[Alexandria Radio Club Reflector] Boat RF Ground plans, plus do you know if anyone has a battery cable crimper and cable cutter that I can use?

Fri May 28 08:46:33 EDT 2021

Handy calculator:  http://circuitwizard.bluesea.com

On Fri, May 28, 2021, 08:38 Ian <iann8ik at gmail.com> wrote:

> Ancor is a gold standard for marine wiring.  Specify size by AWG, not SAE.
> They are very different.
>
>
> On Fri, May 28, 2021, 07:59 Philip Brown <phil at pjb3.com> wrote:
>
>> Thank you, Ian!
>>
>> I will use yellow for ground instead of Black.  I appreciate the info.
>>
>> Also, I made a typo.  All wire will be copper wire that is tin coated.
>>
>> I don’t know why I wrote aluminum…. I know that aluminum is NOT a
>> preferred wire, except for some feeder lines to homes call SER for “service
>> entry round” where they use very thick aluminum wires for some reason, and
>> you need to use a special paste where they connect to avoid some type of
>> buildup that can cause high resistance over time that generates heat and
>> can even cause a fire.
>>
>> With that said, Copper is the preferred wiring, and tinned copper is
>> preferred for boats.
>>
>> I will look into getting yellow for the ground if possible… if it’s not
>> available I guess I *will* use black, since — among other reasons — I don’t
>> have A/C and don’t plan to add it… but at a minimum, I’ll buy yellow
>> electrical tape and/or yellow heat shrink so that I can put at least two
>> bands of yellow at the termination of the black wires as a way of marking
>> them.
>>
>> Thanks again, Ian!
>>
>>          73!
>>
>>             -Phil
>>
>> On May 28, 2021, at 7:32 AM, Ian <iann8ik at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Phil,
>>
>> Be sure that you're using marine grade tinned wiring, not untinned
>> automotive grade wiring.  In the ham world DC positive is red and DC
>> negative is black, but in the marine world DC positive is also red but DC
>> negative/ground is yellow.  This is so that the black wires are easily
>> distinguished as AC hot single-phase.
>>
>> 73, Ian N8IK
>>
>> On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 12:05 AM Philip Brown <phil at pjb3.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Great!
>>>
>>> I’m still working in my wiring plan (draft attached), including figuring
>>> out what size wire to use for different runs.
>>> While I don’t want to undersize anything, I’ll have to make the classic
>>> tradeoff between size and cost.
>>>
>>> All wiring will be tinned aluminum.
>>>
>>> Also,  I’ve found a company www.batterycablesusa.com, that has  very
>>> competitive prices for wires, and for a little less than $2 per connection
>>> they
>>> will crimp on a lug of your choice and heat shrink it…. so I’m looking
>>> at plans and budgets, but I’m tempted to let the pros do the crimping and
>>> heating since they
>>> likely have hydraulic crimpers and other professional grade tools.
>>>
>>> Thank you Jack W4JJ.
>>>
>>> I will reach out to you and/or Don if I end up crimping my own cables.
>>>  (Don has some tools too).
>>>
>>> A preview of my plans are attached, but they are still a work in
>>> progress, and once I’m done I’ll probably ask for some input from the more
>>> experiences hams.
>>>
>>> I’m rewiring the whole boat, including moving the battery forward from
>>> the stern to under the passenger seat much closer to the bow, and also
>>> adding a 2nd battery and an automatic charge relay that keeps the batteries
>>> isolated except when the one of them is being charged, then the unit
>>> connects them in parallel so that both batteries charge.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 73
>>>
>>>      -Philip,  W3PJB
>>>
>>>
>>> On May 27, 2021, at 5:01 PM, W4JJ <jackparker at w4jj.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, I have one that should work.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On May 27, 2021, at 1:32 PM, Ian <iann8ik at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Anyone have a crimping tool to handle 4ga battery cable?
>>> 73, Ian N8IK
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
>>> From: Philip Brown <phil at pjb3.com>
>>> Date: Wed, May 26, 2021 at 9:22 PM
>>> Subject: Boat RF Ground plans, plus do you know if anyone has a battery
>>> cable crimper and cable cutter that I can use?
>>> To: Ian Keith <n8ik at arrl.net>, Don (KI4D) <don.ki4d at gmail.com>
>>> Cc: Philip J Brown III <phil at pjb3.com>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hello Ian,
>>>
