[CW] Fake or Real? MGY

Mon Feb 10 10:02:12 EST 2020

    I think there is conflation of the machines. Poulsen invented 
a magnetic recorder he intended mainly for recording telegraph 
signals. It was not developed commercially. This was about 1900 
but I have to look up the date. The Signal Corps had wire 
recorders based on patents from Armour Research during WW-2. 
Similar machines were available commercially following the war. 
Armour also did research on magnetic tape recorders.  The Germans 
had magnetic tape recorders c.late 1930s. I will have to refresh 
my memory as to exact dates. These were DC bias machines of 
limited fidelity designed as telephone answering machines but 
they evidently had discovered super-sonic bias since recordings 
of Hitler's speeches were broadcast on German radio with good 
fidelity. They were not disc recordings. The source of my 
information is Jack Mullin, who brought back AEG Magnetophon 
machines after the war. BTW, this was completely legal. Machines 
were also brought back by Col Richard Ranger, of Rangertone fame 
(built the NBC chimes machines). Mullin rebuilt the electronics 
of his machines to use American tubes and super-sonic bias. 
Mullin's machines were used to record radio programs for Bing 
Crosby and were the foundation of the Ampex Corp. I am drawing a 
blank on the name of the fellow who did the research at Armour 
but I had the honor to meet and talk with him a few times. Will 
come back and I will post it. Apparently, the first discovery of 
super-sonic bias was done by Carlson and Carpenter at the Navel 
Research Laboratory c.1927 but was rediscoverd by Kurt Stille in 
Germany and by the fellow at Armour. Super-sonic bias allows low 
distortion recording on magnetic media.
     The first tape used by Mullin and Ranger was made by Agfa. 
It differed from later tape in that the magnetic particles were 
suspended throughout the plastic base rather than being coated on 
the surface. The early Bing Crosby programs were recorded on this 
tape. Later tape was made by 3M company (Scotch Tape).  Mullin 
approached Kodak but they were not interested at the time.
    Now, it turns out that wax cylinder recording machines for 
dictating were available as early as 1890 so its possible such a 
machine could have been used in 1912. However, some way would 
have to have been available to drive the recording head from the 
output of a wireless receiver. This is too early for vacuum tubes 
but there were telephone repeater amplifiers using a carbon 
microphone coupled to an earphone at the time so I suppose it was 
possible. These amplifiers were intended for long distance 
telephone work but were not very satisfactory. With all this I am 
not convinced, the recording is too clean and too far removed 
from its presumptive source.
    BTW, I thought Sayville belonged to a German company before 
WW-1.

On 2/10/2020 5:25 AM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
> If a wire recorder and a wire telegraph recorder were available since
> the 1800's, those weren't very qualified experts.  The stuff on the wire
> recorder is interesting to me since the first mention of that technology
> I heard about was on a broadcast of the D-Day Invasion when a
> correspondent going onto Omaha Beach with the troops mentioned he was
> using a wire recorder to do the report.  With the improvements in wire
> production made by manufacturers since the 1800's I'm wondering if
> better wire exists that could be used in one of those recorders if
> finding one of those recorders is even possible these days.  Reel to
> Reel tape I found better than casettes while I used that technology but
> I never had exposure to wire recorders.
>
> On Mon, 10 Feb 2020, spud roscoe wrote:
>
>> Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2020 08:04:43
>> From: spud roscoe <spudrve1bc at outlook.com>
>> Reply-To: CW Reflector <cw at mailman.qth.net>
>> To: CW Reflector <cw at mailman.qth.net>
>> Subject: Re: [CW] Fake or Real? MGY
>>
>> Good Morning:
>>
>> If my memory serves me correctly I remember reading something of the court case over WSL during World War I. In that the so called experts stated they did not know of a devise that could record radio signals. Maybe if you have access to that it will indicate fake because it was four or five years after Titanic. Years ago I interviewed some of the old operators that were operating around then. I find it hard to believe there was a recording and the Cape Race VCE logs on Titanic were lost in the fire when the station burned in 1919.
>>
>> Hope this helps.
>>
>> 73
>> Spud VE1BC
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10
>>
>> From: D.J.J. Ring, Jr.<mailto:n1ea at arrl.net>
>> Sent: February 10, 2020 7:09 AM
>> To: CW Reflector<mailto:cw at mailman.qth.net>
>> Subject: Re: [CW] Fake or Real? MGY
>>
>> The narrator isn't me. There was a W5 callsign given at the end, that man was born in 1920, he has an amazing voice for a man that old.  Most likely the last letter of his call got cut off.
>>
>> I agree with your remarks, they spent a lot of time on a fake recording, I think.
>>
>> 73
>>
>> DR
>> On Mon, Feb 10, 2020, 00:52 Richard Knoppow <1oldlens1 at ix.netcom.com<mailto:1oldlens1 at ix.netcom.com>> wrote:
>>      Now, having listened again to the entire thing with
>> introduction I find some of what I wanted is addressed
>> particularly the origin of the recording.
>>      Is the narrator you David? If so I wish I had been a little
>> more gentle in my remarks. Also, if its you, it makes my
>> judgement more toward the recording being genuine because I know
>> you are a historian and generally pretty reliabl
>>
>>
>
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-- 
Richard Knoppow
1oldlens1 at ix.netcom.com
WB6KBL