[Boatanchors] Boatanchors Digest, Vol 85, Issue 41

[Henry Mei'l's]

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <boatanchors-request at mailman.qth.net>
To: <boatanchors at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2011 12:50 AM
Subject: Boatanchors Digest, Vol 85, Issue 41


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> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Re: MFP (was BC-342 (WA5CAB at cs.com)
>   2. Vintage Hammarlund Transmitter (Joe Walden)
>   3. Re: MFP (was BC-342 (J. Forster)
>   4. Tubes (LARRY D GODEK)
>   5. Re: MFP (was BC-342 (Richard Knoppow)
>   6. Re: MFP (was BC-342 (Todd, KA1KAQ)
>   7. Re: MFP (was BC-342 (D C *Mac* Macdonald)
>   8. Re: MFP (was BC-342 (J. Forster)
>   9. Re: MFP (was BC-342 (Todd, KA1KAQ)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 16:58:18 EST
> From: WA5CAB at cs.com
> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] MFP (was BC-342
> To: boatanchors at mailman.qth.net, boatanchors at theporch.com
> Message-ID: <14f197.227c8ccb.3a96dcfa at cs.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
> Richard,
>
> I don't.  All that I recall is that I only turned up one vendor and that 
> it
> was purpose mixed, not a generic.  A similar search today again turned up
> MIL-V-173C as the late 20th Century spec.  But not the after-application
> solvent for removal.
>
> To maybe answer another question or comment today (about arsenic), my
> search also turned up a Dr. Barry Ornitz reply on a list I'm not familar 
> with.
> He does not mention arsenic.
>
> *********************
> From: "Barry Ornitz" <ornitz at usa.net>
> Newsgroups: rec.antiques.radio+phono
> Subject: Re: voltage rating of enameled wire?
> Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 20:29:53 -0500
>
> "Gene Warner" <warn at ridgenet.net> wrote in message
> news:938ea7$i2v$2 at delphi.ridgenet.net...
>> Wasn't the stuff applied to bare copper wires for motor and tranformer
>> windings actually called Glyptal? At least most all Govt. Specs called
>> for it. I recall ontime looking up the Glyptal Specification and I think
>> the dialectric strength exceeded plain electrical varnish by quite a few
>> hundreds of volts. The Glyptal I am familar with came out of the can red
>> in color. It is also what gives gives the innards of well used govt.
>> electronics that distinctive oder. They even sprayed the stuff on
>> pre-insulated under chassis wiring primarily to tropicalize the
>> equipment. Perhaps if Zenith and other mfgs. had put it on their rubber
>> insulated wiring we restorers wouldn't be
>> gnashing out teeth today over crumbling insulation.
>> R\Gene
>
> Glyptal is merely a trade name for an alkyd varnish.  The name comes from
> GLYcerin and PhThALic acid which were combined in a condensation
> polymerization to produce the raw resin.  Its voltage rating is no higher
> than regular alkyd varnish.  The red color is often obtained by adding red
> lead.
>
> The tropical coating is known as MPF, moisture and fungus proofing.  It 
> was
> originally an alkyd varnish to which had been added copper naphthnate as 
> an
> anti-fungus agent.
> Today if you want to recreate this look, especially with military
> equipment, use urethane varnish to which has been added some yellow and
> green dye.
>
> *******************************
>
> In a message dated 2/23/2011 9:57:17 AM Central Standard Time,
> 1oldlens1 at ix.netcom.com writes:
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: <WA5CAB at cs.com>
>> To: <boatanchors at mailman.qth.net>;
>> <boatanchors at theporch.com>
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2011 7:50 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] BC-342
>>
>>
>> >Some years ago, I researched MFP solvent.  And found two
>> >or three sources.
>> >Unfortunately the minimum order was something like 20
>> >gallons and cost
>> >several hundred dollars.  The only practical removal
>> >method is mechanical.  And
>> >after half a century the best tool I've found is one of
>> >those soldering
>> >accessories marketed under tradenames like "Solder
>> >Helper".  The ones with a
>> >hexagonal wood handle.  Out of one end sticks a metal rod
>> >with a flat on one
>> >side and a tapered and rounded point.  Rod may be straight
>> >or bent at about 30
>> >degrees.  The bent one usually works best.  I've seen them
>> >in two rod
>> >diameters, about 3/16" and about 1/8" diameter.  Out of
>> >the other end is another
>> >rod of the same diameter terminated in a brush or a slot
>> >(for bending wire)
>> >or maybe other things.
