ZJH

So come on guys! Help me buy myself a Christmas present! A bag of parts
doesn't count---it has to be wrapped and put under the tree as a "thing". My
XYL isn't going to know what it's for, in any case, but it needs to be
recognizable as a "thing". 

I'm a sucker for test equipment, and would buy one of AADE's Mark IIB L/C
meters, but he is closed up with some sort of serious illness. Anybody got
one to sell?

I looked up the specs on the QM-1, and it does have a 2X scale. I don't
suppose it's very likely that we will be winding coils with Q's much higher
than 250 anyway. 

In my Spanish guitar making, I test Q's of wood parts at audio frequencies,
as a measure of their damping properties. So many things affect these
numbers that I only use them as comparative quality measurements. I would
imagine that the same would apply to electronic components.

Cheers,

Brian  





---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com


From hbr at mailman.qth.net  Sun Nov 30 14:48:50 2014
From: hbr at mailman.qth.net (Lee Craner via HBR)
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 14:48:50 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Coil Q and the Boonton 260
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIqSiFedW95KtmSd8pWNxXABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <c9766.31790d43.41aca9aa@aol.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAGWw+qlW7BtOvjUQS2MdIaUBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<CA+uDY2TAjZa1Y9Rq8jVroeZBO4_e+3TdZt6Y6tbRa7WGGwUT-Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIqSiFedW95KtmSd8pWNxXABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8D1DAEDCC52FE7C-D40-34DC6@webmail-vm091.sysops.aol.com>


 If you can find one, I'd highly recommend the AADE Mark IIB L/C meter.  I have a ESI 250-DA Impedance Bridge that I've used for years for measuring capacitance and inductance.  A couple years ago I got talked into buying the Mark IIB, even though the ESI served me quite well.  I haven't used the ESI since.  The Almost All Digital meter is about as accurate and a whole heck of a lot quicker to use.

73
Lee WB6SSW

 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Burns <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
To: 'HBR Receiver List' <hbr at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Sun, Nov 30, 2014 7:14 pm
Subject: Re: [HBR] Coil Q and the Boonton 260


Hello Peter,

~ I would not recommend buying any vintage Q Meter that uses a
thermocouple....

~ The Heath QM-1 Q Meters are fairly cheap,  but they are limited to
measuring Q's of 250 on the 1X scale.  For comparative tests, they are
probably quite usable for the coil forms used in the HBR series.

~ Peter  K1ZJH

So come on guys! Help me buy myself a Christmas present! A bag of parts
doesn't count---it has to be wrapped and put under the tree as a "thing". My
XYL isn't going to know what it's for, in any case, but it needs to be
recognizable as a "thing". 

I'm a sucker for test equipment, and would buy one of AADE's Mark IIB L/C
meters, but he is closed up with some sort of serious illness. Anybody got
one to sell?

I looked up the specs on the QM-1, and it does have a 2X scale. I don't
suppose it's very likely that we will be winding coils with Q's much higher
than 250 anyway. 

In my Spanish guitar making, I test Q's of wood parts at audio frequencies,
as a measure of their damping properties. So many things affect these
numbers that I only use them as comparative quality measurements. I would
imagine that the same would apply to electronic components.

Cheers,

Brian  





---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com

______________________________________________________________
HBR mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

 

From brianburns1066 at gmail.com  Sun Nov 30 15:11:57 2014
From: brianburns1066 at gmail.com (Brian Burns)
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 12:11:57 -0800
Subject: [HBR] Coil Q and the Boonton 260
In-Reply-To: <8D1DAEDCC52FE7C-D40-34DC6@webmail-vm091.sysops.aol.com>
References: <c9766.31790d43.41aca9aa@aol.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAGWw+qlW7BtOvjUQS2MdIaUBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<CA+uDY2TAjZa1Y9Rq8jVroeZBO4_e+3TdZt6Y6tbRa7WGGwUT-Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIqSiFedW95KtmSd8pWNxXABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<8D1DAEDCC52FE7C-D40-34DC6@webmail-vm091.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAISt7x7RaI9CszHhIgzDUAABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>

Hello Lee,

~ If you can find one, I'd highly recommend the AADE Mark IIB L/C meter.  I
have a ESI 250-DA Impedance Bridge that I've used for years for measuring
capacitance and inductance.  A couple years ago I got talked into buying the
Mark IIB, even though the ESI served me quite well.  I haven't used the ESI
since.  The Almost All Digital meter is about as accurate and a whole heck
of a lot quicker to use.

Right...I've had my eye on it for a couple of years. But, now that I'm ready
to buy one, the fellow that owns the company is laid up with a serious
illness! I wouldn't expect anyone who owns one to want to part with it, but
does anyone have a spare to sell?

