[Fists] Helping CW Ops Get Better; WAS: QRS OPS

[Dan KB6NU]

Mike's not complaining about slow operators, per se. Nor did he say that he
refuses to QRS for slower ops. What he is saying is that he is surprised at
the number of operators who don't seem to care whether they are good
operators or not. Some of these are FISTS members, some of these are not.

I have to agree with him on this, and it's just not a matter of speed. Like
Mike, I am continually surprised at the number of operators who are
operating at barely 13 wpm or who slur their characters together or who
don't seem to know the accepted abbreviations, etc., etc. And these aren't
newly licensed amateurs, either. Many of these guys say that they've been
amateurs for 20+ years and work mostly CW!

A couple of days ago, for example, I called CQ, and  a guy came back to me
at about 20 wpm. His signal was strong, but I could barely copy him because
he ran his characters together so badly. He told me that he'd been licensed
for 15 years and that he worked mostly CW. Fortunately, the guy signed off
after his second transmission; I don't think I could have taken anymore.
Fortunately, I don't think this guy was a FISTS member.

Now, what should I have done in this case? Should I politely ignore his bad
operating practices? Should I attempt to contact him and encourage him to
improve his sending? Should I call him a lid and tell him to get off the
air? Ignore any further calls from him?

This really has nothing to do with speed. Mike may or may not QRS for slower
ops. Whatever he does, that's his choice. But his observation that many ops
seem to have gotten into bad operating habits is right on.

I'll take that a step further and say that the presence of these bad ops is
driving away newer ops. Think about it. Say you finally screwed up enough
courage to call CQ on 40m CW, and one of these sloppy senders comes back to
you. They may be sending at a speed you can copy, but the keying is so bad
you can't tell one character from the next. Is this QSO going to make you
want to get back on CW? I think not.

I realize that what I've said sounds pretty elitist, but I don't mean it to
sound that way. I realize that I am not the best operator on the air, and I
thank all those that have been patient with me (including Mike K8XF, by the
way). I also don't want to make FISTS into the "CW Cops," as I said in an
earlier message, but it would be a good thing if somehow FISTS could
contribute to making us all better operators and not garnering a reputation
as the "slow speed CW club."

73!

Dan KB6NU

----- Original Message -----
From: "David J. Ring, Jr." <n1ea at arrl.net>
To: <fists at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Saturday, July 17, 2004 12:08 AM
Subject: Re: [Fists] Fists QRS OPS


