[Elecraft] P3: Can the Panadapter be used with a Ten Tec Orion 1?

Mon Oct 24 20:52:43 EDT 2011

Hi Lu,

Why not just tune the K3 to the RF output frequency of the Orion?  The
K3's IF output signal is picked off before the crystal filters, so the
P3 shows the actual unfiltered signal received at the K3 antenna
connector.

Alan N1AL

On Mon, 2011-10-24 at 16:39 -0400, Lu Romero wrote:
> Hi Don:
> 
> Thanks for the response.  
> 
> Maybe Im not clear regarding what Im trying to do.
> 
> I have a dozen TenTec Orion 1's at a multi multi operation I
> play at.  Im tasked with "standardizing" the audio
> parameters for this operation in regards to compression and
> frequency response before CQ WW SSB.  We want to make sure
> that all the rigs sound as good as they can sound and have
> consistent levels.  People play with these radios over the
> ensuing months, so they are usually diddled to death by the
> time I get there.
> 
> I have done this in the past "by ear".  That is, I have
> plugged a given rig into a dummy load and diddled with the
> audio settings until I got it to sound "right".  I wrote
> down all the settings and went to another radio.  I set that
> radio on a dummy load and input all the settings I wrote
> down on the first radio.  I used the same microphone, the
> same audio path and made sure the radios were at the same
> software revision.  Lo and behold, the second radio sounds
> different than the first with exactly the same numbers in
> the software!  I have found in practice that no two Orions
> sound the same, using exactly the same numbers and exactly
> the same microphone and exactly the same voice (mine).
> 
> What I want to do is inject pink noise from a Flash Memory
> WAV player that has a track from the NAB Audio Reference
> disk.  I have the WAV player set to loop the file forever. 
> Feeding it through a Radio Design Labs line level to mic
> level amplifier block, the level coming out is 0 VU mic
> level at a nominal 600 ohms impedance.  I want to feed this
> into the mic input of the Transceiver under Test and, with a
> "spectrum analyser" looking at the output of the audio
> monitor circuit (yes, not ideal, but it gets me in the
> ballpark) "see" where Im at.  I trust my ears, but it would
> be nice to be able to see the waveform on the SA.  Knowing
> where I am at, I can then adjust the rig's settings and even
> "pre-distort" the audio input from external processing
> (several transceivers are driven through W2IHY processors)
> to optimize drive, punch and inteligibility.
> 
> As I said, I have done this "by ear" in the past.  But now I
> have a P3.  I can do exactly the same thing on my personal
> K3 by disconnecting the serial connection.  I can then see
> the output of the rig in the P3 via IF leakage, and I was
> able to look at what pink noise looks like at my personal
> station and the effect of applying EQ to the pink noise
> VISUALLY on the P3. I could do what I have to do faster on
> the Orions if I could SEE the waveforms.  It would save me
> time I can use otherwise at this station. 
> 
> What I would like to know is if the P3 can, using any IF
> leakage from the Orion's IF out, do the same thing as I can
> do on my K3. Im not looking for any laboratory grade results
> here, Im just looking for a ballpark image of the modulation
> envelope that includes frequency domain information so I can
> judge the "flatness" (or lack thereof) of the audio
> frequency response of a given Orion rig.  This way, I can
> twiddle the knobs and "match" the rigs as closely as
> possible to a "consistent" starting point since the same
> identical numbers dont seem to have indentical results 
> across Orions as they do on K3's.  If the numbers gave
> repeatable results across several Orions, I wouldnt have to
> do this! I would just input the numbers into all the rigs
> and have a consistent starting point for tweaking.  
> 
> I want to use what I have on hand, I dont want to go out and
> spend money or time building things.  If I was still at my
> old TV station, I would borrow the Tek Spectrum Analyser at
> the transmitter, or the Anchor audio analyser at the studio
> and be done with it, but I dont work there anymore and dont
> have access to these tools, so I wanted to use what I had on
> hand.  
> 
> Guess I will just have to try it and see if it works!  Or
> maybe I will look on the web for a freeware or shareware
> audio baseband spectrum analyser which runs on a PC laptop
> which I can then plug into the headphone output of a given
> Orion and observe the waveform there.  
> 
> I was just curious if someone had used the P3 for something
> like this in the past.
> 
> -lu-w4lt-
> 
> Message: 17
> Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2011 23:40:35 -0400
> From: Don Wilhelm <w3fpr at embarqmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] P3: Can the Panadapter be used with
> a Ten Tec
>     Orion 1?
> To: elecraft at mailman.qth.net
> Message-ID: <4EA4DE33.6020402 at embarqmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> Lu,
> 
> I don't like to discourage list members away from Elecraft
> products, but 
> I do not know if the P3 will do the task you are asking
> about - it 
> depends on what other equipment you have to use along with
> the P3.  Yes, 
> the P3 can do the job IF you have the other equipment to run
> it for your 
> immediate purposes.
> 
> I would suggest that you also investigate the "Simple
> Spectrum Analyzer" 
> by G4AON used in conjunction with Spectrogram or SpectrumLab
> or other 
> computer based FFT audio spectrum analyzer.
> You can find information on the resistive tap and the mixer
> at 
> http://www.astromag.co.uk/ssa/.  This is an adaptation of
> the 40 dB 
> resistive tap from the W7ZOI Power Meter along with a mixer
> to bring the 
> signal down to baseband where it can be analyzed with an
> audio FFT 
> spectrum analyzer.
> 
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
> 
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