[Boatanchors] R-390 Digest, Vol 82, Issue 9

Sat Feb 5 12:28:05 EST 2011

The company 'Sunshine Makers'" produces "Simple Green". 

Good News:

They also make a product called 'Simple Green Precision Equipment Degreaser'. It "WAS" sold right next to the familiar SG green bottle. It came in a BLUE bottle. This stuff has a label stating "meets Boeing spec D6-17487P". The label also states "NON_CORROSIVE safe on aluminum and carbon fiber!" I restore boatanchors and old test equipment. I have tried literally EVERY type of cleaner and this stuff was flat the BEST. 

Bad News:

Home Depot discontinued it. It was right next to the green bottled SG. Every time I (or a close friend) would visit the store, we would pick up a few bottles. Alas, the last time I found it was on the "discontinued" rack. I bought every bottle they had.

I am down to my last bottle......  Got some funky cigarette stained knobs? Put them in a jar of the 'blue' SG, shake it, and they look brand new. If they are REALLY disgusting, you might have to use a soft toothbrush. It will NOT remove lettering, white marker lines, etc. It leaves Dakaware knobs shiney. Some cleaners will dull the bakelite type knobs.
Every time I use it, I am just amazed. I'm gonna contact the company and see if I can buy a case or two. It's THAT good, and I'm pretty tight with a buck! ha ha

ron
N4UE

.

-----Original Message-----
From: r-390-request <r-390-request at mailman.qth.net>
To: r-390 <r-390 at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Sat, Feb 5, 2011 12:01 pm
Subject: R-390 Digest, Vol 82, Issue 9

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oday's Topics:
   1. Re: More chemicals from the dark side (Barry Williams)
  2. Re: More chemicals from the dark side (rbethman)
  3.  Benchmark - R390A odd-ball cleaning and lubrication (Tisha Hayes)
  4. EAC R-390A for sale (Dr Fred Hambrecht)
  5. Re: Benchmark - R390A odd-ball cleaning and lubrication (Jim)
  6. Re: More chemicals from the dark side (Francesco Ledda)
  7. Re: More chemicals from the dark side (Roy Morgan)

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
ate: Fri, 04 Feb 2011 11:42:13 -0600
rom: Barry Williams <ba.williams at charter.net>
ubject: Re: [R-390] More chemicals from the dark side
o: r-390 at mailman.qth.net
essage-ID: <4D4C3A75.8030509 at charter.net>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
A member informed the list some years ago that the Air Force had 
rohibited the use of Simple Green for exterior aircraft cleaning 
ecause it corroded metal when not washed away thoroughly. A thorough 
ashing was meant as when parts were disassembled.

he other Barry

 It may well have been discussed here, as is just about anything and
 everything.

 The Karcher Corp. that makes pressure washers, makes the pump out of
 Aluminum and Brass.

 They are very picky as to what should or should not be run through them.

 When directly contacted, they said Simple Green was just fine.  I've
 been using it for over 8 years now.  No damage or issues.  I don't even
 have to run clear water through it, although I do anyway.

 If it was so detrimental to aluminum, then why is it so highly
 recommended and used by General Aviation owners?

 Bob - N0DGN

 On 2/4/2011 12:21 PM, Shoppa, Tim wrote:
> Didn't we discuss here in the past year, something about keeping Simple Green 
way from aluminum chassis or at least making sure it was very thoroughly washed 
ff afterwards to prevent long-term corrosion from residues? When you gotta 
lean off the cleaner that you used to clean off the cleaner it starts sounding 
ike "the old lady who swallowed the fly".
>
> Most of the geartrain parts are steel but I wonder if some parts might be 
luminum?
 ______________________________________________________________

