[Elecraft] [Elecraft K3] Volume Level with NR

Sam Morgan k5oai.sam at gmail.com
Mon Oct 4 20:24:49 EDT 2010 

I think perhaps we should be including what settings
are being used for not only the DSP settings,
but also AGC SLP and AGC THR as well as AF anf RF settings
all the above will make for different results when folks say,
it's louder or not

using head phones would also make for a big difference
in how high the volume needs to be

maybe not so much in the louder or not part
but in the just HOW much louder it needs to be
to maintain the level of volume heard prior to turning DR on

just to muddy the waters a bit, lol

GB & 73
K5OAI
Sam Morgan

On 10/4/2010 7:01 PM, JAMES ROGERS wrote:
> Not throttled back here.
>
> Jim, W4ATK
>
> On Oct 4, 2010, at 6:20 PM, David Herring wrote:
>
>> General question to those participating in this thread,  when you
>> engage NR, are you running RF gain maxed out, or are you adjusting
>> RF gain back to the point where it just affects the S-meter?
>>
>> Sadly I'm off the air for a few days so I can't test myself, but I'm
>> interested to know if throttling the RF gain has any bearing on the
>> drop in volume.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> Dave, AH6TD
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Oct 4, 2010, at 12:47 PM, Gary Gregory<garyvk4fd at gmail.com>  wrote:
>>
>>> Hmmm...this topic appears from time to time and in the early days I
>>> think it
>>> was relevant. Since Lyle has has worked on the DSP and introduced
>>> F1-x  for
>>> CW and 5-x up for SSB there has been a huge improvement.
>>>
>>> Perhaps the settings used by those experiencing a big drop in audio
>>> levels
>>> are different to mine BUT I have just checked 7.055 listening to an
>>> Indonesian station close to the noise floor.
>>>
>>> The result is I hear a lot of band noise and a soft and difficult to
>>> understand SSB conversation, when I use NR (5-2) the noise drops
>>> significantly and the voice is marginally softer but now
>>> understandable. and
>>> a QSO would be easy to do providing the other station would be able
>>> to copy
>>> me.
>>>
>>> I am sure that Lyle will revisit the Algorithm and see if indeed any
>>> improvements can be made BUT for now I am quite satisfied with the NR
>>> functionality.
>>>
>>> Having said this, we all experience different band conditions and
>>> what works
>>> for one person may not work for all of us.
>>>
>>> My 2 cents worth...keep the change
>>>
>>> 73's
>>> Gary
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 8:15 AM, WILLIS COOKE<wrcooke at yahoo.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> That sure is not what I have observed.  My signals drop about 2 S
>>>> units if
>>>> they
>>>> are strong.  If they are near the noise level they disappear.  I
>>>> am running
>>>> F
>>>> 1-1.  It is worse if I run a higher NR level.
>>>>
>>>> Willis 'Cookie' Cooke
>>>> K5EWJ
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> From: W4GRJ<w4grj at satterfield.org>
>>>> To: Dale Wiese<dwiese42 at mac.com>; Elecraft Email<
>>>> elecraft at mailman.qth.net>
>>>> Sent: Mon, October 4, 2010 4:54:21 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft K3] Volume Level with NR
>>>>
>>>> Dale,
>>>>
>>>> Just for reference, my experience with the K3 NR is outstanding. I
>>>> cannot
>>>> notice any reduced volume on the tuned signal. The NR on my K3
>>>> does a great
>>>> job of whacking out the noise without effecting the signal level.
>>>>
>>>> You may need to do some checking of settings and calibration, I am
>>>> sure
>>>> there are folks here that can help you.
>>>>
>>>> Jack
>>>> W4GRJ
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: elecraft-bounces at mailman.qth.net
>>>> [mailto:elecraft-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Dale Wiese
>>>> Sent: Monday, October 04, 2010 2:31 PM
>>>> To: Elecraft Email
>>>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Volume Level with NR
>>>>
>>>> Wayne,
>>>>
>>>> I am going to disagree - I think its a real issue, and an area for
>>>> K3
>>>> improvement.  While I have not been to Jim's shack to hear what he
>>>> is
>>>> hearing, it  sounds like what I have always observed, at least for
>>>> SSB
>>>> reception.  Engaging the NR significantly reduces the overall
>>>> audio level.
>>>>
>>>> When I engage the NR on my MkV or FT-847, the band noise drops
>>>> away, but
>>>> the
>>>> perceived volume of the monitored voice stays about the same.  It
>>>> is rare
>>>> that I need to touch the volume control.  Yaesu NR is reasonably
>>>> effective
>>>> for turning a marginal signal into something that can be copied, and
>>>> turning
>>>> a strong signal with high band noise into something more pleasant
>>>> to listen
>>>> to.
>>>>
>>>> On the K3, engaging the NR in SSB drops both the noise and the
>>>> apparent
>>>> voice level substantially, requiring that the volume control be
>>>> turned up
>>>> [a
>>>> lot]  to copy the voice.  But then the noise is also increased.
>>>> Frequently it feels like the NR has done little to no good, but it
>>>> is hard
>>>> to tell.  Perhaps the ratio between the band noise and the desired
>>>> signal
>>>> is
>>>> improved, but overall I would say its not.  Or not very much.
>>>>
>>>> The NR difference on SSB between the K3 and the Yaesu products I
>>>> have used
>>>> is large, and the K3 loses.  It is the _only_ K3 feature I find
>>>> which is
>>>> sub-par, and only for SSB - NR for CW seems much more effective.
>>>>
>>>> 73,
>>>> Dale
>>>> N9XD
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Oct 4, 2010, at 9:13 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Jim,
>>>>>
>>>>> Some drop in apparent volume level is typical with NR. Part of the
>>>>> drop is due to the removal of noise. Part of it may be a
>>>>> psychoacoustic effect (sorry, I'm not an expert on this).
>>>>>
>>>>> You might also try setting F5-1. Settings from F5-x to F8-x use a
>>>>> different algorithm.
>>>>>
>>>>> 73,
>>>>> Wayne
>>>>> N6KR
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Oct 4, 2010, at 9:04 AM, Jim Harris wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've noticed recently that when I press NR the volume level drops
>>>>>> what could be called a considerable amount.  I normally use NR
>>>>>> setting of F-1-1 or -2.  More than that tends to almost mute the
>>>>>> receiver.  I find that the volume control needs to be increased
>>>>>> about 70 degrees or so to give the same loudness as before the NR
>>>>>> was pressed with the above settings.  I have to manually change
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> volume every time I engage or disengage the NR.  I realize that
>>>>>> most
>>>>>> likely there should be some decrease in loudness but this seems to
>>>>>> be excessive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Does anyone have any meaningful experience or recommendations they
>>>>>> can pass along.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Take Pride in the USA!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 73,  Jim, W0EM
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Gary
>>> VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile
>>> http://www.qsl.net/vk4fd/
>>> K3 #679
>>> For everything else there's Mastercard!!!
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