>> >
>>       Have you any memory of what the solvent was or was it
>> not a generic one? I have never found anything that takes
>> the stuff off easily. Paint rememover will eventually get it
>> off but it may take many hours of repeated application,
>> certainly not very practical for wiring. Most of the time
>> the soldering iron will burn it off but then you must clean
>> the residue.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Richard Knoppow
>> Los Angeles
>> WB6KBL
>> dickburk at ix.netcom.com
>>
>
> Robert Downs - Houston
> wa5cab dot com (Web Store)
> MVPA 9480
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 16:06:36 -0600
> From: "Joe Walden" <w5jdy at cox.net>
> Subject: [Boatanchors] Vintage Hammarlund Transmitter
> To: <boatanchors at mailman.qth.net>
> Message-ID: <003401cbd3a5$f044b3d0$a0076144 at jhwlqzuxggye4r>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hello from Joe w5jdy in Okla...  I recently purchased a vintage Hammarlund
> Modulator
> Model Four-11 from Brian af4k and am now looking for the matching
> transmitter Model Four-20...  I am trying to put together a AM rig that I
> always wanted when I was a young ham back in the 1960s..   If anyone can
> help me please email
> me direct at w5jdy at cox.net    Thanks Joe
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 14:14:44 -0800 (PST)
> From: "J. Forster" <jfor at quik.com>
> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] MFP (was BC-342
> To: WA5CAB at cs.com
> Cc: boatanchors at mailman.qth.net, boatanchors at theporch.com
> Message-ID: <64950.12.6.201.2.1298499284.squirrel at popaccts.quikus.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>
> It may well be that the MFP coating contains solids and a solvent. After
> application, the solvent evaporates and the solids polymerize. After
> polymerization, the material is no longer soluable in the original
> solvent. In such cases, a far more aggressive solvent may be needed to
> remove the set-up coating.
>
> Certainly modern epoxy paints are like that. You can thin them and clean
> up with a common solvent (xylene, acetone, MEK) but once set are nearly
> impossible to dissolve.
>
> FWIW,
>
> -John
>
> ================
>
>
>
>> Richard,
>>
>> I don't.  All that I recall is that I only turned up one vendor and that
>> it
>> was purpose mixed, not a generic.  A similar search today again turned up
>> MIL-V-173C as the late 20th Century spec.  But not the after-application
>> solvent for removal.
>>
>> To maybe answer another question or comment today (about arsenic), my
>> search also turned up a Dr. Barry Ornitz reply on a list I'm not familar
>> with.
>> He does not mention arsenic.
>>
>> *********************
>> From: "Barry Ornitz" <ornitz at usa.net>
>> Newsgroups: rec.antiques.radio+phono
>> Subject: Re: voltage rating of enameled wire?
>> Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 20:29:53 -0500
>>
>> "Gene Warner" <warn at ridgenet.net> wrote in message
>> news:938ea7$i2v$2 at delphi.ridgenet.net...
>>> Wasn't the stuff applied to bare copper wires for motor and tranformer
>>> windings actually called Glyptal? At least most all Govt. Specs called
>>> for it. I recall ontime looking up the Glyptal Specification and I think
>>> the dialectric strength exceeded plain electrical varnish by quite a few
>>> hundreds of volts. The Glyptal I am familar with came out of the can red
>>> in color. It is also what gives gives the innards of well used govt.
>>> electronics that distinctive oder. They even sprayed the stuff on
>>> pre-insulated under chassis wiring primarily to tropicalize the
>>> equipment. Perhaps if Zenith and other mfgs. had put it on their rubber
>>> insulated wiring we restorers wouldn't be
>>> gnashing out teeth today over crumbling insulation.
>>> R\Gene
>>
>> Glyptal is merely a trade name for an alkyd varnish.  The name comes from
>> GLYcerin and PhThALic acid which were combined in a condensation
>> polymerization to produce the raw resin.  Its voltage rating is no higher
>> than regular alkyd varnish.  The red color is often obtained by adding 
>> red
>> lead.
>>
>> The tropical coating is known as MPF, moisture and fungus proofing.  It
>> was
>> originally an alkyd varnish to which had been added copper naphthnate as
>> an
>> anti-fungus agent.
>> Today if you want to recreate this look, especially with military
>> equipment, use urethane varnish to which has been added some yellow and
>> green dye.
>>
>>  *******************************
>>
>> In a message dated 2/23/2011 9:57:17 AM Central Standard Time,
>> 1oldlens1 at ix.netcom.com writes:
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: <WA5CAB at cs.com>
>>> To: <boatanchors at mailman.qth.net>;
>>> <boatanchors at theporch.com>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2011 7:50 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] BC-342
>>>
>>>
>>> >Some years ago, I researched MFP solvent.  And found two
>>> >or three sources.