------------------------------
Message: 2
ate: Fri, 04 Feb 2011 13:04:00 -0500
rom: rbethman <rbethman at comcast.net>
ubject: Re: [R-390] More chemicals from the dark side
o: R-390 List Serve <R-390 at mailman.qth.net>
essage-ID: <4D4C3F90.7070609 at comcast.net>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
The "Flying Circus" here in Bealton, VA use Simple Green every day they 
o their Aerobatic routines.
They use it on props, leading edges, and struts.  They use it to clean 
ll the bugs and bug entrails after all the low altitude routines.
They don't shower the entire aircraft with it.
They too have an A&P in the group that oversees their annuals and other 
ork that they are allowed to do.  There is also an FAA representative 
n the field for every show.
It seems to be an issue of how mad one is about over use.
Bob - N0DGN
On 2/4/2011 12:38 PM, Cecil Acuff wrote:
 It's not recommended here by the majority of General Aviation owners I 
 frequent...

 We have an A&P on the field and most of the owners do their own Annual 
 inspections under his watchful eye before being signed off on by the 
 certified Inspector.

 Cecil 

------------------------------
Message: 3
ate: Fri, 4 Feb 2011 12:16:12 -0600
rom: Tisha Hayes <tisha.hayes at gmail.com>
ubject: [R-390]  Benchmark - R390A odd-ball cleaning and lubrication
o: R-390 at mailman.qth.net
essage-ID:
<AANLkTimH07=9wPq+X=y8GVfwoogGWrt2LC9WJRMViztS at mail.gmail.com>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
What would really help would be a heated ultrasonic cleaning tank. Of
ourse, when dealing with flammable or combustible materials you need to
ake certain that the flash point temperature is not exceeded and you have
dequate fume control.
I would set the thing up in the yard and run it outside. It is amazing what
n ultrasonic cleaner will do for some of the gear packs like the clutch
echanism that is usually filled with 40 year old grease.
With any water based cleaning solution you need to be aware of
lectro-galvanic corrosion due to dissimilar metals. Some solvents react
adly with alkali earth metals (aluminum) and others react badly with lead
some of the trichloro... solutions).
Light oils like kerosine, mineral spirits, etc.. are usually inert to the
etal but may take time to soften and remove built up deposits. I have used
white gas" (Stoddard Solvent, Coleman fuel) as a cleaning solvent. It is
ot as volatile as gasoline (that has lots of light ends and additives) and
 little more aggressive than kerosene. Usually I put the parts in a sealed
ontainer with the solvent and shake the container around.
The bad rap that Simple Green had came from a few instances where it was
sed in too strong of a concentration and the residues were allowed to build
p in an enclosed space. Then you will get corrosion or a strong reaction
ue to dissimilar metals. (note: even changing the temper of a metal by
rilling, heating or bending can cause a local electrgalvanic reaction
etween that area and another section on the same part.
-- 
s. Tisha Hayes/ AA4HA
---------------
I'll be a diode, cathode, electrode
verload, generator, oscillator
ake a circuit with me." -- The Polecats

-----------------------------
Message: 4
ate: Fri, 4 Feb 2011 13:22:47 -0500
rom: "Dr Fred Hambrecht" <w4jle at w4jle.com>
ubject: [R-390] EAC R-390A for sale
o: <R-390 at mailman.qth.net>
essage-ID: <D0209F0A63864040888CA8E8C0D3AA8C at FredPC>
ontent-Type: text/plain;	charset="us-ascii"
I have an EAC R390A that is in excellent condition mechanically with both
op and bottom covers. I have not turned it on in years. It worked fine when
ast turned on, but not having a variac I hesitate to turn it on now.
I would like to sell it and am open to fair offers or trades. I may be
ontacted at W4JLE at w4jle.com

73 Fred W4JLE 

------------------------------
Message: 5
ate: Fri, 04 Feb 2011 13:29:49 -0500
rom: "Jim" <jbrannig at verizon.net>
ubject: Re: [R-390] Benchmark - R390A odd-ball cleaning and
lubrication
o: "Tisha Hayes" <tisha.hayes at gmail.com>,	<R-390 at mailman.qth.net>
essage-ID: <E0145A3500484018BC4328859105A48D at DJCK4V71>
ontent-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
reply-type=original
I used diluted Simple Green to clean my S-line and a few other BA's...
Granted, this is not the challenge of the R-390A gear train...but
Simple Green with artist brushes for agitation and a through rinse with 
istilled water worked wonders...
Compressed air to clear off the standing water and a day or so in the bright 
ot sunshine did the trick...
(Does anyone remember bright, hot sunshine?)
Jim

