[50mhz] New DXCC activated on 6m!

Sat Jan 29 18:28:02 EST 2011

Howdy John,

I agree - stacking a pair of antennas side by side if they are vertically polarized 
is much simpler mechanically, and they are easy to elevate that way.  The ground gain 
drops about 3 dB when you are aimed at the horizon (for Es or F2).  When you are 
elevated, it shouldn't make much difference at all, since the polarity changes on EME 
due to Faraday rotation anyway.

I worked NL7Z a number of times when he had his vertically polarized yagis:

http://www.bigskyspaces.com/w7gj/NL7Z.jpg

VY 73, Lance

On 1/29/2011 6:46 PM, John Geiger wrote:
> If you were mainly interested in EME, would a side by side stack on 2 vertically
> polarized yagis reduce the ground gain much? It would make the mechanical issues much
> easier.
>
> 73s John AA5JG
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lance Collister" <w7gj at q.com>
> To: "Carl" <km1h at jeremy.mv.com>
> Cc: "Magic Band EME Operators" <MagicEME at googlegroups.com>; "50mhz"
> <50mhz at mailman.qth.net>; "James M. Galm, W8WTS" <jim at w8wts.com>; "Bill VanAlstyne
> W5WVO" <w5wvo at cybermesa.net>
> Sent: Saturday, January 29, 2011 5:38 PM
> Subject: Re: [50mhz] New DXCC activated on 6m!
>
>
>> Hello Carl, Bill, et al,
>>
>> There is no question that side by side stacking can be done and it certainly makes
>> elevation easier. And if the yagis are horizontally polarized, there should be
>> optimum ground gain. Typically, a 7 element yagi 20' above the ground would have
>> ground gain lobes around 7 and 15 degrees elevation when aimed at the horizon...
>> and when elevated, local noise goes down rapidly.
>>
>> Of course, stacking horizontally polarized antennas side by side introduces
>> mechanical challenges since the cross boom needs to be non-conducting on the end
>> sections, and the coaxial phasing lines need to drop down from the yagis at right
>> angles rather than be dressed along the cross boom. However, G3WOS has shown with
>> his new side-by-side horizontal array what success can be had with elevation.
>> Detailed information of the construction and operation of his new array is here:
>>
>> http://www.gare.co.uk/6m_antenna/
>>
>> There are a number of exciting new DXCC coming on 6m in the coming months that
>> will only be workable on 6m EME, which is why more and more people are gearing up
>> now ;-)
>>
>> GL and VY 73, Lance
>>
>> On 1/29/2011 5:14 PM, Carl wrote:
>>> Why not a side by side long boom array at 10-20' above ground? Elevation pattern
>>> is raised but I wonder at what point you lose the ground gain?
>>>
>>> Ive heard EME at the horizon with my 35' 8el which is at 60' with a hilltop 2-3
>>> degree negative horizon in most directions. Havent had any interest in working any
>>> yet it but might have to consider if its the only way to get a new country.
>>>
>>> Carl
>>> KM1H
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill VanAlstyne W5WVO" <w5wvo at cybermesa.net>
>>> To: <doc at kd4e.com>; <w7gj at q.com>
>>> Cc: "James M. Galm, W8WTS" <jim at w8wts.com>; "50mhz" <50mhz at mailman.qth.net>
>>> Sent: Friday, January 28, 2011 10:56 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [50mhz] New DXCC activated on 6m!
>>>
>>>
>>>> The primary barrier to 6m EME is man-made noise. While it is possible for a
>>>> decent horizon-only station with QRO to make the occasional contact with EME
>>>> super-stations on 6m, elevating the antenna 20 degrees or more above the
>>>> horizon can drop your noise floor by 10 dB or more -- and that changes
>>>> everything.
>>>>
>>>> I run a kW+ to 5-over-5 on 6m, and I have been successful in making only
>>>> three EME contacts on this band, all with bona fide multi-kilowatt
>>>> super-stations in EU. All other 6m EME attempts have failed due to my
>>>> inability to even see a signal from most stations, let alone decode it --
>>>> all while receiving (by Internet) reports of loudspeaker copy on my
>>>> transmitted signal. Bottom line, it's all about noise.
>>>>
>>>> I haven't done it yet, as my ham radio priorities lie elsewhere, but if I
>>>> was going to get serious about 6m EME, the first thing I would do is put up
>>>> an elevation rotator system!
>>>>
>>>> Bill W5WVO
>>>> DM65qh
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message----- From: doc at kd4e.com
>>>> Sent: Friday, January 28, 2011 01:38
>>>> To: w7gj at q.com
>>>> Cc: James M. Galm, W8WTS ; 50mhz
>>>> Subject: Re: [50mhz] New DXCC activated on 6m!
>>>>
>>>> I saw the amp listed for him but not the rig.
>>>>
>>>> OK re. your station - that is good data as to what is necessary for a
>>>> serious EME station - good prop. or weak.
>>>>
>>>> I am trying to learn what Hams are using who are making contacts on
>>>> 6M when 99% of Hams hear nothing but static - the requirements do
>>>> appear the same for borderline EME conditions: an antenna array up
>>>> high, max. legal output, low-loss everything, top-notch rig.
>>>>
>>>> As you say, under good conditions much less is necessary, at least
>>>> on one end of the QSO.
>>>>
>>>> And, as is true of weak-signal and other DX work, knowledge of the
>>>> band, the propagation, and other specific variables matters.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Thanks! & 73, KD4E
>>>> David Colburn http://kd4e.com
>>>> Have an http://ultrafidian.com day
>>>> I don't google I SEARCH! http://ixquick.com
>>>> Shop Freedom-Friendly http://kd4e.com/of.html
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> 50mhz mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/50mhz
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:50mhz at mailman.qth.net
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> 50mhz mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/50mhz
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:50mhz at mailman.qth.net
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Lance Collister, W7GJ (ex: WA3GPL, WA1JXN, WA1JXN/C6A, ZF2OC/ZF8, E51SIX, 3D2LR)
>> P.O. Box 73
>> Frenchtown, MT 59834 USA
>> QTH: DN27UB
>> TEL: (406) 626-5728 URL: http://www.bigskyspaces.com/w7gj
>> LIVE MESSENGER CHAT: w7gj at hotmail.com SKYPE: lancew7gj
>> 2m DXCC #11, 6m DXCC #815
>>
>> Interested in 6m EME? Ask me about subscribing to the Magic Band EME email Google
>> Group!
>> (or click on the link at the bottom of my web page above)
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> 50mhz mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/50mhz
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:50mhz at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>
>
>

-- 
Lance Collister, W7GJ
(ex WA3GPL, WA1JXN, WA1JXN/C6A, ZF2OC/ZF8, E51SIX, 3D2LR)
P.O. Box 73
Frenchtown, MT   59834-0073
USA
TEL: (406) 626-5728
QTH: DN27ub
URL: http://www.bigskyspaces.com/w7gj
Windows Messenger: W7GJ at hotmail.com
Skype: lanceW7GJ
2m DXCC #11/6m DXCC #815

Interested in 6m EME?  Ask me about subscribing to the Magic Band EME
email group, or just fill in the request box at the bottom of my web
page (above)!