>>> >Unfortunately the minimum order was something like 20
>>> >gallons and cost
>>> >several hundred dollars.  The only practical removal
>>> >method is mechanical.  And
>>> >after half a century the best tool I've found is one of
>>> >those soldering
>>> >accessories marketed under tradenames like "Solder
>>> >Helper".  The ones with a
>>> >hexagonal wood handle.  Out of one end sticks a metal rod
>>> >with a flat on one
>>> >side and a tapered and rounded point.  Rod may be straight
>>> >or bent at about 30
>>> >degrees.  The bent one usually works best.  I've seen them
>>> >in two rod
>>> >diameters, about 3/16" and about 1/8" diameter.  Out of
>>> >the other end is another
>>> >rod of the same diameter terminated in a brush or a slot
>>> >(for bending wire)
>>> >or maybe other things.
>>> >
>>>       Have you any memory of what the solvent was or was it
>>> not a generic one? I have never found anything that takes
>>> the stuff off easily. Paint rememover will eventually get it
>>> off but it may take many hours of repeated application,
>>> certainly not very practical for wiring. Most of the time
>>> the soldering iron will burn it off but then you must clean
>>> the residue.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Richard Knoppow
>>> Los Angeles
>>> WB6KBL
>>> dickburk at ix.netcom.com
>>>
>>
>> Robert Downs - Houston
>> wa5cab dot com (Web Store)
>> MVPA 9480
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> Boatanchors mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:Boatanchors at mailman.qth.net
>>
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>> ** For Assistance: dfischer at usol.com **
>>
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 22:23:18 +0000
> From: LARRY D GODEK <telegrapher at q.com>
> Subject: [Boatanchors] Tubes
> To: <boatanchors at mailman.qth.net>
> Message-ID: <BLU139-W17A87FCE1D8BA545DB8F93A7DB0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
> In the event you enter into the burning desire to have more or need some 
> tubes for you Hammarlund radios, let me know.  Real cheap as i think i 
> have a corner on the market.
>
> 6N7. 6J5, 6Q7, 6C5 and so on.  Forgot what all is there.
>
> Lots of 6D6 and 6C6 tubes along with some 6A7 types.  Found a box full of 
> 6L6, some glass and some metal, 6V6 also.
>
> And there are more........  I could use a 12K8, 12SF5 and 12SR7.
>
> Larry
> W0OGH
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 15:29:47 -0800
> From: "Richard Knoppow" <1oldlens1 at ix.netcom.com>
> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] MFP (was BC-342
> To: <jfor at quik.com>, <WA5CAB at cs.com>
> Cc: boatanchors at mailman.qth.net
> Message-ID: <D6F4780193E94E56943DCDAC11C2D29D at VALUED20606295>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "J. Forster" <jfor at quik.com>
> To: <WA5CAB at cs.com>
> Cc: <boatanchors at mailman.qth.net>;
> <boatanchors at theporch.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2011 2:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] MFP (was BC-342
>
>
>> It may well be that the MFP coating contains solids and a
>> solvent. After
>> application, the solvent evaporates and the solids
>> polymerize. After
>> polymerization, the material is no longer soluable in the
>> original
>> solvent. In such cases, a far more aggressive solvent may
>> be needed to
>> remove the set-up coating.
>>
>> Certainly modern epoxy paints are like that. You can thin
>> them and clean
>> up with a common solvent (xylene, acetone, MEK) but once
>> set are nearly
>> impossible to dissolve.
>>
>> FWIW,
>>
>> -John
>
>     I think this is probably correct, it certainly behaves
> like an epoxy, nothing seems to dissolve it although, as I
> mentioned, long enough application of paint remover seems to
> work, but its _very_ slow. Heat will shrivel it so I've
> found that for soldering coated joints a fairly large iron
> works along with some scraping.
>     The notes from Barry Ornitz forwarded by Bob Downs are
> also very interesing and thanks to him for the posting.
> Perhaps there is a secret ingredient: Nonremovium.
>
> --
> Richard Knoppow
> Los Angeles
> WB6KBL
> dickburk at ix.netcom.com
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 18:34:28 -0500
> From: "Todd, KA1KAQ" <ka1kaq at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] MFP (was BC-342
> To: jfor at quik.com
> Cc: boatanchors at mailman.qth.net, boatanchors at theporch.com,
> WA5CAB at cs.com
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTi=6imL43MvjTUYmzMZPKfpfVfHHzLCx8baEpjB4 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 5:14 PM, J. Forster <jfor at quik.com> wrote:
>> It may well be that the MFP coating contains solids and a solvent. After
>> application, the solvent evaporates and the solids polymerize. After
>> polymerization, the material is no longer soluable in the original
>> solvent. In such cases, a far more aggressive solvent may be needed to
>> remove the set-up coating.
>
> Oddly enough, I had excellent luck removing the stuff with hot soap
> and water. Discovered it years ago by mistake while cleaning up a part
> or sub chassis, can't remember now. All I remember is that the hot
> water really took the stuff off and turned the cleaning rag yellow
> that I was using.
>
> Might've been a fluke - bad batch or whatever, but it sure came off
> easy. I figured the hot water softened or dissolved it. IIRC, it was
> Dawn dish soap I was using. And a toothbrush.