 The bad rap that Simple Green had came from a few instances where it was
 used in too strong of a concentration and the residues were allowed to 
 build
 up in an enclosed space. Then you will get corrosion or a strong reaction
 due to dissimilar metals. (note: even changing the temper of a metal by
 drilling, heating or bending can cause a local electrgalvanic reaction
 between that area and another section on the same part.

 -- 
 Ms. Tisha Hayes/ AA4HA

------------------------------
Message: 6
ate: Fri, 4 Feb 2011 16:29:19 -0600
rom: Francesco Ledda <frledda at att.net>
ubject: Re: [R-390] More chemicals from the dark side
o: rbethman <rbethman at comcast.net>
c: R-390 List Serve <R-390 at mailman.qth.net>
essage-ID: <C58C5CCC-010D-40DD-A4AF-AC6E7D9124CB at att.net>
ontent-Type: text/plain;	charset=us-ascii
Simple green should no be used on airplanes or aluminum structures. It will 
orrode rivets etc. I may be used if heavily diluted and the surface is washed 
ith water afterward. Corrosion is the biggest enemy of airplanes. I don't 
nderstand why anyone would want more corrosion. I also know from personal 
xperience that not all A&P are the same.
Old timer pilot and aircraft owner... 
Sent from my iPhone

n Feb 4, 2011, at 12:04, rbethman <rbethman at comcast.net> wrote:
> The "Flying Circus" here in Bealton, VA use Simple Green every day they 
 do their Aerobatic routines.

 They use it on props, leading edges, and struts.  They use it to clean 
 all the bugs and bug entrails after all the low altitude routines.

 They don't shower the entire aircraft with it.

 They too have an A&P in the group that oversees their annuals and other 
 work that they are allowed to do.  There is also an FAA representative 
 on the field for every show.

 It seems to be an issue of how mad one is about over use.

 Bob - N0DGN

 On 2/4/2011 12:38 PM, Cecil Acuff wrote:
> It's not recommended here by the majority of General Aviation owners I 
> frequent...
> 
> We have an A&P on the field and most of the owners do their own Annual 
> inspections under his watchful eye before being signed off on by the 
> certified Inspector.
> 
> Cecil 

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Message: 7
ate: Sat, 5 Feb 2011 01:55:52 -0500
rom: Roy Morgan <k1lky at earthlink.net>
ubject: Re: [R-390] More chemicals from the dark side
o: rbethman <rbethman at comcast.net>
c: R-390 List Serve <R-390 at mailman.qth.net>
essage-ID: <50072C23-5ACD-4A3F-936F-6B028DC32DBC at earthlink.net>
ontent-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes

n Feb 4, 2011, at 12:30 PM, rbethman wrote:

 The Karcher Corp. that makes pressure washers, ...
 When directly contacted, they said Simple Green was just fine.
..

 If it was so detrimental to aluminum, then why is it so highly
 recommended and used by General Aviation owners?
The Army published a prohibition against Simple Green in one of it's  
echanics magazines quite some time ago.
Quoting:
Never use an cleaning product on your aircraft that has not been  
pproved by the Army. SIMPLE GREEN has not been approved and is not  
uthorized for use as an aircraft wash.
  It is highly corrosive on aircraft aluminum.  It also makes high- 
trength aircraft alloys brittle. If your unit is using SIMPLE GREEN  
s an aircraft wash, STOP!"
rom a publication called PS 573, AUG 00
I had not heard that General Aviation owners use it.
Roy

Roy Morgan
1lky at earthlink.net
1LKY Since 1958 - Keep 'em Glowing!

------------------------------
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nd of R-390 Digest, Vol 82, Issue 9
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