[Elecraft] 43' Vertical

Sun Mar 15 20:23:10 EDT 2009

I am in the process of building a 40 meter  1/4 wave vertical.  My hopes for 
this antenna is that when the conditions favor vertical antennas as opposed 
to a dipole, that it will help me to work in to the far East as my dipole 
does not.  I understand that a dense radial field is necessary for good 
results and that the far field which I have no control is a factor.  My plan 
is to use 64 insulated radials as close to resonant as possible, buried a 
few inches below soil.  I thought of using ladder line as the radiator, 
cutting one side for 40 and the other for 30 meters supported by a catenary 
line.  If that does not prove out, I have aluminum tubing which to make a 
1/4 wave for 40.  Anyone have any comments pro or con for my project?  So 
far, I have the pipe in the ground, and the radials cut ready to attach to 
the DX Engineering radial plate.

I have K3 #1366 and really like this radio.  A lot to offer in such a small 
package.

73.

Roy Davis - WK4Y
Richmond VA

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "WILLIS COOKE" <wrcooke at flash.net>
To: "James Apple" <wb1dog at gmail.com>; <Elecraft at mailman.qth.net>; "Darwin, 
Keith" <Keith.Darwin at goodrich.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2009 6:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 43' Vertical and the K2 tuner

>
> Keith, in theory the 5/8 vertical should be 3 db stronger than the 1/4 
> vertical installed in the same position.  A ground plane on top of a house 
> could easily be as good or better than a 5/8 wave ground mounted and 
> radiating into the side of the house and some trees.  3 db is about 1/2 S 
> unit anyway, so it will not be a large difference.  You are correct about 
> the far field conductivity being very important in how a vertical antenna 
> will play, whether it is mounted on top of a tower or house or ground 
> mounted.  The radials are most important to bring up the radiation 
> efficiency, the far field is most important for the take off angle.
>
> The 43 foot vertical will have a higher radiation resistance than a 
> shorter vertical for all bands, making it easier to get the efficiency up. 
> It will still be lower than 50 ohms for 160, 80 and 60 meters, about 50 
> ohms for 40 and higher for the upper frequencies.  I don't have one 
> because I have a 3 element SteppIR with the 30/40 dipole trombone at 21 
> meters.  I don't think the 43 foot vertical will play as well, but they do 
> play well.  I have worked several of the Zero-Five offering and they all 
> play well.  I would expect the DXE, Hygain and MFJ to play well also, but 
> they are newer and I don't know anyone who has one.  All still need a good 
> ground plane and will play much better with conductive soil.
>
> Willis 'Cookie' Cooke
> K5EWJ
>
>
> --- On Sun, 3/15/09, Darwin, Keith <Keith.Darwin at goodrich.com> wrote:
>
>> From: Darwin, Keith <Keith.Darwin at goodrich.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 43' Vertical and the K2 tuner
>> To: "James Apple" <wb1dog at gmail.com>, Elecraft at mailman.qth.net
>> Date: Sunday, March 15, 2009, 2:39 PM
>> A few years ago, I was really on the 5/8 vertical bandwagon.
>>  I thought it was the cat's meow.  The problem was that
>> real world A/B testing did NOT show it to be any better than
>> a 1/4 wave vert.
>>
>> I had a 5/8 wave vert for 15 meters.  Ground mounted over
>> 16 radials.  An ATU at the base took care of the small
>> impedance mismatch and RG-213 carried the signal to the rig.
>>  Hot stuff - or so I thought.
>>
>> I also had a 1/4 wave ground plane (4 radials) on the roof
>> of my single story house.  It was fed with RG-58.  I spent a
>> lot of time with an A/B switch listening to both antennas.
>> You'd think the 5/8 with it's mondo low-angle
>> radiation pattern would walk all over the 1/4 wave but it
>> DID NOT.  DX signals as the band was just opening or closing
>> were sometimes stronger on the 5/8, other times on the 1/4.
>> There was no clear winner.
>>
>> It was years before I found the answer.
>>
>> Apparently, that wonderful low angle radiation that we want
>> out of the 5/8 wave antenna depends HEAVILY on the ground
>> conductivity many, many wavelengths away from the antenna.
>> Far out of the reach of any ground radial system, poor soil
>> conductivity is sucking the low angle radiation down to near
>> zero.  Sure, over salt water it is fabulous, but for the
>> vast majority, it just doesn't pan out that way.
>>
>> So, for "normal" soil, it seems the best height
>> is something less than 1/2 wave.
>>
>> I run a 33' vertical with a Hustler 80M resonator on
>> top.  It resonates on 80 and 40 and does pretty well on
>> those two bands.  It also delivers the goods on 30 meters
>> due to the remote tuner.  On 20 meters and higher it
>> isn't really all that impressive.
>>
>> - Keith N1AS -
>> - K3 711 -
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: elecraft-bounces at mailman.qth.net on behalf of James
>> Apple
>> Sent: Sun 3/15/2009 9:26 AM
>> To: Elecraft at mailman.qth.net
>> Subject: [Elecraft] 43' Vertical and the K2 tuner
>>
>> After the ice storm of 2009, I'm looking for an new
>> antenna.  I've
>> been considering the 43' verticals by DXE,HyGain and
>> MFJ.  But I'm not
>> sure if my K2 tuner will have the range needed.  The DXE
>> site has a
>> warning about internal tuners.  Anyone using a K2 and a
>> 43' vertical ?
>> how's it play ?
>>
>> Thanks in Advance
>>
>> - Jim (WB1DOG)
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