>
> ~ Todd,  KA1KAQ/4
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 17:42:45 -0600
> From: D C *Mac* Macdonald <k2gkk at hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] MFP (was BC-342
> To: <ka1kaq at gmail.com>, <jfor at quik.com>
> Cc: boatanchors at mailman.qth.net, "WA5CAB, Robert Downs"
> <wa5cab at cs.com>
> Message-ID: <BLU129-W207FAE5C556FCFD189286AF1DB0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
> Dawn dishwashing liquid is widely known as a
> "wonder" cleaner for all sorts of stuff.
>
> * * * * * * * * * * *
> * 73 - Mac, K2GKK/5 *
> * (Since 30 Nov 53) *
> * Oklahoma City, OK *
> * USAF, Ret (61-81) *
> * * * * * * * * * * *
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------
>> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 18:34:28 -0500
>> From: ka1kaq at gmail.com
>> To: jfor at quik.com
>> CC: boatanchors at mailman.qth.net; boatanchors at theporch.com; WA5CAB at cs.com
>> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] MFP (was BC-342
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 5:14 PM, J. Forster wrote:
>> > It may well be that the MFP coating contains solids and a solvent. 
>> > After
>> > application, the solvent evaporates and the solids polymerize. After
>> > polymerization, the material is no longer soluable in the original
>> > solvent. In such cases, a far more aggressive solvent may be needed to
>> > remove the set-up coating.
>>
>> Oddly enough, I had excellent luck removing the stuff with hot soap
>> and water. Discovered it years ago by mistake while cleaning up a part
>> or sub chassis, can't remember now. All I remember is that the hot
>> water really took the stuff off and turned the cleaning rag yellow
>> that I was using.
>>
>> Might've been a fluke - bad batch or whatever, but it sure came off
>> easy. I figured the hot water softened or dissolved it. IIRC, it was
>> Dawn dish soap I was using. And a toothbrush.
>>
>> ~ Todd, KA1KAQ/4
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 15:46:35 -0800 (PST)
> From: "J. Forster" <jfor at quik.com>
> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] MFP (was BC-342
> To: "Todd, KA1KAQ" <ka1kaq at gmail.com>
> Cc: boatanchors at mailman.qth.net, wa5cab at cs.com
> Message-ID: <55767.12.6.201.2.1298504795.squirrel at popaccts.quikus.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>
> Todd,
>
> At a guess, that was a fluke and the coating was not well adhered.
>
> As to water and soap, if there are minor defects in the coating, the
> water, with surface tension lowered by the soap, will get under the
> coating and lift it in bubbles.  Think rust propagating under paint.
>
> FWIW,
>
> -John
>
> ===============
>
>
>
>> On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 5:14 PM, J. Forster <jfor at quik.com> wrote:
>>> It may well be that the MFP coating contains solids and a solvent. After
>>> application, the solvent evaporates and the solids polymerize. After
>>> polymerization, the material is no longer soluable in the original
>>> solvent. In such cases, a far more aggressive solvent may be needed to
>>> remove the set-up coating.
>>
>> Oddly enough, I had excellent luck removing the stuff with hot soap
>> and water. Discovered it years ago by mistake while cleaning up a part
>> or sub chassis, can't remember now. All I remember is that the hot
>> water really took the stuff off and turned the cleaning rag yellow
>> that I was using.
>>
>> Might've been a fluke - bad batch or whatever, but it sure came off
>> easy. I figured the hot water softened or dissolved it. IIRC, it was
>> Dawn dish soap I was using. And a toothbrush.
>>
>> ~ Todd,  KA1KAQ/4
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 18:50:16 -0500
> From: "Todd, KA1KAQ" <ka1kaq at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] MFP (was BC-342
> To: "D C *Mac* Macdonald" <k2gkk at hotmail.com>
> Cc: boatanchors at mailman.qth.net, jfor at quik.com, "WA5CAB, Robert Downs"
> <wa5cab at cs.com>
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTik+WbS+9sr0APeT0BAZwPjJAyPUZaA_7oaCE3i9 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 6:42 PM, D C *Mac* Macdonald <k2gkk at hotmail.com> 
> wrote:
>>
>> Dawn dishwashing liquid is widely known as a
>> "wonder" cleaner for all sorts of stuff.
>
> It works well on grease, and that's what I think I was trying to deal
> with. Hot water helps a lot too, I think it probably did the bulk of
> the work. And of course, it;s not a practical approach for an entire
> radio and all its solder connections.
>
> ~ Todd/KAQ
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> ______________________________________________________________
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> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:Boatanchors at mailman.qth.net
>
> List Administrator: Duane Fischer, W8DBF
> ** For Assistance: dfischer at usol.com **
>
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
> End of Boatanchors Digest, Vol 85, Issue 41
> *******************************************