>>> (Don,  I’m CC’ing as an FYI… since you’re clearly interested in
>>> everything
>>> RF ! :-)     )
>>>
>>> Do you know if anyone in the club has a battery cable crimper that I can
>>> borrow?
>>> Is there any way that you could pose the question to the membership?
>>>
>>>
>>> I’m planning to run some 4 Gauge tinned copper wires in both the boat and
>>> the 4Runner, and once I crimp and heat-shrink the cables
>>> I’d have no use for a crimper or a cable cutter of that size…  not to
>>> mention that this project is starting to get **expensive**  !!  :-)
>>>
>>>
>>> Here’s the update on my plans for an RF ground for the boat, and also for
>>> my 4Runner.
>>>
>>> *Any feedback from you, Don or an Elmer would be warmly welcomed.  :-)*
>>>
>>>
>>> I found a part on craig’s list for $45 and bought it today — New old
>>> stock…. basically someone bought it and never used.
>>> Westmarine sells the same part new for $109.   The manufacturer claims it
>>> has the same effect as 12 sqft of copper foil.
>>>
>>> It’s cool.  It’s extremely pourous bronze that is specially bonded
>>> together
>>> to act as an electrical and RF ground.  You bolt it to the bottom
>>> of your boat, and connect the ground wire to a gold plated bolt using
>>> gold
>>> plated nuts that are provided.
>>>
>>> It also protects the boat from lightning strikes by offering a
>>> high-current
>>> path to ground.
>>> It has some type of silver conductive paste that’s dried out in the box
>>> for
>>> my unit… I could probably use a small amount if anyone has a tube of that
>>> as well.
>>>
>>> The guy who I bought mine from said that his boat had a lighting strike
>>> while at the dock, and while it destroyed his dynaplate and fried his
>>> electronics,
>>> it didn’t blow-out his through-hull transducer, which he said is a common
>>> problem that leaves a hole in the hull that sinks many boats.
>>>
>>> This is pretty cool, and all new to me, but I find it exciting!
>>>
>>> I’m planning to use one of these
>>> as my “common RF ground” point for the boat, and another one for the
>>> 4Runner.
>>> I’m planning to run a  4 gauge copper tinned cable from this ground to
>>> the
>>> dynaplate on the boat, and to the vehicles body near the battery ground
>>> on the 4Runner.
>>>
>>> From Westmarine:
>>>
>>>
>>>  1. Marine Electronics <https://www.westmarine.com/marine-electronics> /
>>>  2. Marine Communication <
>>> https://www.westmarine.com/marine-communication>
>>>   /
>>>  3. VHF Accessories <https://www.westmarine.com/vhf-accessories> /
>>>  4. Grounding <https://www.westmarine.com/grounding>
>>>
>>> [image: Dynaplate, Bonding Use]larged view of picture, opens dialimages
>>> carousel, showing slide 1 of 1
>>> GUEST <https://www.westmarine.com/guest>–Dynaplate, Bonding Use
>>> 0 stars, 0 reviews, skips to reviews
>>> $109.99
>>>
>>>
>>> Model # 377010 | Mfg # 4008
>>> SpecsDynaplate, Bonding Use
>>> NameValue
>>> Type Ground Plates
>>> Product Overview
>>>
>>> Bronze grounding plates replace yards of copper foil. Looks like a solid
>>> bronze plate, but actually a porous matrix of bronze spheres, presenting
>>> the same effective electrical surface as a much larger expanse of copper
>>> foil. Use as electronic ground for SSBs, Lorans and ham transceivers, or
>>> as
>>> a ground reference in bonding systems. Includes gold-plated bronze
>>> flathead
>>> fasteners and silver contact paste for superior conductivity. Plates have
>>> tapered ends and rounded edges for reduced turbulence.
>>>
>>> Standard Dynaplate
>>> Part No. 4006
>>> Dimensions: 6.0"W x 2.0" H x 0.50" D
>>> Mounting Holes: 2-1/2" center to center
>>> Mounting Hardware:1-3" Gold plated bolt and nut, 1-3" Bronze bolt and
>>> nut,
>>> 3 copper washers
>>> Weight: 3 Lbs.
>>>
>>>
>>>  - Use for basic bonding and grounding
>>>  - Improves performance of electronics and reduces RF interference
>>>  - Offers the best path for hull bonding without long runs of copper foil
>>>  - Equivalent to 12 square feet of copper foil
>>>  - Provides a direct, low resistance path for improved lighting
>>> protection
>>>  - Deters electrolysis and galvanic corrosion
>>>  - Sintered porous bronze sphere construction for maximum conductivity in
>>>  a compact size
>>>  - Low drag, non fouling shape
>>>  - Easy to install
>>>  - Easy to clean with wire brush
>>>  - Conforms to ABYC standards
>>>
>>> From the installation instructions:
>>> ______________________________________________________________
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>>