[HBQRP] 4 BTV also

[ssellmeyer]

Veeeeerrrryyyyyyy interesting !

Will chat with you more tomorrow at the meeting. Don't know if I'll make the
swapmeet in Springfield or not.
Somewhere there is a Heathkit HW-101 with power supply and speaker enclosure
with my name on it. Wonder if it's there ??? Hmmmm

Steve/WBØQQT


----- Original Message -----
From: "Piatt, Darwin" <dpiatt at fnni.com>
To: "ssellmeyer" <ssellmeyer at inebraska.com>; "Midwest Homebrewers Group"
<hbqrp at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2005 10:17 AM
Subject: RE: [HBQRP] 4 BTV also


Hi Steve..
Well this will be a long answer. I have 4 radials and they run N/S and E/W,
and I want more.
Now some history..

Back in my Air Force days, the MARS station commander (a captain) was a HAM
and a friend. We did some experimenting with verticals as a project for the
MARS station.  In a really big field, we put a full size 20 meter vertical
on the ground with feed point very close to the ground and one 8 foot ground
rod driven all the way down except for maybe 2 inches. We attached a strap
to the ground rod and the antenna mount. We put a field strength meter on a
ladder about 100 yards away. And then we tuned the antenna and measured the
signal strength for each test. We started with no radials, then went to 2,
then to 4 then to 8 then to 16 then to 32 and finally to 64 (we ran out of
wire). Each time we doubled the number of radials we has an increase in
signal strength. We always got a good match because of the tuner, but the
radiated signal got better with each increase of radials.  Our conclusion
was that the antenna was more 'efficient' with more and more radials. This
finding agrees with lots of stuff out on the web.

Now for fun, we put a 14AVQ (40 - 10 meter) out there and more of less
discovered that as long as you had 'several' radials that were at least as
long as the vertical was high, we had basically the same results. At one
point we had 4 radials cut to 1/4 wave for each band (40, 20, 15 & 10) (32
radials). Then we put 32 radials that were the same length as the vertical
was tall. The field strength meter showed no real difference.

Conclusion? Just put a bunch of radials out there, at least as long as the
vertical is high and go for it. (remember, if you will, that a multi band
vertical is only a 1/4 wave on 10 meters, it is short on all the other bands
because of the coils).
One odd thing we noticed was that we had to keep them matched, in other
words, do them in pairs. The vertical seems to get a little 'directional' if
there are more radials on one side than the other.

I seem to have less noise with the radials than I did before and although
I've made no real scientific measurements, my brain tells me my receive side
is better now.

I'm thinking there is a basis of good reasoning why the FCC requires
commercial radio stations to have 128 radials.

See ya all on Saturday after the Flea Market.

De W9HZC - Dar...


-----Original Message-----
From: hbqrp-bounces at mailman.qth.net [mailto:hbqrp-bounces at mailman.qth.net]
On Behalf Of ssellmeyer
Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2005 9:25 AM
To: Midwest Homebrewers Group
Subject: [HBQRP] 4 BTV also

I've got a Hustler 4 BTV also mounted in the backyard. Tried to center it in
the middle of the backyard with all the chain link fence,
flower beds, power lines, garage, house etc. Have yet to put down radials as
I could only run them north/south. Garage to the west and flower beds to the
east. The grass eventually grew over the RG-8 cable that was exposed. I'm
sure it would grow over radials too if "pinned" down with coat hanger hooks.

I drove a 4 foot piece of pipe into the ground about 3 feet to mount it on
leaving 1 foot above ground. This will be it's 4th year and have had no
problems with the wind. I've watched it during thunderstorms and gusts and
it just sways a little but nothing serious. I've read several postings on
various mail groups that say.........if you can't put down at least 120
radials, you are wasting your time. I certainly question THAT statement.

Dar, I'd be interested in knowing if only 4 radials made a noticeable
difference. I could always "sneak" a couple thru the flower beds while she
is at work someday. Have often thought of 4 each for 20 and 40 meters. "Oh
look dear, your flowers are putting out nice, new, green runners (color of
insulation) for next year."     What say ????



Steve/WBØQQT
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