[Elecraft] KX1: requesting recommended wire antenna lengths advice

[Pat Ring]

Thanks.  I meant that I have an end fed with unun, like a par endfedz.  I
know it requires a certain length of coax.  I don't really want to use it,
but I know it will tune up well on 40M.  I'll try the other lengths when I
get back...I am looking forward to the folded dipole.  I check in and my
windows are sealed.  I can't drop a line out anyway.  I'll just have to
have a walk down to Bourbon Street and skip ham radio tonight.  Too bad.
Thanks again everyone.  Pat NQ0N

On Mon, Apr 20, 2015 at 5:53 PM, Michael Babineau <mbabineau at magma.ca>
wrote:

> Pat / Jim  :
>
> The idea is that there is no coax feed line.  I suggest that you connect
> the wires directly to the rig / ATU and forget about the unun and coax.
> Because a 24/28 foot wire is non-resonant if you use coax to feed it you
> will incur additional loses because of the mismatch.  No feed-line means no
> feed line losses.
>
> Michael VE3WMB
>
> P.S. Pat if you want a longer length wire,  try 51 feet. It will load very
> well on 40m/20m, but it may require that you roll up a couple of feet to
> get below
> 2:1 SWR on 30m.  I sometimes use this as an end-fed inverted vee or
> inverted-L worked against the previously mentioned ribbon cable ground.
> The KX1 ATU will
> match this.
>
> P.P.S. As a compromise I tried a 26 ft wire at one time and I was able to
> get a reasonable match on 40m, however I discovered that it is much more
> sensitive to how it
> is deployed, as compared to the 28 foot wire and in some configurations it
> was hard to get a decent match.
>
> On Apr 20, 2015, at 3:00 PM, jim <jbollit at outlook.com> wrote:
>
> > The length of you coax feed line also needs to be considered.
> >
> > The feed line is a "transformer" by itself.
> >
> > Jim
> > W6AIM
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of
> Pat Ring
> > Sent: Monday, April 20, 2015 10:51 AM
> > To: Michael Babineau
> > Cc: elecraft at mailman.qth.net
> > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX1: requesting recommended wire antenna lengths
> advice
> >
> > Thanks for all of the list and offline posts.  All very helpful.  I
> thought the 24' length was going to be quite a compromise.  Tried 28' but
> that didn't help much.  Will try the solutions suggested.  Michael, I was
> reading one of your blog posts describing your folded dipole and grounding
> solutions and dismissed it initially because I didn't want to carry a
> pole.  Now I have a thought in mind on how to deploy without a squid or
> jackite pole and will look into that when I get back (I have some cat 5
> cable I will untwist).  Reluctantly packed some coax, unun, and long wire
> > (KX3 Helper) for the trip, but will look into other solutions when I
> return.  I know this radio has been out for years, so I knew there would be
> a bunch of expertise here to help me.  Thanks.  Pat NQ0N
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 20, 2015 at 8:05 AM, Michael Babineau <mbabineau at magma.ca>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Pat wrote :
> >>
> >>> The 24' wire tuned up fine on 20m and 30m, around 1.2:1, but I can't
> >>> get
> >> an KX1ATU lower than about 8.9
> >>> SWR on 40.  Am I missing something obvious, or should I continue to
> >>> experiment?
> >>
> >> Pat :
> >>
> >> My experience is that you need a wire longer than 24 feet to get a
> >> decent match with the KXAT1 on 40m.
> >> Anything over about 12 feet long should match pretty well on 30m and
> 20m.
> >> Try 28 feet if you want to
> >> include 40m and perhaps consider a more extensive ground.
> >>
> >> For a ground system I use a 20 foot length of computer ribbon cable
> >> with 5 or 6 conductors.
> >> Unzip all but about the last 3 or 4 feet and then tape it so that it
> >> doesn’t unzip further. Strip all of the conductors at the intact end
> >> of the cable and attach them all to a banana plug.  This makes routing
> >> the ground off a picnic table easy as it is one big flat ribbon but
> >> the individual unzipped wires can then be splayed out in different
> >> directions on the ground.
> >> I find that with more than about 5 or 6 conductors it starts to turn
> >> into a bit of a tangled mess.
> >> If I decide I want more radials then I use two of these. Note that the
> >> Pomona BNC to banana jack adaptors will allow two banana plugs to be
> >> connected to each terminal (i.e. 2 on the red and 2 on the black).
> >>
> >> If you want to use a shorter wire that will fit on a 20 foot fishing
> >> pole then try a 20 ft length of twin lead (I use the lightweight Radio
> >> Shack Indoor twinlead) with the leads at the top shorted together and
> >> soldered. Install  banana plugs on both of the leads at the bottom.
> >> For 20m and 30m you can connect both banana plugs to the centre of the
> >> KX1 BNC, giving you a FAT 20 ft radiator. On 40m just disconnect one
> >> of the banana plugs and now you have a 40 foot radiator that is folded
> >> in half … which is effectively a 20 foot linear loaded wire that will
> >> resonate a bit below the 40m band, but will match quite nicely on 40m.
> >> (Think of it as half of a 40 foot long folded doublet/dipole).
> >>
> >> I have used this configuration with a 20 foot fiberglass pole to make
> >> hundreds of 40m KX1 qsos and it works quite well and deploys quickly.
> >>
> >>
> >> Michael VE3WMB
> >>
> >> P.S. Trust me .. folding the wire back on itself does not result in
> >> signal cancellation. At worst your vertical will have a very slightly
> >> asymmetric omnidirectional radiation pattern.
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