It is confusing. My thought: Once the shaft with the cams starts spinning, timing is such that the start pulse plus 5 more pulses are read. After that, if there is no stop pulse to stop the shaft from spinning, it keeps reading pulses. 

1. Wait for start. Start (0) comes; shaft starts spinning.

2. Wait 22ms, then read the next five bits at 22ms each.

So, that’s a total of 132ms. 

3. After this, do we have a stop bit? Yes, the shaft stops spinning and things wait until a start bit comes (go to step 1). Otherwise go to step 2

In this dot cycle mode, there is no stop bit after the first character. So things would need to really be aligned for the second character to print well.  When I look at that reversal stream it does seem that after the second character finishes there is a stop bit. But that stop bit is short, only 22ms vs 31.24ms. So alignment is still important.

0/10101/01010/1/0/10101/01010/1/0/…
Which is: start/character/character/stop/start/character/character/stop/start/…. 

This does not feel exactly like 7 vs 7.42 operation, it fees like something different. 

Things need to be aligned really well. I would think motor speeds would be a factor.

Of course, I might be totally wrong in my analysis. I never heard of this dot cycle mode. 

Paul
W2TTY

On Jun 3, 2024, at 5:27 AM, Nick England <[email protected]> wrote:


Here’s the issue with reversals (dot cycle)

0 start
10101 Y
0 but I need 1 to stop
        so maybe I keep going
1 is this the first bit of a new character? 
        or is this the stop bit I’ve been waiting for?
        or do I just keep going?
0 is this a start bit for Y 10101 ??
         or is it the first bit of R 01010 ??

I am so confused!

Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com


On Mon, Jun 3, 2024 at 6:14 AM Nick England <[email protected]> wrote:
Yes to the range adjustment. 

Note that “dot cycle” or “reversals” is NOT the same as RYRY. 
Reversals 01010101010101
RYRY. 0101011/0010101/  
(/just to show characters)

Depending on the machine it might print RYRY for reversals or might not. I suspect 7 vs 7.42 speed makes a difference but haven’t bothered to verify that. 

Anyway set the range control with real RY characters, not reversals.

Reversals are great for adjusting polar relays and transmission circuits, not printers. 

Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com


On Sun, Jun 2, 2024 at 10:13 PM Duncan Brown <[email protected]> wrote:
Eugene,

With the "Dot cycle" signal, you are generating a short stop pulse (22ms). 

Check the motor speed and the Range control.  You can probably get it to print correctly with a Range adjustment.  If the Range setting is much different than the other unit, it indicates another problem.

Good luck,

Duncan
K2OEQ



On 6/2/2024 10:04 PM, W2HX wrote:

Thanks Jeff. They both used to work 100% in sync a few years ago. This is something that has changed in the last few years.

One thing I’ll do is put the character generator on a scope (in series with a voltage source) to see what exactly is the difference between setting two characters of R and Y vs. dot cycle.

 

As you suggested, I just tried the dot cycle on the ASR only (removing the KSR) and still had the same result RYYRYY.

I should also mention that, the rhythm of the machine sounds “off” almost like it is running faster than 45 baud. Not much faster, but just sounds off. It used to be when I ran both machines together, they audibly would be perfect. Now the ASR sounds like it is running a little faster. That is the only thing I can think of to describe the sound.

 

73 Eugene W2HX
My Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@w2hx/videos

 

From: Jeffrey Golas <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, June 2, 2024 9:56 PM
To: W2HX <[email protected]>
Cc: Greenkeys <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] M28 ASR Print Issue

 

Id compare selector magnet resistance/inductance, the repeating letters aImost seem like a signal issue than mechanical. Id also try an RY paper tape by itself (or try your tester on just that machine).

 

I wonder if one is intended for a different current rating or has any resistors on the loop that are aging or just too large.

 

Jeff



On Jun 2, 2024, at 9:37 PM, W2HX <[email protected]> wrote:



Hi all,

 

For the last several years, I’ve noticed that my ASR does not print traffic the same as my KSR both are on the same loop. I would say the accuracy of the print is much worse than the KSR. But since I had the KSR working well, I never had the impetus to look into in detail. Tonight, I did a simple test and saw some interesting results.

 

First, I am using a character generator which seems to work well (see attached picture).  The character generator has several modes, QBF (sentence) is one mode, then you can set up two individual characters and send an alternating series of these characters. It also has a “dot cycle” mode, which I believe is simply alternating mark and space. 

 

When I set up R and Y and send them out, both printers work perfectly. However, when I use the DOT CYCLE mode, the KSR again works FB, but the ASR shows RYYRYYRYY. Below are links to the print copy. Note there are two “paragraphs” on the page. The top paragraph is using the individual R and Y characters set up using toggle switches. The second paragraph shows the results of the DOT CYCLE mode. Again, these are on the same current loop.

 

KSR page: https://w2hx.com/x/What-Is-It/ASR-Printing-Issue/20240602_191335.jpg

ASR page: https://w2hx.com/x/What-Is-It/ASR-Printing-Issue/20240602_191352.jpg

 

Anyone have any suggestions where to look?

Thanks

 

73 Eugene W2HX
My Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@w2hx/videos

 

 

<20240602_191208.jpg>

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