Cheers,

Brian


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com


From radioconnection at gmail.com  Sun Nov 30 15:33:03 2014
From: radioconnection at gmail.com (Peter Bertini)
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 15:33:03 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Coil Q and the Boonton 260
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIqSiFedW95KtmSd8pWNxXABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
References: <c9766.31790d43.41aca9aa@aol.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAGWw+qlW7BtOvjUQS2MdIaUBAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
	<CA+uDY2TAjZa1Y9Rq8jVroeZBO4_e+3TdZt6Y6tbRa7WGGwUT-Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO9WiXwKTRJMveKqmcXf97/CgAAAEAAAAIqSiFedW95KtmSd8pWNxXABAAAAAA==@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+uDY2QEfjC-VjtPd9x5WBWFU38TgXWtZ0fjWHvRn0Qbm5GXyQ@mail.gmail.com>

Heck, I am a test equipment junkie... that's probably why I have five HP
141T spectrum
analyzers in the shop! LOL!  Actually, two are in for repair for another
ham.

Q's above 500 are hard to come by, unless you start using ferrite cores to
minimize resistive
loses.  Beyond that it is fun to try various dielectric material for the
coil forms.

But, heck, if you want to buy a piece of HP test gear for your Christmas
present, I would be all
for it!  I have two of the QM-1 Heathkit units, and a Boonton 190 VHF Q
Meter that I have
restored. I rarely use them, but I feel warm and fuzzy when I look at them!

BTW, the AADE LCR meter is a great tool!  I would lost without mine.

Pete

On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 2:14 PM, Brian Burns <brianburns1066 at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hello Peter,
>
> ~ I would not recommend buying any vintage Q Meter that uses a
> thermocouple....
>
> ~ The Heath QM-1 Q Meters are fairly cheap,  but they are limited to
> measuring Q's of 250 on the 1X scale.  For comparative tests, they are
> probably quite usable for the coil forms used in the HBR series.
>
> ~ Peter  K1ZJH
>
> So come on guys! Help me buy myself a Christmas present! A bag of parts
> doesn't count---it has to be wrapped and put under the tree as a "thing".
> My
> XYL isn't going to know what it's for, in any case, but it needs to be
> recognizable as a "thing".
>
> I'm a sucker for test equipment, and would buy one of AADE's Mark IIB L/C
> meters, but he is closed up with some sort of serious illness. Anybody got
> one to sell?
>
> I looked up the specs on the QM-1, and it does have a 2X scale. I don't
> suppose it's very likely that we will be winding coils with Q's much higher
> than 250 anyway.
>
> In my Spanish guitar making, I test Q's of wood parts at audio frequencies,
> as a measure of their damping properties. So many things affect these
> numbers that I only use them as comparative quality measurements. I would
> imagine that the same would apply to electronic components.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Brian
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> http://www.avast.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> HBR mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/hbr
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:HBR at mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>

From catman351 at gmail.com  Sun Nov 30 18:03:59 2014
From: catman351 at gmail.com (Cyril Euscobar)
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2014 18:03:59 -0500
Subject: [HBR] Looking for schematic for BC-221 VFO conversion
Message-ID: <CAEkBCjD1UvcTN+9ZDPHURW=Zp+JA+PgLNPe1Lxie2+bpNx7P1w@mail.gmail.com>

Hi:
Several decades ago, QST had this article on converting the BC-221 into a
VFO ( QST March 1947. "The BC-221 Frequency Meter as a VFO" by Howard W.
Johnson, W7NU.).  Does someone have a copy of this they can send me?
Thanks.

From bcarling at cfl.rr.com  Mon Nov  3 12:46:23 2014
From: bcarling at cfl.rr.com (bcarling at cfl.rr.com)
Date: Mon, 03 Nov 2014 17:46:23 -0000
Subject: [HBR] FS: Rare Bliley CCO - 6AG7 Crystal Oscilator Module
Message-ID: <5457BF57.17785.17513B6@bcarling.cfl.rr.com>

FOR SALE:

Bliley CCO - "Crystal Controlled Oscillator" = 6AG7 Crystal Oscilator Module

Here is a Very Cool Commerically built 6AG7 tube oscillator - great for the heart of a 
homebrew transmitter. Rare antique rom hte 1950s - long since discontinued.

This is a Bliley Co. gadget uilt on a little chassis with terminals for power and RF out. On the 
front there is a nice Ceramic Millen Co. style ceramic crystal socket suitaqble for FT243 
crystals.

There is a switch for selecting ranges for use at 27 - 30 MHz or 46  - 54 MHz.
Intended for VHF but with the change of one coil at the poutput this can easily 
become be an HF oscillator.

Neat looking gray painted chassis with terminal strip in rear for all connections.
Excellent condition. Comes with all documentation. Complete with the 6AG7, tube - tested 
nandeworking. 

Available for $25.00 plus shipping.

Pictures and details here:

http://af4k.com/cco.htm

73 - Bry AF4K




 

Brian Carling, Radio AF4K