> Mike,
>
> I know many excellent operators who are members of FISTS, some of who
would
> put me to shame they are so good.  Everytime I contact them, I am in awe
of
> just how good they are.
>
> One that comes to mind - and he won't get all puffed up because he is now
a
> silent key (dead) is Bob, W2LYH.  Bob was one of the best operator's I've
> ever worked.  If Bob heard a slow ham, he would take out his hand key and
> practice sending SLOW code with it;  if he heard a fast bug, he'd answer
it
> with his blue racer.  The code he sent was pure music.
>
> His character formation, word spacing of code was fabulous.  Bob worked at
> Radio Central for RCA then he worked for ITT - both as a CW operator.  His
> last job was sending traffic to ships at sea at radio station WSL in New
> York.
>
> He could send with any kind of key you'd want to mention.  He could send
and
> copy both American Morse and International Morse by tone or sounder.
>
> He would copy all sorts of JUNK sending from diverse nationalities of
> ships - Pakistani, Greek, Phillipine, and each country seemed to have it's
> own distortion of the code.  He just copied it down - perfectly.
>
> If you've ever seen his station - or a picture of it - you would be
amazed.
> It was a hetrodyned VFO, half-kilowat, sequentially switched home built CW
> transmitter and receiver - the stuff looked better than Collins equipment.
> Bob designed it, fabricated the chassis and built the circuits.
>
> As someone once told me:  "Bob would be the man to HATE - he is a perfect
> operator, can copy anything, can send smooth as silk, and when you think
> 'heck, he probably can do only that...', you learn that he is a top-notch
> engineer; and then to top it all off, he was very unassuming and modest.
He
> would stop and help anyone with a question, or who needed advice.  He
would
> also listen to the new comer - both the builder or the code operator.  He
> was a very likable guy and didn't think himself better than anyone else.
>
> Perhaps that is why he was a FISTS member?
>
> I wish you knew him, he was a powerful example to follow.
>
> A few weeks before he died, he and I had a QSO on 40 meters - we spoke for
> almost five hours - we talked about everything.  He started the
conversation
> with "I was hoping I'd find you on the air..."
>
> During the QSO, he told me "David you have a excellent fist, easy to copy
at
> any speed."
>
> Coming from him, it was quite an honor.  I am grateful for his being a
FIST
> and for knowing him.
>
> I hope the less experienced FISTS members can look at the more experienced
> members in the same way I looked at Bob, W2LYH.
>
> 73
>
> David J. Ring, Jr., N1EA
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike Zbrozek" <k8xf at netzero.net>
> To: <fists at mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2004 9:06 PM
> Subject: [Fists] Fists QRS OPS
>
>
>
>
> Hello Fists -
>
> As a member of Fists since 1999 I am surprised at the consistancy of this
> group.
> Fists continues to attract slow ops like metal filings to a magnet. In the
> beginning
> I was very
> active collecting fist numbers and cc numbers for various awards. I
noticed
> the same
> ops
> on a daily/weekly basis. The people that ask you to qrs back in 99 still
ask
> you to
> qrs
> in 04. And their sending is just as poor. Arent you learning anything by
> now? I am a
> much
> better driver than when I started as a teenager. Practice helps. Why
doesnt
> this
> concept work for
> Fists? I doubt if this type of conversation would be conducted on FOC
> website? Why?
> They have a higher standard for members. I am not a member and have not
> attempted to
> join them.
>
> Too many Fists are  slow fumbling ops and there isnt much we can do about
> it. I have
> known
> a few ops that have left the club for the above reasons stated. What
amazes
> me are
> guys that dont know how to
> send  numbers.....you know who you are,,,guys sending a 3 like ...--- ,
what
> was
> that? I have found
> that its difficult for some to even send their fist membership nbr. What
> more can you
> say.....
> The only thing a  good opr can do is stay away from .58 if that is what
> makes you
> upset.
> I sometimes listen to .058 while doing work in the radioroom and it doesnt
> take long
> until its time
> to spin the Wheel of Misfortune.......sad to say but I know that this is
> what many
> people have
> to do...............
>
>
>
> 73
>
> Mike, K8XF
> Viva CW
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dan KB6NU" <kb6nu at w8pgw.org>
> To: "Fists" <fists at mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2004 2:01 PM
> Subject: Re: [Fists] QRS
>
>
> > Let's not go overboard. It's lamentable that there are bad operators on
> the
> > air, but FISTS should in no way become the "CW cops." Putting these
kinds
> of
> > measures into place would be the downfall of FISTS, and not make the bad
> > operator any better.
> >
> > If another operator won't slow down for you, simply sign off with him or
> her
> > and go find someone else to chat with. If someone is hogging 14.058,
call
> CQ
> > FISTS on 14.056 instead.
> >
> > FISTS should continue to stand for good operating practice and lead by
> > example. Being punitive is a waste of time and energy.
> >
> > 73!
> >
> > Dan KB6NU
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
> > President, ARROW Comm. Assn. (www.w8pgw.org)
> > ARRL MI Section Affiliated Club Coordinator
> > CW Geek (FISTS #9342)
> > Read my ham radio blog at www.blurty.com/~kb6nu
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <YoDoc at aol.com>
> > To: <fists at mailman.qth.net>
> > Sent: Friday, July 16, 2004 11:27 AM
> > Subject: [Fists] QRS
> >
> >
> > > Having just read the message quoted below, I recall many encounters
> > on-the-air with CW operators, all FISTS members, who failed to QRS or
QRS
> to
> > my speed -- usually slowing down to twice the speed at which I was
> sending.
> > Such behaviour is absolutely unacceptable for members of an organization
> > which has, as it's motto -- "Accuracy transcends speed."  I cannot copy
> > accurately when half the characters received fly by me at a rate way
> beyond
> > my comprehension.
> > >
> > > I've been an avid CW operator throughout my ham "career," but am now
> > primarily a digital mode operator.  I still enjoy CW QSO's, but due to
the
> > "diversity" of my amateur radio pursuits, I have not developed copying
> speed
> > beyond 25 WPM, max.  I have had a lot of QSO's with OM's who started out
> > clicking away at 50 WPM, but very gladly slowed to my speed, whatever it
> was
> > at the time.  Lately, nobody seems to want to do that anymore.  I've had
> one
> > OM try to explain it away be saying he is "pushing me to try to copy
> > faster."  Thanks, OM, but I'll push myself be SENDING faster so the
other
> OM
> > I'm working can match MY speed, as should be the case.  The priority
> should
> > always be given to the slowest operator, at least within the FISTS
> > organization.
> > >
> > > I like the idea of setting up a system for booting people out of FISTS
> > upon receipt of "x" number of complaints.  Of course, this would require
> at
> > least two or more complaints on the same operator.  I'd also like to
> > sanction other FISTS transgressions like "hogging" the .058 frequencies
> > (especially 14.058) and run-together sending at ANY speed.
> > >
> > > I also like the idea of requiring future FISTS members to be
"nominated"
> > for membership.  This would require working on-the-air and receiving
> > nominations from at least 3 FISTS members.  Let's see some more
discussion
> > of this concept.
> > >
> > > 73 de Larry, K3LT
> > > FISTS 2008
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >A FISTS member ought to not only know better than for be an arrogant
CW
> > op,
> > > >a FISTS member should strive to set an example of what a good op is
> like.
> > > >Perhaps a change in bylaws is in order. How about if a set number of
> bad
> > > >reports come in, dropping a member from FISTS?
> > > >
> > > >Think about this: IF A NOMINATION FOR FISTS WERE REQUIRED, WOULD
ANYONE
> > > >NOMINATE YOU?
> > > >
> > > >A person shouldn't even have to ask for someone to slow down! A good
> > > >operator should do that automatically. Arrogance (by refusing to slow
> > down)
> > > >is not the sign of a good operator.
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Fists mailing list
> > > Fists at mailman.qth.net
> > > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/fists
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Fists mailing list
> > Fists at mailman.qth.net
> > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/fists
> >
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Fists mailing list
> Fists at mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/fists
>
> _______________________________________________
> Fists mailing list
> Fists at mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/fists
>